Money Matters
strickland8052
member
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Our tech team has launched updates to The Nest today. As a result of these updates, members of the Nest Community will need to change their password in order to continue participating in the community. In addition, The Nest community member's avatars will be replaced with generic default avatars. If you wish to revert to your original avatar, you will need to re-upload it via The Nest.
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Note: This only affects The Nest's community members and will not affect members on The Bump or The Knot.
Argument with H over financial advisor - Vent
H lets his fear and lack of confidence completely dictate his money decisions, and it is driving me crazy. I make about $300 a year, just by using cash back credit cards and paying off the statements in full every month. H refuses to consider that, because he is scared he'll go crazy with the credit card. (He is actually very tight with money, and would never do that). His one credit card is with some bank that lives in the stone ages with no online payment system, and he has to drive an hour to pay his CC anytime he uses it (which is basically one or two times a year when someone won't take his debit card). I had finally gotten over the CC thing and decided "whatever.. I'll make my extra cash and let him miss out on his."
Now his fear is driving me crazy in regards to retirement. He has a financial advisor at Wells Fargo, who basically controls his ROTH IRA. H doesn't have any idea what this man is doing with his money.. he just trusts him blindly. I am a big Suze Orman fan, and I honestly believe that financial advisors are a waste of money. I use Fidelity and basically have my Roth invested in the same mutual funds as H, but I chose them myself and don't have to pay some person 3% of the profit. H claims the financial advisor told him he could have $2 million by retirement (that is if he invested the max contribution, which I highly doubt will happen). I then point out that IF he really does make that, then he'll be giving that financial advisor $600,000 since he gets 3%. He is then like "What does $600,000 matter when I'll have $2 million." Um... 1. You aren't going to have $2 million because we have not been making enough money to contribute to the max. 2. $600,000 is like 10 years of our combined income!!!
It is not just his fear that drives me crazy.. it is the fact that he refuses to take the time to learn about money issues. I have had to explain to him 100 times how our mortgage works. Our health insurance offers a $480 health reimbursement account if you just fill out a questionnaire about your weight and what not... he refuses to take 20 minutes out of time because "it is just $480 and I probably won't even need it".
I probably should just calm down, because it could be a lot worse. H is really really good about saving money and not spending friviously. He is just lazy about some things regarding money and gets annoyed with me when I try to plan/figure things out. Just two months ago, he got mad at me because I tried to have a conversation with him about how much life insurance we need! Agh!!! Any advice? Am I overreacting? Because of all this, we basically keep our money completely separate and just split the bills down the middle. Sometimes I feel like we are keeping this too separate and I wish we could work together as a team to figure things out.
Re: Argument with H over financial advisor - Vent
Just as a FYI, 3% of $2,000,000 is only $60,000.. not that it makes the situation any better. Financial differences can tear apart marriages- do your best to continue to talk to your H about money and hopefully over time he'll start to come around. Maybe seeing a counselor would help? There may be more issues (communication, trust, etc) than just finances that you two need to work through. GL!
I highly recommend going through Financial Peace University together or both of you read Total Money Makeover by Dave Ramsey. I don't know Suzie Orman or what she says but I'm a big Dave Ramsey Fan. DH and I read his book and it totally transformed our marriage - the money aspect was a side note. Our communication was pretty bad in general before that. Mismanaged money was just a by product of poor communication.
We disagreed about everything to do with money - everything - we ended up both shifting our views slightly and in some ways drastically and both realizing that we needed to get our money under control. We opened a Joint Account (we had planned it but were putting it off) and we started making a plan for our money. I make the budget because i'm the math nerd and then we discuss it and he gets a vote, he can change things etc. We talk about where we're spending OUR money now. We stick to the budget and anything outside the budget needs to be discussed because the budget needs to be adjusted (we can't just spend more then we are making). Communicating about money taught us how to communicate in general. We applied the same principles to every other area of our life. It took very little thought actually. The idea that we're in this together and we either win together or lose together but no matter what we do it together.
My advice is sit down with him and discuss the idea of going joint and working together. Learn how to communicate. This isn't a time to discuss retirement or credit cars - its just to get you to start working together. Communicate about how you are spending the money that you bring in and agree to look at things as a team (its OUR money - not mine, not yours). Thats the first and most important step. The bigger issues will be easier to agree on when your actually on the same page.
With the retirement account, I do prefer your approach. That said, if he's putting away that's more than many people, and I admire the goal to max out his Roth even if it will be tough (I share that goal!).
I would get my naggy pants to deal with the health survey issue. I mean, come on!
Overall, sounds like you married a man who is a bit on the passive side. That won't change at this point. What can change is your communication. You may need to let go a bit, while he may need to meet you in the middle of some things. It also sounds like separate isn't working for you and you need to go joint. I think that will be a good first step to becoming a team again.
That can be one of the perks of being married. if you feel it's your strength, then maybe you can take over the finances instead of trying to force him to do something he simply isn't comfortable doing.
I'm going to make this comparison - I suck at creativity and artwork. If someone put a canvas in front of me and said "paint! Make your own picture. It's SO much better than buying someone's elses art" - I'd come to a total standstill. I wouldn't know where to start, nor would I WANT to know. I'm NOT INTERESTED in it because I know I'm not good at it.
There are bigger issues here, that's clear. But you need to find a middle ground here. You're concerned about his retirement? O.k., I get it. But who gives a flying fluck if he maximizes every dollar he spends on his CC or not. If you could let some of the truly minor things go and just backed off, it might make him feel less pressured and perhaps more open to talking to you about the important stuff.
I don't agree with the PP who said you need to join your finances. Joint finances are not for every married couple, and some can be very happy and successful while maintaining separate finances. This doesn't mean they are just living as roommates.
The key to ANY financial partnership is communication. Even if you both have drastically different styles, you need to be able to discuss these with each other. My husband sounds similar to yours; he would just as soon automate everything and never have to worry about the bills getting paid, retirement getting funded, etc. for as long as he lives. On the other hand, I work in the banking industry. I'm obsessed with researching every financial decision and maximizing my returns. I actually think its really fun!
You just have to communicate your needs with each other and reach an understanding that you can both be comfortable with.
P.S. I feel you on the credit cards. I maximize the heck out of my Discover card cashback; H uses a Cabela's card that earns points that can only be spent at Cabela's. Doesn't bother me--I use my cashback for whatever I want and he can do whatever he wants with his cards. I know I'm getting the better deal and that's fine with me :-)
I was able to get her to see that the other group that her old job suggested was not what we wanted when they would not discuss with us their strategy for her retirement until we had bought "enough" life insurance. I got tired of going around with them so we didn't transfer.
MW can have and does use her credit card more than I do. I tend to get into trouble if I have a credit card or extra money so I rarely carry even a debit card on me.
We also keep our finances mostly separate because of automatic deposits and payments that we have coming out of our accounts. Each couple has to find their own balance on everything and good communication is the key.