Family Matters
Dear Community,
Our tech team has launched updates to The Nest today. As a result of these updates, members of the Nest Community will need to change their password in order to continue participating in the community. In addition, The Nest community member's avatars will be replaced with generic default avatars. If you wish to revert to your original avatar, you will need to re-upload it via The Nest.
If you have questions about this, please email help@theknot.com.
Thank you.
Note: This only affects The Nest's community members and will not affect members on The Bump or The Knot.
Our tech team has launched updates to The Nest today. As a result of these updates, members of the Nest Community will need to change their password in order to continue participating in the community. In addition, The Nest community member's avatars will be replaced with generic default avatars. If you wish to revert to your original avatar, you will need to re-upload it via The Nest.
If you have questions about this, please email help@theknot.com.
Thank you.
Note: This only affects The Nest's community members and will not affect members on The Bump or The Knot.
Grammar Police
Nearly every post I read in this forum begins with a ritual hazing regarding spelling, grammar, and punctuation. Yes, it is annoying when people post run-on sentences. Yes, bad spelling and poor grammar make a post more difficult to read. No, your snide contributions to the OP's education are not going to change their posting style.
I'm guessing that the entire point of this exercise is to chase people with less-than-stellar english away from the board?
In the future, perhaps some of you could endeavor to be less ethnocentric and realize that not everyone experiences the kind of privilege that you do.
Re: Grammar Police
I don't think I have ever posted on the family matters board but I often read the posts. Honestly, of the posts that I have seen recieve comments about grammar, they were pretty unreadable. If it's full of run on sentences, poor spelling, or bad punctuation, I just can't make sense of it. If someone wants to be treated like an adult and get adult answers then they should learn how to communicate like an adult.
I'm not sure you got my point.
The constant (and it is - just look at the first page of posts) remarks about grammar and spelling serve to alienate a few specific types of people: people whose education left much to be desired (often people of lower socioeconomic backgrounds), and those for whom english is a second language - which in this country, is generally also those with lower socioeconomic status.
It's not "adult" you want people to act, it's educated. In the circumstances listed above, you are deliberately excluding poor people and those of different ethnicities. Hence, my call to practice less ethnocentrism. And classism.
Basically, just understand that not everyone has the access to decent education (and the imperative to utilize it) that many of you did. Berating those people is really just kind of an *** move in my opinion. But carry on. Seems like most of you will, regardless.
First of all, you clearly haven't been on here enough to see the frequent posters using text speak. That's not an ethnocentric thing. It's directly related to maturity. No sympathy there.
Secondly, did it occur to you that a good chunk of the people who use poor grammar/spelling on these boards are trolls? That's usually one of the giveaways. Again, no sympathy.
Thirdly, there's a spell check funtion on the toolbar. If there's a function designed to help you and you choose not to use it, then that's on you.
And, really, the moral police posts do absolutely nothing. If you don't like it, don't come onto the boards. You certainly aren't going to change anybody.
I do agree people on these boards seem to try an alienate people who have grammar issues. I also think it is a valid point to remember that not everyone has had all of the same opportunities when it comes to education.
However there are some pretty horrible posts that are very hard to read. The responses could be a little nicer, but I don't think that is going to happen.
I don't see that many complaints unless the situation is so bad it's nearly incomprehensible. And see, that's the point. if you can't comprehend a post, there's no way on earth you'll be able to give useful, helpful advice to the poster.
Maybe people don't say it in the "nicest" way, but I get that -- you try reading five or ten or fifteen unclear, horribly written posts and see how you react. I get the jitters just by seeing my sister text "u" instead of "you" (I passionately hate netspeak), imagine how hard it is to read, and to fully comprehend, a post that's riddled with shortened/extra long sentences, comma Yahtzee, horrible misspellings (to the point that you're not sure what the word was supposed to be) and unclear statements.
This is why every newbie is encouraged to lurk before posting. Look at what people expect on this board, what you should be posting if you want to get a decent, well thought out answer, and emulate that style. Trust me, that will never serve you wrong (and this is true for real life as well as "net-life.")
I went to an inner city highschool. Most of my classmates were from lower socioeconomic backgrounds. Has my grammar suffered? Granted some people don't see the importance of education but, if you can't embrace the public education you have been given and use it, in my opinion, our government is wasting its money on you. YOU choose your future, the school you attended doesn't. YOU choose whether you put in the effort or not.
My mother is a teacher at another school in that same area. For those of you that think it is the quality of education they are recieving is poor, you can't teach a child that refuses to learn. For those of you that think the books are old, grammar hasn't changed since the 1970s. I have no sympathy for people that think it is okay to communicate poorly. You were given the opportunity to learn. You didn't use it. That is why you are being treated like a moron.
You just can't give advice in response to an incomprehensible post. Is everyone as polite as they could be when pointing out spelling/grammar errors? Of course not, but this isn't the Fluffy Kitties and Rainbows message board. This is why lurking is always a good idea. And, if you're asking someone else for advice, it's your obligation to express your situation in the most coherent way you can. I'm not asking for it to be perfect; I'm asking for it to be readable. (I'm a copy editor by trade, FYI, and my standards of "readable" are pretty darn low.) And, frankly, if English is not a poster's first language and they can communicate significantly better in their first language, wouldn't they be better served finding a message board in their native tongue? Because, again, if people who would like to respond can't understand what OPs are saying, how are they going to respond in a meaningful way?
And, if you don't like what you read here, by all means, move on.
Ethnocentric?
You mean to say that certain ethnic groups spell better/worse than others? Or that certain ethnic groups can afford laptops, but not fancy ones with Spell Check or Grammar Check?
Last time I checked library cards are free. Simply reading books of Harry-Potter caliber or greater would astronomically improve one's chances at proper grammar, spelling, etc.
I know a few of my own nieces/nephews who go to excellent schools and do their homework, and yet they still can't manage to formulate a correct sentence in written communication. These are kids about to enter the workforce in a few years, and their own lack of interest in their education is going to create obstacles for them.
Point being - if you aren't interested enough in your education to work on it and practice it - yes, even on an internet message board - you are not helping yourself in other more important areas with direct impact upon your success in life. For some it IS about lack of privilege or opportunity, for others it is just being downright lazy.
OP, I have a question... are you also saying that a lot of people on here are racist? Ethnocentrism - . the belief in the inherent superiority of one's own ethnic group or culture.
Education level, or issues with punctuation/grammar are not an issue of one's ethnicity. I do enjoy the fact that you are trying to throw out "big" words, that sound more intelligent, just make sure you check the definitions first. Thanks.
Sometimes we need Grammar Police:
I helped my Uncle Jack off a horse.
I helped my uncle jack off a horse.
Dear John not getting any better come home soon Maggy
Dear John. Not getting any. Better come home soon. Maggy.
Woman: without her, man is nothing.
Woman, without her man, is nothing.
Enh, I think the spelling and grammar snark is eye roll worthy as well. It usually feels like people just wanting to snark without having the creativity to back it up. Creative snark is funny, grammar snark just make you look dull.
That said, posts like yours make my cringe. You know these never work, right? Right?
But the ferocious attempt by some to defend grammar snark is hilarious, but not in a good way for said posters.
geez... really, OP?
You think we should just suffer through reading horrible grammar and not say anything? How does that help anyone? Should we just allow the newspapers and all the books to be published and overlook grammar/spelling mistakes because the writers may not have had the benefit of a "quality" education? Reaaaaaaaaaally?
The main medium this forum uses is WORDS. If you can't use WORDS properly, then you should probably work on it. Spelling, grammar, and simple math are things everyone needs to function on a daily basis. No excuses. Better yourself. The end.
The grammar mistake I see most often is your used for you're. I think it's misused so often now that people really just don't know the difference.
Also if someone doesn't speak/write English well they usually state that in the beginning and the mistakes are totally different from someone using text language/just writing terribly.
Let's eat Grandpa!
Let's eat, Grandpa!
Proper grammar can save lives.
Last updated 4/06/11
The entire original post has angered me to no end.
I have to agree with you... the grammar snark is pretty cruel and inappropriate.
That being said, there are some pretty unreadable posts on here sometimes.
I think politely asking the OP to separate their text into paragraphs or use more periods would go a long way.
The snark is just unneccessary and kinda cruel, IMO, especially because most of it is directed at new posters who don't really know what they're getting into.
I was driven away from the Knot boards because of all the incredible snark (much, much worse than on here). Nobody was particularly mean to me, but the way they hazed out newbies was scary sometimes. I was stressing out so much about my wedding... then I stopped reading Knot boards and all the stress went away.
Overall, the ladies on the Nest are pretty nice, but yes, the grammar police do seem kinda ridiculous to me.
HA! Thanks for making me laugh for the first time today! This Monday was a rough one.
Actually, I've noticed that if the post is comprehensible, most of the folks replying don't have anything to say about spelling or grammar. It's when the OP requires several readings to understand that people start to get annoyed.
Some PP pointed out that it's usually pretty obvious when English is not the poster's first language; the mistakes tend to be different than someone who's just generally quasi-literate. I agree with this wholeheartedly.
(And as far as not everyone having the same access to education...I'm not sure what countries you're thinking of, but here in the U.S. with our free public education, we teach basic sentence structure in the third grade.)
And I call BS on the "this is just a board" (or as one poster incorrectly claimed, "a blog") and proper grammar isn't important here. No matter what you try to claim, one does not go from being unable to use proper sentence structure, not understanding the correct use of I/me/myself (not to mention using them in compounds), and failing to use correct tenses to being able to use proper grammar when it is needed. It just doesn't happen. True mistakes, word usage slips, and mistyped errors do happen to everyone, but if an entire post is at a second grade writing level, I will respond as though the poster is a second grader and correct them--that is the only way people are going to learn.
I am an elementary school teacher and I have to admit that seeing extremely poor spelling, punctuation, and grammar just makes me cringe. What bothers me the most is when people misuse the words to, two, and too. Other quirks of mine are than and then, and when people add "..." to the end of each sentence. Sometimes I want to post respective grammar rules in a comment underneath posts with incorrect grammar.
Oh dear. No. I'm not sure how you came to this conclusion, but my guess is that your fingers did the thinking. See, people like you enjoy hazing others for spelling and grammar difficulties. I enjoy pointing out the major logic failures of those who profess to be informed and fully capable in the cognitive sense.