PSA: True chip+PIN card for foreign travel

hoffse · November 2016

I have discovered that the Target red card is a true chip+PIN card for foreign travel.

I have had the red card for years for use at Target. They recently switched everybody over to a Mastercard and enabled PIN technology after their huge breach last year. I checked the T&Cs before leaving, and there is no foreign transaction fee on the card.

After many failed attempts at trying to get multiple US cards to work in unmanned kiosks in Europe, the Target card is the first one I have ever tried that had no failure rate at all. It worked in kiosks where our fancy/expensive visa travel card failed.

I looked this up online before leaving and could not find a report of anybody who had tried it. Well I have now tried it and can confirm that it works. If you leave the US, take your Target card with you (and remember to call to let them know you are traveling).

brij2006 · November 2016

This is awesome! I'm definitely going take note now that we don't have any credit cards at all. AIl we have are our debit cards from 2 different banks and the Target red debit card. *knocks on wood* We have yet to have any trouble at all traveling with just our debit cards. Even while renting a car. But I usually don't bring my Target card with me knowing I won't use it and it's just another thing that can be stolen. I'll have to make sure I toss it in from now on, just in case.

hoffse · November 2016

Does the red debit card have a PIN on it as well? If so, it just might work. You would have to test it.

I have heard of one or two other cards that are supposedly chip+PIN, but they are through small credit unions that you have join first. It's a PITA for a card that you would otherwise never use.

Xstatic3333 · November 2016

At least for now, I think the Target debit just works in Target stores. Good to know about the CC, though! I have the debit but we could always have H snag the CC just for travel.

brij2006 · November 2016

I'm confused, is there a difference? All of our debit cards, including the red card, have a chip and we have to put in the pin number in order to use it. Now, our debit cards automatically pop up for me to put in the pin number when I use the chip, but I can choose to run it as credit instead and do so 99% of the time.

LillibetteV · November 2016

I'm confused too - I love my Target credit card, but I thought you can only use it at Target?? I've never tried using it elsewhere......

Xstatic3333 · November 2016

brij2006 said:

I'm confused, is there a difference? All of our debit cards, including the red card, have a chip and we have to put in the pin number in order to use it. Now, our debit cards automatically pop up for me to put in the pin number when I use the chip, but I can choose to run it as credit instead and do so 99% of the time.

Mine is like that now too, but it wasn't yet when we were last in Europe. It still worked fine in ATMs, but I couldn't use it to make purchases or for the kiosks at train stations. It will be interesting to give it a try the next time we make it over there, whenever that may be!

I had a pin for my CC, but some places were debit-only (kiosks and grocery stores) so we had to use cash there. Turns out Europe is pretty anti-CC! Apparently at least in the Netherlands they have a little bit of a cultural stigma. Of course the tourist places had no qualms taking them.

brij2006 · November 2016

Xstatic3333 said:

brij2006 said:

I'm confused, is there a difference? All of our debit cards, including the red card, have a chip and we have to put in the pin number in order to use it. Now, our debit cards automatically pop up for me to put in the pin number when I use the chip, but I can choose to run it as credit instead and do so 99% of the time.

Mine is like that now too, but it wasn't yet when we were last in Europe. It still worked fine in ATMs, but I couldn't use it to make purchases or for the kiosks at train stations. It will be interesting to give it a try the next time we make it over there, whenever that may be!

I had a pin for my CC, but some places were debit-only (kiosks and grocery stores) so we had to use cash there. Turns out Europe is pretty anti-CC! Apparently at least in the Netherlands they have a little bit of a cultural stigma. Of course the tourist places had no qualms taking them.

It's so funny to read this. We don't have a single credit card yet travel a lot, stay in hotels, and rent cars. In America this is viewed as such a debacle. That there's no way you can go anywhere without a credit card, rent a car, or stay in a hotel. I was once told I'd never travel internationally because no places will take my debit card. I've actually found the opposite to be true, especially when traveling internationally. I had more issues when trying to use my credit card and traveling than I have with using my debit card. Granted I do have to use the actual pin number when I use it out of the country. I have yet to figure out how to run it as credit instead and sign for the purchase.

LillibetteV · November 2016

brij2006 said:

Xstatic3333 said:

brij2006 said:

I'm confused, is there a difference? All of our debit cards, including the red card, have a chip and we have to put in the pin number in order to use it. Now, our debit cards automatically pop up for me to put in the pin number when I use the chip, but I can choose to run it as credit instead and do so 99% of the time.

Mine is like that now too, but it wasn't yet when we were last in Europe. It still worked fine in ATMs, but I couldn't use it to make purchases or for the kiosks at train stations. It will be interesting to give it a try the next time we make it over there, whenever that may be!

I had a pin for my CC, but some places were debit-only (kiosks and grocery stores) so we had to use cash there. Turns out Europe is pretty anti-CC! Apparently at least in the Netherlands they have a little bit of a cultural stigma. Of course the tourist places had no qualms taking them.

It's so funny to read this. We don't have a single credit card yet travel a lot, stay in hotels, and rent cars. In America this is viewed as such a debacle. That there's no way you can go anywhere without a credit card, rent a car, or stay in a hotel. I was once told I'd never travel internationally because no places will take my debit card. I've actually found the opposite to be true, especially when traveling internationally. I had more issues when trying to use my credit card and traveling than I have with using my debit card. Granted I do have to use the actual pin number when I use it out of the country. I have yet to figure out how to run it as credit instead and sign for the purchase.

Traveling on a debit card would make me nervous! Too many opportunities for thieves to get hold of my number and drain my bank account. One of my husband's card numbers was stolen on our honeymoon (in the US...and we only used that card for restaurants so we know some waiter skimmed it when we paid a bill. Knowing I tipped someone to steal from my still irks me) and it was a pain in the butt to deal with the charges, but at least the money wasn't GONE from our account.

splotch716 · November 2016

Target has a debit card and a credit card. The debit can only be used in Target as it does not have a visa or mastercard logo. However, the credit card was recently converted to a mastercard which makes it so it can be used outside of Target. About 10 years ago it was a Visa, then went to just Target. The debit card transactions are ACH withdrawals, or converted into a check like transaction and can take several days to withdraw the money from the linked account. This is why a check for a valid checking account is needed when applying for the debit.

Target is my second, part-time job, so I will ask around to see if there have been or will be any changes with the debit card.

smerka · November 2016

I have the RedCard credit card and it does have a chip and a pin. But it does not have a MasterCard logo so I'm assuming I can't use it anywhere but Target.

If I didn't have a credit card, I would use a pre-paid credit card instead of my debit card. Hotels have a nasty habit of holding funds in case you wreck the place. They can tie up a lot of money in your checking account before they actually push their charge through.

hoffse · November 2016

Yeah there was never really a reason to use the Target CC outside of Target because you don't get points or anything at other places... but all of their CC's have been converted to a mastercard like @splotch716 said. So if you have their credit card, you can definitely use it at other places.

I decided to give this a try after going to Target right before our trip and having to use the PIN to pay. I have other CC's that supposedly have PIN technology, but those cards never actually default to the PIN when paying. The Target card always does require the PIN.

European cards all have PIN's associated with them, and this is how kiosks authorize you. They can't authorize your signature without a person present, so without a PIN or cash you are SOL and have to stand in line to wait for a customer service rep. I do carry cash in Europe, but I try not to use it at train stations due to pick pocketing.

LillibetteV · November 2016

smerka said:

I have the RedCard credit card and it does have a chip and a pin. But it does not have a MasterCard logo so I'm assuming I can't use it anywhere but Target.

If I didn't have a credit card, I would use a pre-paid credit card instead of my debit card. Hotels have a nasty habit of holding funds in case you wreck the place. They can tie up a lot of money in your checking account before they actually push their charge through.

Same!

brij2006 · November 2016

smerka said:

I have the RedCard credit card and it does have a chip and a pin. But it does not have a MasterCard logo so I'm assuming I can't use it anywhere but Target.

If I didn't have a credit card, I would use a pre-paid credit card instead of my debit card. Hotels have a nasty habit of holding funds in case you wreck the place. They can tie up a lot of money in your checking account before they actually push their charge through.

I have yet to have a hotel do any larger than a $50 hold on my account for using a debit card, and we travel often. We just stayed in the Wisconsin Dells this weekend and they did a $50 hold for our 2 night stay and I logged into my banking this afternoon and it was already debited back to my account.
Hawaii was the same way. A $50 hold in Maui for our 7 night stay and the money was back in our account the Monday after we checked out (checked out on Saturday).
The only one that was a bit different was our 2 night stay in Honolulu. They had a $30/day resort fee and the clerk noticed we were using a debit card. She recommended to just have them charge the full $60 for the 2 days in resort fees and then they won't need to put a hold on the card. She said credit cards they put the hold for the full $60 resort fee but don't charge till the end of the stay. I figured that either way we were going to have to pay the fee, so might as well just pay it and not have the hold. She did say otherwise their hold is $200 on a debit card.

Xstatic3333 · November 2016

brij2006 said:

Xstatic3333 said:

brij2006 said:

I'm confused, is there a difference? All of our debit cards, including the red card, have a chip and we have to put in the pin number in order to use it. Now, our debit cards automatically pop up for me to put in the pin number when I use the chip, but I can choose to run it as credit instead and do so 99% of the time.

Mine is like that now too, but it wasn't yet when we were last in Europe. It still worked fine in ATMs, but I couldn't use it to make purchases or for the kiosks at train stations. It will be interesting to give it a try the next time we make it over there, whenever that may be!

I had a pin for my CC, but some places were debit-only (kiosks and grocery stores) so we had to use cash there. Turns out Europe is pretty anti-CC! Apparently at least in the Netherlands they have a little bit of a cultural stigma. Of course the tourist places had no qualms taking them.

It's so funny to read this. We don't have a single credit card yet travel a lot, stay in hotels, and rent cars. In America this is viewed as such a debacle. That there's no way you can go anywhere without a credit card, rent a car, or stay in a hotel. I was once told I'd never travel internationally because no places will take my debit card. I've actually found the opposite to be true, especially when traveling internationally. I had more issues when trying to use my credit card and traveling than I have with using my debit card. Granted I do have to use the actual pin number when I use it out of the country. I have yet to figure out how to run it as credit instead and sign for the purchase.

I thought it was interesting, too! Someone in a Dutch Duolingo Facebook group I joined explained that, similar to your philosophy, they think of CCs as spending money that they don't really have. We will keep a credit card around to use for certain travel expenses even though we're not using them anymore day-to-day, but I think that for a family like yours that doesn't use them at all travel is definitely still doable as long as there's enough money in the account to cover any holds that occur.

jtmh2012 · November 2016

Xstatic3333 said:

I had a pin for my CC, but some places were debit-only (kiosks and grocery stores) so we had to use cash there. Turns out Europe is pretty anti-CC! Apparently at least in the Netherlands they have a little bit of a cultural stigma. Of course the tourist places had no qualms taking them.

We noticed that too. Fortunately we had some Euros on us. And ditto for the tourist places....

jtmh2012 · November 2016

Xstatic3333 said:\I thought it was interesting, too! Someone in a Dutch Duolingo Facebook group I joined explained that, similar to your philosophy, they think of CCs as spending money that they don't really have. We will keep a credit card around to use for certain travel expenses even though we're not using them anymore day-to-day, but I think that for a family like yours that doesn't use them at all travel is definitely still doable as long as there's enough money in the account to cover any holds that occur.

I think this is the biggest thing. A lot of people don't keep extra funds in the account, so a hold really causes them problems. It also depends on both your bank and the merchant's bank. The cruise lines will let you use a debit card for your onboard account, but they seriously recommend against it due to the holds. Some banks are better than others about clearing them quickly....

brij2006 · November 2016

jtmh2012 said:

Xstatic3333 said:\I thought it was interesting, too! Someone in a Dutch Duolingo Facebook group I joined explained that, similar to your philosophy, they think of CCs as spending money that they don't really have. We will keep a credit card around to use for certain travel expenses even though we're not using them anymore day-to-day, but I think that for a family like yours that doesn't use them at all travel is definitely still doable as long as there's enough money in the account to cover any holds that occur.

I think this is the biggest thing. A lot of people don't keep extra funds in the account, so a hold really causes them problems. It also depends on both your bank and the merchant's bank. The cruise lines will let you use a debit card for your onboard account, but they seriously recommend against it due to the holds. Some banks are better than others about clearing them quickly....

Yes! I think this is where using a debit card for traveling can get people into a sticky situation. I know us MM people aren't the norm, but I always transfer $1k from our savings to have in there as a buffer while traveling. That way if a hotel does do a $200 hold it isn't as big of a deal because the money is sitting there.

short+sassy · November 2016

brij2006 said:

jtmh2012 said:

Xstatic3333 said:\I thought it was interesting, too! Someone in a Dutch Duolingo Facebook group I joined explained that, similar to your philosophy, they think of CCs as spending money that they don't really have. We will keep a credit card around to use for certain travel expenses even though we're not using them anymore day-to-day, but I think that for a family like yours that doesn't use them at all travel is definitely still doable as long as there's enough money in the account to cover any holds that occur.

I think this is the biggest thing. A lot of people don't keep extra funds in the account, so a hold really causes them problems. It also depends on both your bank and the merchant's bank. The cruise lines will let you use a debit card for your onboard account, but they seriously recommend against it due to the holds. Some banks are better than others about clearing them quickly....

Yes! I think this is where using a debit card for traveling can get people into a sticky situation. I know us MM people aren't the norm, but I always transfer $1k from our savings to have in there as a buffer while traveling. That way if a hotel does do a $200 hold it isn't as big of a deal because the money is sitting there.

A couple years ago, one of my coworkers mentioned she was going to get a hotel room in the Downtown/French Quarter area for her 23rd b-day. I get free hotel rooms all the time in that area, that I rarely use, from Harrahs. And if it isn't free, it's heavily discounted. I offered to hook her up with the deal.

She wanted to take advantage of it and asked me to call and set it up. I warned her ahead of time she would need give them a credit or debit card and they would put a $50 hold on it. So I call and, yay!, I can get a free room for her. Only to have her tell me she'll have to have me book it after the next payday because she doesn't have $50 available to hold on her debit. She didn't have a credit card.

Mildly irritated, because why did I just waste my time calling if she wasn't ready. I also warned her that, the closer she got to her date, the less likely it was I could still get a free room. It wasn't until THREE pay periods went by that she finally had enough for the $50 hold. Except now I couldn't get a free room anymore. Now it was $99. Still a great price but, after taxes, $120ish more than what she needed to pay.

I know she didn't make a lot of money, but she was also living with her parents! Anyway, just seemed crazy to me that she wouldn't conserve $50 sooner to have avoided paying over $100 for her hotel room.

LillibetteV · November 2016

@short+sassy sounds like that girl had no business renting a hotel room for her birthday in the first place no matter what the price was!

brij2006 · November 2016

LillibetteV said:

@short+sassy sounds like that girl had no business renting a hotel room for her birthday in the first place no matter what the price was!

FFC? This is exactly how I feel when people start freaking out about hotels putting a hold on a debit card. It's usually well under $200. If you can't afford to be without $200 for a week or 2, then maybe you shouldn't travel?
We used to travel and share a room with a couple. They only had a debit card which was no big deal, but when we went to check in one time they asked if we could use our card because they knew they didn't have enough in their account to cover the hold and the wife got paid the next day so it would be in their account then. We did, but from then on we had them pay us for their half of the room beforehand and we just used our debit card when checking in. It was hard, but I wanted so badly to say that maybe they shouldn't be going on this trip if there isn't $100 in their account.

hoffse · November 2016

I once had a 3,000 euro hold put on my card for a car rental in France.

brij2006 · November 2016

hoffse said:

I once had a 3,000 euro hold put on my card for a car rental in France.

Holy moly! *knocks on wood* I've actually never had a hold put on my card for renting a car. They just want proof of our return flight when using a debit card. Not sure how that secures them, but that's all they've ever needed.

short+sassy · November 2016

@LillibetteV and @brij2006, agreed! In contrast, I got a free hotel room for a friend from CA who was coming out to visit. Since she couldn't be with me on the phone call to hand over her credit card, I just used mine for the hold. But I know she is responsible with money and has a credit card, so it was NBD. When she checked in, she put her card up as the "hold" card and it was released from mine at some point. To be fair, those were credit cards, not debit cards. But still.

She ordered room service a couple times and told me to make sure it didn't accidentally go on my card. And to let her know if it did, she would pay me right back. Nothing like that happened, but it was sweet she was worried about it.

@hoffse, whoa! Now that's a tough hold! I don't rent cars very often but, I remember it being a $250 hold (in the U.S.).

hoffse · November 2016

brij2006 said:

hoffse said:

I once had a 3,000 euro hold put on my card for a car rental in France.

Holy moly! *knocks on wood* I've actually never had a hold put on my card for renting a car. They just want proof of our return flight when using a debit card. Not sure how that secures them, but that's all they've ever needed.

They put a hold that large because we declined the comprehensive insurance. Our CC has primary car rental insurance, but you have to decline the rental company's comprehensive insurance in order to use it. It was not a huge deal, and the car rental company released the hold as soon as they inspected the car, but I don't think really high holds are terribly unusual when renting cars overseas.

In all fairness, people in France kiss bumpers to park. I can't really blame them for wanting to make sure their vehicle is covered when a customer declines their insurance.

Most of the hotel holds I get range from $50-$250/night. I have found the holds tend to be higher outside of the US.

brij2006 · November 2016

Maybe that's the difference then. We've always purchased the insurance when renting a car outside the country. Our auto insurance only covers the US and Canada. I also bring a copy of our policy with when we rent in the US since we decline the insurance, just in case they want proof that we have it.

short+sassy · November 2016

That's interesting the difference in car insurance in regards to foreign countries.

Granted, this was a long time ago, but the car insurance I had when I lived in CA was good in both Mexico and Canada BUT only within the first 50 or 100 miles of the border. Something like that. But that was for driving my personal vehicle over the border. Maybe it would have been different if I had rented a car in a foreign country.

Oh! Speaking of holds. I rented furniture back in early Feb. from Rent-A-Center for Air BnB guests I had for Mardi Gras. That place CHARGED my credit card $1,000 for their "security deposit" and then reversed the charge when the furniture was returned. To be more exact, they reversed it three weeks later when I called and complained.

They gave me some song and dance that I had to "request" it back and go back to the store with my card for it to be reversed. I told them, "No thank you. It's faster for me to just put a dispute in with my credit card company." So that was what I did.

Two days after I put in the dispute, that store called me and asked, "Ms. Short+Sassy, we noticed we still have your $1,000 security deposit. Would you like us to reverse that charge?" Oh! Apparently now they can reverse it over the phone (rolling eyes). And so bizarre they even called and asked me that. As if there would be anything else I would I want them to do with it.

PSA: True chip+PIN card for foreign travel

Re: PSA: True chip+PIN card for foreign travel

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