Pittsburgh Nesties
lala5507
member
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Our tech team has launched updates to The Nest today. As a result of these updates, members of the Nest Community will need to change their password in order to continue participating in the community. In addition, The Nest community member's avatars will be replaced with generic default avatars. If you wish to revert to your original avatar, you will need to re-upload it via The Nest.
If you have questions about this, please email help@theknot.com.
Thank you.
Note: This only affects The Nest's community members and will not affect members on The Bump or The Knot.
Has your faith every been tested?
I am in such a low place right now. I got word yesterday that a relative lost their baby yesterday; one week before the due date. Perfectly healthy baby got wrapped in the cord. I realize that some times horrible things happen to good people and I've always turned to my faith in God for comfort. But this is not the first tragedy this family has had to go through and that has just rocked my faith. How many times can bad things happen to good people? I have experienced pain and loss in my life and watch horrible things happen in the world but this is the first time in my life that I am thinking, "is there even a God?"
Re: Has your faith every been tested?
Thank you both for your responses. What you both says makes a lot a sense.
On another note. I am not sure what to say to my kids. They don't really know the people very well (maybe see them once a year) but they see me sad and crying. I don't really know what say. I think the death of a baby opens up a lot of questions. Any advice on that front would be greatly appreciated as well.
I should preface this by saying that while I have a good sense of faith and spirituality, I am not the most religous person, if that makes sense. For me personally, I have never looked to God as the one who controls the good things and bad things that happen in my life or in the world. I don't look to God to answer "why did this happen", because I don't believe that there could ever be an explanation for something like the loss of a baby or any other tragic event. I really just turn to my faith/spirituality for comfort or reflection as I go through the grieving process or whatever the difficult time might be that I'm going through.
As for your kids, I think you just have to go with what you're comfortable with and what is most appropriate for your kids - that's going to be different for everyone.
I'm so sorry for the loss.
Jake - 1.15.08
Liam - 5.17.11
As for your kids, how old are they? Have they had any experience with death yet? It's a hard thing to know how much to say. Dd hasn't had much experience with it luckily but last year we had to talk to her about it when my parents dog died. She kind of became obsessed with it and would get really upset about us or her dying. So we had to have lots of discussions about it and I feel bad that she worried so much. But on the other hand I don't want to completely shield her from this stuff.
I think with it being a baby that it might be a very hard discussion to have. Personally with my dd I wouldn't tell her the specifics unless it was unavoidable (ie she knows the mom and knows she was having a baby and will want to know what happened when there isn't a baby).
I'm so sorry for your family!
First when DH's dad died
2 weeks later when my grandmother died
A few months later when DH's brother was diagnosed with cancer
--those three instances so close together were making a valiant effort to crumble our marriage--luckily DH's brother is now fine.
More recently, my aunt was diagnosed with breast cancer and is in the process of 6 months of chemo and 1 month of radiation
My grandmother will be starting dialysis
My cousin was told her baby had Edwards syndrome and if she delivered the baby would only live a week or 2
It's been a lot to take and I've questioned God's goodness more times that I can count.
However, my aunt with cancer was the one to pull it back into perspective for me. She told her husband when she was diagnosed, "I want to beat this, but if I don't, it's because God has a higher plan for me. If he needs me, I do not want you getting mad at God, because I will be waiting for you in heaven."
I would love to get back to my faith, but the reality is that I'm not there yet.
As far as talking to your kids--I'm a crier by nature, so I've had to tell DD why I'm crying a lot. DD isn't a worrier by nature, so I can be pretty honest. In that situation, I would just say, "I heard some news that made me sad." If she pressed further I would say, "so and so was going to have a baby, but the baby went to heaven instead."
Thank you all for your kind and wise words. It's hard to think clearly about things when you are just so mad/sad.
Amyjoy - I am so sorry for everything that is happening in your family. I can't even imagine. But thank you for your insight and for your answer about what to say to the kids. That is the simple answer I was looking for.
Sorry I didn't read this sooner. LaLa, i will be praying for your friend. I can't imagine how hard that must be.
Since you asked, here are some of my theological thoughts, based on my training and my beliefs. These are the things I talk face to face about with people in my church....I hope they come out OK via text. But if anyone has any specific questions or would want to get together to talk about it in person, I'd be up for that! Friend me on FB or email me at dlist at prostream dot net.
Also, I'm not perfect. And I'm not an expert. These are just the things that help get me through.
- Bad things happen. We live in a screwed up world. (Side not...I think I can say that here. I got an anonymous nasty-gram in the offering plate once because I used the phrase "screwed up" as in "messed up" in a sermon or a prayer. True story.) And sin is the cause of all of the bad that goes on - the reason that we don't live in the perfect "Garden of Eden" kind of society that God intended. The whole idea that sin entered into the world came as a result of free choice. We have that choice because God is not a puppeteer, and God wants people to choose to love and to follow...not to be forced to. The effects of sin are seen in our personal relationships, in natural disasters, illnesses, etc.
- God does not delight in bad things happening. I firmly believe that God doesn't enjoy watching us suffer and grieve and struggle. It wasn't God's perfect plan. But, much like we give children choices and then have to live through the consequences with them, God does the same with us. God doesn't make these bad things happen. I believe God knows about them. And we don't know why God doesn't prevent them....but I don't think God allows them in order to take pleasure in seeing us suffer. Nor do I think bad things happen get our attention, or to force us back to faith.
- Bad things aren't direct punishment. I don't subscribe to the idea that you messed up and so you are being directly punished. I don't think that cancers, and losses of babies, and accidents, and hurricanes, are direct punishment for individual sins. (For instance, I don't believe that New Orleans got punished by Katrina because of all of the stuff that goes on there, or that someone's aunt got cancer because they were a terrible person, etc.) I tend to think of the terrible things as just a part of the (sinful) world we live in...random and unpredictable. I have no idea why some people struggle more than other, why some people seem to sail through life and others face heartbreak at every turn. I do know that we all struggle differently, though, and sometimes the struggles are more public than others and we can all see it...and other struggles are much more hidden and private.
- God can handle our questions and complaints. So often I think we focus on the "heroes" of the Bible...we focus on the stories where people are faithful and make the right choices and lead well. But there are TONS of examples of people struggling with their faith. The Psalms are FULL of examples of the writers being at their wits end, feeling like they have been abandoned, wondering where God is, and complaining about the struggles that they face. Even the heroes had moments when they questioned it all...when they messed up so badly they couldn't find their way out...when they felt completely ill-equipped to do what had to be done.
I take that as permission to take those same things to God myself. There have been so many times when I've asked God why...when I've admitted that I don't understand what God was/is doing...I tell God that I HATE the fact that people around me are struggling....and that I'm really mad that things happened the way they did.
I often tell kids "You can talk to God like you're talking to your best friend," and I say it because it is a good reminder to me that I can tell God anything...when I'm scared, when I am confused, when I am hurting, when my heart is breaking for someone else. None of my questions are too much for God. They don't even come as a surprise. I believe that God knows my heart...nothing is hidden. It helps me to know that even when I feel like my faith is shaking, hanging on by a thread (and I have been there), and I wonder where God is and what is going on, God is still there, listening to me and loving me. God doesn't turn away because we get angry or frustrated. It is my hope that by continuing to communicate with God...even when I am communicating struggles, that it will help my faith to remain, and eventually it will help it grow.
- God is with us as we struggle. I think, that through the Holy Spirit, God doesn't abandon us. Even when we don't feel it, even when we are angry, God is right there with us. I think God is saddened by terrible things right along with us, and God is comforting us...through Scripture, through peace in our hearts that can sometimes come, and through others that gather around us in support when we are struggling.
- I don't think we'll ever have an answer to the "Why?'s" There are some things that are just awful. Good things can come out of them (a family comes back together to support each other, a person realizes how strong they can be, etc.), but that doesn't make the bad any less bad. And I think we sometimes do a disservice to people when we say "God has a reason." I'm not sure there always is a reason. And it's OK to simply acknowledge that a situation sucks, without putting a good spin on it. (FYI - I would never say "sucks" from the pulpit. ;-) )
- God defeated sin and death...even though we're living in the "in-between" I believe that one day sin will no longer reign..that bad things won't happen any more, and we will be restored to the perfect creation God intended. It started with the crucifixion/resurrection, and will be finalized some day. In the mean time we live with the effects of sin, trusting that God's grace will prevail. Believing this gives me hope that death and suffering in this world is won't have the final word.
For your kids, I think honesty is the best policy, within reason. It can be as general as "Momma's sad for a friend who is sad." to discussion of a baby who passed away, and the idea that bad things happen sometimes, and we don't always understand. Let them ask questions, and answer them simply and honestly. They will probably spend way less time thinking about it than you do, especially if they are not close to the family....a simple "Momma is sad today" may be enough. I wouldn't shield them from the issues and the sadness, but at the same time I wouldn't expose them to more than they need to know at this point.
These things are hard because, as LuckyStar said, they remind us of our own weakness and mortality, and the randomness with which bad things can occur. And the unfairness with which they occur. I have seen tons of unfair things through the course of my job...sometimes I feel like it turns me into a slightly neurotic worrier. But, again, I try to just keep taking it back to God, praying simple prayers like "God, I'm really afraid/worried. You tell me not to be, but I am. So help me trust You...and trust that whatever comes my way, you'll be with me." That makes me sound super confident in my faith, but I'm not always. I struggle a lot and I often have to pray it over and over...over months, weeks, years. Some days I'm all good, and other days I feel a giant mess. But I have proof of God's faithfulness in the past (from Scripture and my own life) and that makes me sure that God will be faithful in the future...even if I don't always see it right away.
So, that's my really long thought process. I will be praying for all of you who are struggling, and for the loved ones in your lives...that you will know God is near to you, and holding on to you. And, like I said, if anyone has any questions, email me, or we can plan to get together.
Hugs to you all!
Dena for President!
But seriously, I love what Amber said about you, Dena: "I hope Dena stops by because I always get such a feeling of peacefulness when she weighs in on these issues of faith."
It's so true. Thank you for that!
My three sons!
I am currently reading a book about Mother Theresa and her struggles too... She herself was in a black, dark place feeling far from God most of her life... She just plugged on and loved God... Even though she felt abandoned by God. even if you are not catholic, to me it is refreshing to know that God understands it can be hard to not question him.
Sorry so long..not very helpful...but Wishing you the best.
=((
Thank you from the bottom of my heart for all of your responses.
Dena, we are all blessed to have you as part of our internet community. And your answer was not too long. It was exactly what I needed.
There are several support groups that you can tell her about, namely the one that I belong to is Mothers of Angels in the South Hills (Pregnancy Recource Center).
It's not an easy struggle to lose a child and I imagine there are more mothers in this group that have had the same experinece with misscarraige or stillbirth.
Will lift your friend up in prayer.