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Our tech team has launched updates to The Nest today. As a result of these updates, members of the Nest Community will need to change their password in order to continue participating in the community. In addition, The Nest community member's avatars will be replaced with generic default avatars. If you wish to revert to your original avatar, you will need to re-upload it via The Nest.
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Unpopular Opinion Thursday
Whatcha got, ladies?
I think Ersland (the pharmacist who shot and killed that kid) should do some time for what he did. It's one thing to protect yourself. It's quite another to empty a clip of a gun into a downed kid's chest. I recently learned some things about that kid...got in with the wrong crowd at the wrong time. He really was a nice kid before they got their hands on him. A student of mine was a friend of his.
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Re: Unpopular Opinion Thursday
I go back and forth on this one.
On one hand, I think that no one really knows what they'd do until they're in the situation. Who's to say that I wouldn't, scared shitless and just been shot at, keep firing regardless of what just happened? I think fear does a lot to stimulate a reaction...I highly doubt he had time to say "okay, this kid is down already, but he was robbing me and had a gun on him, and he shot at me, and maybe he's dead but this fvcker is gonna get it anyway, so here we go." It all happened so quickly on the tape. There couldn't have been much thought going on there--other than fear.
On the other hand...he had to look at that kid and know he was just a kid. He had him down, the job was done...he could have even held him at gunpoint until the police arrived. There's so much that he could have refrained from doing--but who knows if I would've done the same thing or something completely different.
Ya, I don't really feel sorry for that kid. Not at all. A "nice" kid does not rob a business, threaten the business owner and his employees and customers with their lives. At 14 a person knows the difference between right and wrong and he knew what he did was wrong. In Oklahoma, we have a right to protect our property. I am not sure how I would have acted in that situation if I were the pharmacist but I guarantee you, the kid wouldn't be alive. I think its naive to have never been in that position and to judge the pharmacist. I can't even imagine what that was like.
Regardless of a person's age, people need to be accountable for their actions. The case, at this point, is so completely screwed up, but in the end, he will be acquitted.
People who work a job that requires a lot of work and are then either a) completely lazy and don't do any of it or b) get a bad attitude when they are asked to do part of their job tick me off. Go get a job somewhere that requires little to no work. This comes from *some* of the CNAs I work with. There are several that work their butts off day in and day out and I appreciate so much what they do...then there are a few that ruin it for the rest of them because they get so ticked off for the smallest things.
To me, the pharmacist should be punished. I'm sorry but who seriously goes back and shoots the criminal over and over? Really? There was a video of this all and you see the pharmacist walk off and come back to empty the gun, with the boy laying on the ground???
I don't think it matter if the boy was a good kid before or not, because honestly in that situation you don't wonder that. There are consequences. I just think the real issue here is did the pharmacist go too far! Which I believe he did.
It is one thing to shoot the criminal down so you can get help, call police, save your own life...but it is completely different when after you shoot them down you go back to ensure they are dead.
I agree with this. I have seen the video a couple of times and I understand adrenaline pumping and sometimes things happen because of that but that does not excuse him from doing what he did.
But he shoots him and then leaves and comes back and shoots him again. It just seems like he had time to think about what he was doing. I think this is just a bad situation all around. For everyone.
I can honestly say I've never known anyone to be perfectly fine, who then fell into the wrong crowd and then proceeded to rob a pharmacy. I probably sound cold-hearted, but I don't really care if someone is nice or not if they decide robbing places is the way to go.
I do think that the guy behind the counter was wrong to empty the gun out on the kid, definitely, and I do think he's got to have some issues. But that's all that I fault him for.
I understand what you mean, but even if he's a good kid who fell into the wrong crowd he still had to know that robbing a place was wrong and know that there are risks and consequences for doing it (not saying being shot is a consequence, but it is a risk he took).
I'm not sure what I think about what should happen to the pharmacist, but watching the video does disturb me since he left and came back and continued to shoot.
Kaylee & Cole 06.14.08
8/6/11 First 5k! OG&E Expo Run 34:47
9/3/11 Brookhaven Run 5k 34:18
9/17/11 Healthy Sooners Fun Run 5k 33:38
10/15/11 Susan G. Komen Race for the Cure 33:31
10/29/11 Monster Dash 5k 32:06 PR!
11/11/11 Veteran's Day Run 11k in Dallas 1:13:15 Instant PR!
1/28/12 Texas Half Marathon 2:38:03 Instant PR!
3/25/12 Earlywine Dash
This, exactly. Well said, kayleeb!
You say smart things. I had a friend who ended up getting involved with the wrong people. He was with people when they robbed a store with a gun. I saw him at a wedding recently and talked to him. He is doing really well. Really cleaned himself up and knows owns his own business.
I have a major problem that he went back and shot him some more. That is really messed up, even if you were caught up in the moment. From an ethical standpoint, I believe that he went over the top. You have a right to defend yourself but that does not mean you have a right to kill someone. I felt uncomfortable when he described it as 'unloading on him' and 'nailed him.' Not to factor in his changing stories that he fabricated because he knew it was wrong to go back to shoot him more. He almost seemed to forget he installed a camera in the store.
While gangs may be a problem, that doesn't mean citizens should become the courts and decide people's fates.
I think if the races were switched, the public reaction would be different. Black business owner 'unloads' on a white teen who lives in a nice upper middle class neighborhood, goes to church, but got involved in the wrong crowd.
I do think the pharmacist should see *some* punishment. I agree with the statements about the kid. Nice kid in wrong crowd or not, he should know right vs wrong. I realize that young people have trouble with willpower and self support these days in hard situations. But robbing someone at gunpoint is really, really dumb.
Having said that... so is being a business owner that brutalized a child, and yes, I believe that person should've still been considered a child. If you can't stand up for yourself enough to not rob pharmacies at gunpoint, you qualify as a child in my book.
I think he was right in the sense that he was protecting his life and property, and the lives of the people in his place of business. However, I don't think the second trip to "unload" was called for. Now mind you, I was taught to shoot a gun for my protection. I was also taught that when you shoot for your protection, you empty the clip. But I was taught to empty the clip in one trip... not repeated trips. So yes, I think he should do some jail time, and have his right to own firearms revoked.
But I also think that releasing the kid from blame on the "wrong crowd" plea is wrong too. I know many people who have been and still are "in" with the wrong crowd. I know a few who fell in with the wrong crowd and managed to get themselves out, and also a few who probably should have fallen into the wrong crowd and somehow missed the mark. So, while I think paying for it with his life is quite a steep price, he had punishment coming too.
What do you mean that's the wrong side? Tastes great to me!
Let me clarify--in no way do I think the kid was in the right by robbing the place. I don't think he didn't know right from wrong; he would have to be pretty much pathological to not know, but that instead of was acting under peer pressure. Certainly, someone who can (try to) rob a place at gunpoint should do some time. But, it should have been the court's decision what punishment he received, not the owner. Shoot to defend, not shoot to kill.
The kid might have gone to jail and eventually become a productive citizen. It does happen. But, we'll never know because of some cavalier "cowboy" who took it upon himself to dispense justice instead of the justice system.
Oh, to clarifiy, I don't think anyone is trying to make the boy innocent because he was a 'nice kid' who got in the wrong crowd. To take someone's life is a pretty serious matter, and I am sure the boy had a lot of friends and family who loved him very much. Some people seem to think he had what was coming to him and it was justified to kill him because of an undetermined future that is based on stereotypes.
When it comes down to it, did the pharmacist have to go back a second time, get a different gun, and unload in him to defend himself? You do not have the right to kill someone; you have the right to defend youself. The process of defending yourself may result in you killing someone else. That should be unintended.
He turned his back on the boy to get the second gun. If he felt threatened by the boy enough to shoot him more, why would he do that. This wasn't self-defense, but a deliberate murder. It wasn't like he came back to the store and saw the boy crawling for a gun.
Regardless, this man should not ever touch a gun again.
This is Oklahoma...
I don't think it was justified to kill the boy, but I think the boy should have known that getting shot was a risk he was taking when he agreed/decided to rob the store. I think it is very sad the boy died and I would much rather him learn his lesson and (hopefully) he would've turned his life around. But he took the risk...
Kaylee & Cole 06.14.08
8/6/11 First 5k! OG&E Expo Run 34:47
9/3/11 Brookhaven Run 5k 34:18
9/17/11 Healthy Sooners Fun Run 5k 33:38
10/15/11 Susan G. Komen Race for the Cure 33:31
10/29/11 Monster Dash 5k 32:06 PR!
11/11/11 Veteran's Day Run 11k in Dallas 1:13:15 Instant PR!
1/28/12 Texas Half Marathon 2:38:03 Instant PR!
3/25/12 Earlywine Dash
If you go into a person's business wearing a mask and threatening that business owner and his customers with a gun you run the risk of the business owner (or his customers) protecting themselves and getting hurt. This is Oklahoma.
Clearly, none of us have ever been in a catastrophic event. Have you ever been in a car wreck? I was in a serious accident years ago - I do not remember how I got out of the car, what happened after the accident (I remember being totally confused when my dad showed up because I had no recollection of calling him), do not recall the police and ambulance showing up and even several hours later after waking up in the hospital (totally confused as to why I was there) my adreneline was still pumping like a mo fo. If I multiply those feelings by about one million I might have some idea as to how that pharmacist felt. Its easy to watch that video and judge him but.....I can't imagine how he felt and I hope I NEVER know how that feels.