You were right. . .

noffgurl · November 2014

Y'all were right, H and I have many other problems that I didn't realize were as bad as they are. We are going to do the separate accounts with the joint account for mutual bills. Any advice on my personal budgeting? I need to focus on having enough savings for if we decide to split, but along with that I need to reduce my debt or I won't have anywhere to live

. My income is $650-700 every two weeks. My bills are: $350 every two weeks for the joint account, gas I shouldn't need more than $20 a week, food I'm not sure. My debts are: #1 Old electric bill $143, #2 another old electric bill $198, #3 medical $332, #4 credit card $437, #5 old cell phone $629, #6 credit card $756, #7 credit card $1260, #8 credit card $1620, #9 old apartment $1898, #10 school $3026.

short+sassy · November 2014

If you think you may need to move out at some point, I would start an emergency fund for that yesterday. Cut back all spending you can, without paying any bills late. Find a part-time job to earn more, if at all possible.

I noticed the word "old" with a lot of those debts. I'm assuming your credit has already been negatively "hit" by them. If I were you, once your emergency fund is in place, I would start saving a few hundred a month to make offers to your debtors. For example, contact your old landlord and tell him/her that, if they will waive the rest of the debt, you will pay $950 now to have it cleared.

I am a landlady myself and, although fortunately I have never had to evict anyone or had a tenant owe me money, I guarantee you the vast majority of us would dance a jig if an old tenant popped up and said, "Hey, I know I owe you money. I just came into $950 and would like to just give you that lump sum if we can call this debt square." Because they are looking at that debt as sunk anyway.

I'd take the same approach with the two electric bills and the medical bills. Possibly even the credit cards. Those are the kind of debts that will be the most amenable to making a deal.

But the trick to this tactic is you need to have what you are going to offer available at the time you are trying to negotiate. Because basically what you are trading is money NOW for money they may never get if they wait.

Xstatic3333 · November 2014

I'm so sorry about your problems with H. I hope you'll be able to get some help (counseling, together or by yourself) to help you through this time. Take care of yourself.

To clarify, are all of these debts yours exclusively? Will the $350 cover housing, utilities, phone bill, internet, etc.? If you are still living together at this time, I would recommend sharing responsibility for groceries and doing that from the joint account. We can get our groceries to $200 for both of us. We do buy many things organic but also don't buy much meat, so it's probably a wash with how most people eat.

Budging from $650/paycheck, and assuming $100 for food, you'll have around $500 a month left over after gas. If these are really all your bills, I would probably work the Dave Ramsey baby steps in your situation. That would mean step one is to save $1000, and then tackle your debts smallest to largest. If you're really considering moving out, I'd probably save $1000 or first/last/deposit for your area, whichever is larger. Doing it this way will free up your cash flow, especially since many of your debts are on the small side. Some of the ladies around here who have been through his system can probably give you more specific advice. Unless it's an issue of losing food or housing, I do also think you need a token amount of fun or buffer money to avoid going crazy.

More questions: are all of your debts current? What are the minimum payments?

I know there's a lot of non-financial issues wrapped up in this, but I do think that if you and H are going to stay together, doing things this way won't work long-term. It's not fair for you to be working all of these debts while he's out spending on fun. Marriage means teaming up with the other person, debts and all. I'm sorry you're going through this and hope things will get better, one way or another.

noffgurl · November 2014

All of the listed debts are exclusively mine and are 2-6 years old. As far as food goes, that's one of the big issues of contention- we can't do one shopping trip and eat together every night. So, he wants us to fend for ourselves on that point.

hoffse · November 2014

noffgurl said:

All of the listed debts are exclusively mine and are 2-6 years old. As far as food goes, that's one of the big issues of contention- we can't do one shopping trip and eat together every night. So, he wants us to fend for ourselves on that point.

If he's not even willing to share food expenses, then I agree that things are going downhill pretty fast. Food is about as basic as it gets with shared expenses. It shouldn't matter if you eat more of it than he does. You're married.

Re: food costs - H and I lived apart for a couple years while he was finishing law school, so we were keeping two separate kitchens stocked and we would each shop for one most of the time. I averaged probably $40/week without being super strict with myself or going through extreme couponing efforts. Every couple of months I would have a $100 run to Costco to stock up on some essentials. Please note - I paid for my H's groceries while he was in law school because I had a job. We were married, and I saw no reason to borrow more money so he could do something as basic as eat when I had a steady job. Sorry to keep harping on this - it just blows my mind that your H is insisting on that.

I would make saving an emergency fund your #1 priority right now. Keep it in a separate account in your name only so that he can't touch it. Also start working on your personal budget so you can see what sort of flexibility you have and which expenses are really fixed. It's better to know that before you split.

brij2006 · November 2014

AprilH81 said:

noffgurl said:

All of the listed debts are exclusively mine and are 2-6 years old. As far as food goes, that's one of the big issues of contention- we can't do one shopping trip and eat together every night. So, he wants us to fend for ourselves on that point.

Do you guys eat differently? Dietary restrictions/allergies?

Can you work toward eating together more in baby steps? Start out with eating the same meal 3 nights a week and then every month or so add in another night. Eating together (at the same time, the same meal) might also give you guys an opportunity to talk to each other in a non-confrontational manner.

I would really make this a priority and work together on having this come out of the joint account. Mostly for any and all food.

Sorry you are going through this, but it really sounds like all of this is just a trial separation at this point. Not saying that it's good or bad, because I don't know and don't have experience with it. But I really hope it doesn't create more tension and confrontation than it needs to.

brij2006 · November 2014

I'm also going to agree with short+sassy. At this point I would focus on getting your budget down to bare bones, taking on another job, and stock piling a savings in a separate account that does not have your H's name on it. Then if/when the divorce happens, you have a bunch of money to fall back on and use to get out on your own 2 feet. Once you're settled in, then I would put any money left in that account, toward the smallest debt first and work your way up. Otherwise, I would not worry about paying off all of the debts right now. You don't know how much money you're going to need in the near future.

noffgurl · November 2014

The eating issue is he isn't home. So, I can buy things to cook up at home for cheap, but he can't. With him living on the truck, he doesn't have an actual kitchen. If I so much as grab anything from the gas station or fast food or whatever, I get yelled at because I'm the one that wants to save money so bad and I have the capability of eating from home. That just pisses him off because he can't just eat at home, he either has to spend $10 for one fast food meal in a day or try to keep some kind of a camp stove and cooler. That pisses him off because he can't keep meat for longer than a day or so, and if he eats out, we can't afford every freakin meal, so he will literally starve himself. For awhile he started just heating up pastas on the camp stove but now they give him heartburn.

noffgurl · November 2014

With this new job, it looks like he will be gone for 2 weeks and home 2-3 days. He does have access to tons of truck stops but I too think he finds any and every excuse he can against any kind of a budget.

Xstatic3333 · November 2014

noffgurl said:
With this new job, it looks like he will be gone for 2 weeks and home 2-3 days. He does have access to tons of truck stops but I too think he finds any and every excuse he can against any kind of a budget.

I think it's understandable that food prices will end up higher with that sort of job, but yelling at you for an occasional gas station snack (it's hard to avoid those completely!) when he refuses to budget at all is completely inexcusable IMO.

brij2006 · November 2014

I'm such a "tough shit, figure it out" type of person. So in that case of him being a jerk about it, I would probably keep the food thing separated. If he wants to spend $300/month on eating out while out on the road, then go for it. If you want to spend $20/week on eating out and not eat at home, then do so. If things are truly going to be separated then he may quickly learn that he can't eat that way on the road without not having enough funds to do so.

noffgurl · November 2014

There are a lot of inexcusables I have discovered, that I won't get into on here. I just need to come up with a good plan before filing. Thank you ladies.

Xstatic3333 · November 2014

noffgurl said:
There are a lot of inexcusables I have discovered, that I won't get into on here. I just need to come up with a good plan before filing. Thank you ladies.

I didn't realize it had gone that far with my first response. In that case I'm with PPs, just save save save. GL.

brij2006 · November 2014

I'm so sorry to hear that there are other things. Please get into counseling ASAP and see if you can work these things out.

brij2006 · November 2014

^ All of that! Get your ducks in a row and make sure that he isn't going to take on more debt that you could be responsible for since your name was also on the cards or loans.

noffgurl · November 2014

Now I'm really nervous, he just started this job not even a week ago and this is what he sent me in a text just now. I don't know what to say. I used to push him to go to school, I set him up with an at home go at your own pace program he did it for two weeks then came up with every excuse in the book not to do it.

I can't do this profession anymore. I need to just find a regular schedule job where I'm home all the time and I don't have to fuck with traffic or dispatchers. I just can't do it anymore. I'm way to uptight to have shit not go as planned. I'm miserable and hate myself. I think you should find someone who can take care of you better then what I've done over five years. We should have had our own place by now and I've failed there. Should have had two newer vehicles that are reliable and don't fall apart every pay day. I'm not saying anything bad about you. I feel I've failed as a husband

Wulfgar · November 2014

Sounds like he is hitting rock bottom. I am not sure what you can do to help him if he is giving up on himself.

My suggestion, just like others, is to save up money for the split. Since you haven't been really paying on your debts, I would ignore the ones that are close or over 6 years old since after 7 years, most debts are considered too old to collect. For the debts that are 2-3 years old, you can make deals on them after you land somewhere else.

If there is any manufacturing near where you live, your husband might want to try that. I am not sure why he is beating himself up so much though, I have gone through tough patches before but never bad enough to want to give up on my marriage or to a degree, life itself.

blondie42107 · November 2014

noffgurl said:
Now I'm really nervous, he just started this job not even a week ago and this is what he sent me in a text just now. I don't know what to say. I used to push him to go to school, I set him up with an at home go at your own pace program he did it for two weeks then came up with every excuse in the book not to do it.

I can't do this profession anymore. I need to just find a regular schedule job where I'm home all the time and I don't have to fuck with traffic or dispatchers. I just can't do it anymore. I'm way to uptight to have shit not go as planned. I'm miserable and hate myself. I think you should find someone who can take care of you better then what I've done over five years. We should have had our own place by now and I've failed there. Should have had two newer vehicles that are reliable and don't fall apart every pay day. I'm not saying anything bad about you. I feel I've failed as a husband

Only you can decide if you want your marriage to continue. Either way, I would suggest counseling for you. If you want to work on your marriage, I would encourage you and your husband to do marriage counseling. Also if he's feeling that negative about himself, he should consider it for himself also.

vlagrl29 · November 2014

I've been thru the divorce process. I started counseling by myself due to some mental/verbal abuse from H. I moved back with my parents unexpectedly, I had been preparing to move out a little bit at a time and save for a divorce attorney when shit hit the fan and I didn't even have a job at the time. After he realized he couldn't talk me back into moving home again he agreed to counseling. About 6 months later I decided I wanted divorced and found a super affordable attorney because we didn't have kids and only shared 1 house as marital property. It only cost me $600 for an agreeable divorce. I knew if I didn't pay for it he would drag his feet and I was impatient. I did get a job shortly after I had moved out so I had money to pay for it at the time. When I was living with my parents I decided if I could get my car paid off, then I could look into finding a house or apartment to rent. I had a plan, but things took a different route - he ended up passing away before our final court date - long story.

Only you know if you are thru or not with your marriage. Even for me I needed to go thru my own process with a counselor and know I tried everything before i threw in the towel, but when I KNEW I just knew I was done. In the meantime save money in a separate account only in your name. I also agree with an emergency fund and paying off some debts so you will be able to afford to move out if it comes to that. If you have family anywhere close to you, I highly recommend using them as a support system.

Just from some of the things you have shared about him - it doesn't seem like a good marriage.

hoffse · November 2014

I'm sorry you are going through this.

Just to echo pp's - if you think that ending it is inevitable, then go ahead and start getting everything in order. Start researching divorce attorneys in your area. I don't do divorce so I'm not sure of the costs, but you can probably find somebody relatively inexpensive if you don't have too many assets that have to be separated and if you and your H can go through this relatively amicably. If you guys start to fight over it, keep telling yourselves that every time you fight your lawyers can bill you for additional work. I know that when I've done estate work, reminding heirs that fighting = billable work usually calms people down and makes things move more quickly.**

Also, please stick around! This board can be great support if you're trying to get back on your feet and start over.

**This is not legal advice - just practical advice.

brij2006 · November 2014

It really sounds like he is down on himself at this point and his actions are reflecting it. I know it's probably the last thing you want to hear, but remember your vows. "For better and for worse." It means sticking through this with him. It sounds like this may be a rough patch in your relationship. It doesn't help that he's down on himself right now and is feeling like he's let you down. Why not have both of you go to individual counseling and then also marriage counseling together.

He could also listen to the book called "Start" or "Quitter" by Jon Acuff to try and figure out what it is he wants to do with his career.

Here's a link to both of them. He could even do the audio version to listen to while in the truck. They're both on sale for $10 on Dave Ramsey's website.

http://www.daveramsey.com/store/books/quitter/prodquitter.html

http://www.daveramsey.com/store/books/start/prodstart.html

Xstatic3333 · November 2014

It's hard to know what advice to give without knowing the rest of the story and the other issues (not that I'm asking you to share them, of course). Only you can say whether it is worth working on saving the marriage or whether the other problems are unforgiveable. It does sound like he is down and depressed, and also like he is putting a higher value on material goods than financial security, which can look pretty different. I can't imagine that being on the road for days at a time is easy, and I think @Wulfgar's other career suggestions are really good, though I know manufacturing jobs are hard to come by in most areas right now. If you can get him to talk to someone that would help, too.

Whatever you decide, from the MM perspective, saving up all of the money you can can't hurt. It gives you options, whether you use it to strike out on your own to to pay down debt once you've decided to stay.

MommyLiberty5013 · November 2014

OP, from the sound of your husband's text, it seems like a "cry for help" sort of thing. If he is unhappy with himself; however, a change of job isn't going to "fix" the issues. It's not a job problem, it's a person problem. If he feels like a failure as a husband, which he said, then he probably views every other decision he has made as a failure too since those decisions haven't aided him in being the husband/man he wants to be. In his unhappiness with himself, he will attack every other thing or person in his life that reminds him how difficult his life is. I think this is why he gets on your case.

Is his text from his heart reveling his pain and hurt? Or, was the purpose of his text just to test the waters to see if he could end the relationship? What do you SENSE are his intentions?

Bottom line: Do you two love each other? Are you willing to work together and individually?

Either way - staying together or splitting - you two need savings so I agree with everything the PPs have stated regarding your finances.

Erikan73 · November 2014

Without know the other details (like other poster, not asking) all I can say is that given his text and whatever other issues you previously discussed, what does your heart tell you to do. Do you give it a try for a little longer or do you continue with the plans for a divorce & get yourself financially ready for that. Right now, what do you have to lose by getting yourself financially ready for divorce, you'll have some money saved up & some bills from the past resolved. Not bad things to have happen even if you and husband do work things out. We are all here to support you while you go through this difficult time.

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