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FMIL is not invited to our wedding - am I wrong?
Sorry for the wedding question, but this is more of a family issue than a wedding issue.
My fianc? and I are getting married this July in a small wedding (65 people). We are not inviting my fianc??s mother. She has hated me from the first time she even heard that I was dating my fianc?, and has never once been civil to me. She either ignores me or calls me degrading names. After the last incident (a year ago), my fianc? told her that we will not attend any family events where she will be present, and that she is not invited to our wedding unless she apologizes for her behavior. I haven?t seen her or talked to her in about a year; my fianc? has briefly talked to her on the phone and ran into her while he was meeting his dad once.
A few days ago, my fianc??s dad (who has been invited) called and offered to pay for the wedding if we invite her. When my fianc? told him that the only way we will invite her is if she apologizes, his dad changed his offer to ?I will pay if you consider inviting her.? We have not accepted any money from him, and don?t plan to. He is calling often and saying that we should ?take the high road? and invite her (he talks to my fianc?, and doesn?t call me). His dad will likely not attend if we don?t invite his wife.
I wouldn?t really mind inviting her ? if she calls me a whore at our wedding, she will be the one who has to answer to 65 people who love and respect us ? except for the ultimatum that my fianc? gave her (apologize or no wedding invitation). I feel that if we give in, she will forever think that we don?t follow through with what we say.
My fianc? and I were 100% certain that we would not invite her unless she apologizes, until I spoke with my dad today. He thinks that I am being immature, and that I am setting myself up for problems in the future. He said that I am being unfair to my fianc?, and that I shouldn?t ?draw a line in the sand.? My dad and I are really close, and I respect his opinions, but this is causing me to doubt myself.
Would you invite her? Any suggestions?
Re: FMIL is not invited to our wedding - am I wrong?
I think you FI is right to stick up for you, and I can certainly understand why neither of you want her there.
Etiquette wise, you really can't invite your FIL without inviting your MIL. I think your FI needs to ask himself why FIL is ok with MIL treating you this way. He is obviously condoning this behavior.
And, what is up with your dad? He wants someone at his wedding that would call his daughter a whore? Does he let his mother sh!t all over your mom?
I don't understand your dad's attitude either.
What your FI decides regarding his family is just that, his decision. Your dad doesn't have to like the decision that your FI has made, but he damned sure needs to respect it.
I have been asking myself what is up with my dad, too. The only explanation I can think of is that he had a really terrible relationship with my mom's parents (he and my mom are now divorced). My mom's parents thought he was not good enough for my mom, and my grandma really went out of her way to make sure he knew that. I think that maybe, looking back, he wishes that he had tried to be a "peacemaker" in his relationship with my mom's mom. This is the first time in my life that I can remember him not being completely supportive of me - I was pretty shocked by his comments, and I didn't really ask any questions. I am going to call him tomorrow to follow up.
I know we breached etiquette by inviting FIL without MIL, but that was a choice we made because my fiance was hoping that it would at least mean that his dad would attend the wedding. FIL has said that MIL behaves like this to everyone (partially true - she is hateful, but she hates me more than most people she knows), and that I should get over it. I think that this situation is the first time anyone has refused to accept her behavior, and they don't really know how to react.
If FIL is telling you to get over his wife's behavior, I think your FI should tell him that he isn't welcome in your lives either.
You letting your MIL treat you poorly would not be a peace making situation, it would be a doormat creating situation. It's not up to your dad how you two proceed. I wouldn't bother having any more conversations with him, as his opinion is not supportive.
I don't know if your dad has weird good intentions, is too kindhearted or is just trying to put you in a difficult spot but I say that if you are not comfortable asking her then do not ask her.
He should support you in what you want to do. Why should he put you in a situation you don't care for, are uncomfortable with or one that's a potential powderkeg?
I for one would not ask her. She's toxic as per your description and the apple never falls far from the tree.
I wouldn't invite her either. And I wouldn't give in to make FFIL happy. Why would you want a woman who treats you like sh!it at your wedding? She made her bed, now she can lie in it. If you invite her, you're basically saying that her behavior is okay. If your FFIL prefers to stand by his wife, then he can stay home as well.
It's about time someone stood up to her.
My mom is a lot like your dad. "Family" is everything, even if they don't treat you well. My mom is just very niave and doesn't realize that people can be so horrible like DH's family members could be.
I would stop discussing the invitation with your dad. It may hurt, but you disagree and you don't want his advice. You and your H are making your own decisions about relationships.
DH's stepmom treated DH the same way your fMIL treats you, and yes, she was a b*tch to everyone. DH put up with the bad behavior so he could see his dad. But when stepMIL started treating our kids as less than equal to her bio-grandkids, we drew the line and haven't seen her or FIL since. It was definately the right choice! Trust me, you will NOT miss the drama! And MaryNJoe is right - it's about time someome stood up to your fMIL.
Please stick to your guns and dont let $$$$ change your mind!!!
It iabot time that someone in the family teach mil that her behavior will not be tolerated! Obviously FIL hasnt.
Tell him to stay home as well.
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You are definitely setting yourself up for future problems by not inviting her and drawing the line for the wedding. I personally would rather gamble her looking like a complete nut-case at the wedding (as you said, it's not a reflection on you) than cementing things for future grandchildren to come.
Having said that, I wouldn't want her there either and think that your FI made an entirely reasonable standard: apologize.
I would not tie an apology to a wedding invitation. That's more like saying her "ticket" to "an" event is an apology rather than stating that there is an expectation for on going mutual respect.
Whatever is at the root of the difficulties between your and your FMIL is what you need to address. Look, your FFIL talks with his son and not you on the issue of the wedding - and that is completely reasonable and not a slight. I know it is a big thing for FI/DHs to be the "go-between" between their SO and their mothers, and I think that is a *huge* reason why there are martial issues to begin with. I'm not an ultra-feminist, but I think that strong women are more respected (and not messed with as much) - something happened between you and MIL and you need to address it in a non-emotional, no nonsense way. You command the respect due you, don't sell a wedding invite for an apology - actually address the heart of the issue and get it over with before you slip into one of these women who have to demand their DHs cut off entire family branches over spats (grant it - there are legitimate reasons for estrangement).
Next time your FIL calls and speaks to your FI about the wedding - have him turn down the money, suggest FI ask to speak to the mother, and have him put you on the phone. Don't discuss the wedding, per say, but rather the life style the two of you plan on having beyond the wedding and the repercussions building up by this passive-aggressive/aggressive whatever it is going on. If things can't go well during this phone call, by that I mean civil on both ends, then you stand by your FIs wishes. If they go well, you can ask FI to reconsider if you wish. But after that phone call I wouldn't entertain changing positions again with FIL...when he calls the standard reaction should be "Put Mom on the phone and we'll discuss the issue with her."
I had a similar situation, except it was a little easier to handle than yours.
We did not invite my FIL and his wife/his family because he exhibited the same behaviors as your MIL did. My MIL is awesome and she supported our decision (they're obviously divorced).
My mother was also the exact same as your father, she said I should have invited my FIL. It really hurt me that she would want someone at our wedding that shat all over me and our wedding planning/engagement time. I just ignored her.
As for etiquette, whatever. Invite who you want. If you want your FFIL, invite him. If he won't come without his wife, than that's a decision your FI will have to decide/live with.
Good luck and listen to your heart. (Personally, I don't regret not inviting him at all yet, it's been 1.5 years, I also feel it would have been setting me up to be a doormat - he's not in our life currently.)
Going along with this, I wanted to give you the child's perspective. Growing up I had a horrible stepgma. She called me and my siblings horrible names, and showed a great deal of attention to her biological grandchildren over her step grandchildren. My parents, aunts, uncles and grandfather never did anything about it. We all just put up with her abuse for years all for the sake of family. I rememeber asking my mom one time why we all did that and my mom said that she would have made my grandfather's life miserable if he wanted a relationship with us. So for years we had to put up with her telling us that we were horrible bratty children ( we were not), stupid, fat, ungrateful etc. Yes I grew up thinking that is was ok for people to talk to me like that and what was worse is that I grew up knowing that no one would stop it. It wasn't until I was an adult that I decided to cut her and my grandfather out of my life. I figured he was just as bad as she was for allowing it to happen. I haven't looked back.
A few years ago, I spoke to my mom about the situation with my stepgrandma and my mom said that if she could go back in time she would have cut them both out of our lives a long time ago. Having a relationship with them ( if you could even call it that) was not worth all the heartache they created for our family.
My advice to you is to stick to your guns. You and your fiance will soon be making vows to each other and you want to be surrounded by people who love and support you. Trust me. Her hostility will not end with the wedding. Please don't make the same mistake my parents did and keep these toxic people in your lives and expose them to your future children all for the sake of family.
Wow... I can completely relate to this, but I think your FI is better than my now exFI because he could not and outwardly refused to stand up for me when it came to his family. There were members of his family we both decided we didn't want to invite, a few that he didn't want to invite for stupid reasons, such as them not giving us an engagement gift.... but that's another story.
I know an offer of having his parents pay for part of the wedding was an option and we originally refused all money from them because we knew if we did (or so he said) that they would make us invite these certain people.
You should stick to your guns and your FI should be the one to stand up.. it's his family and feeling that you both share!
You have your DH on your side... run w/ it. Your dad says you're being immature. I think your MIL is being BEYOND immature.
At what point does she get called out on her behavior? Why does it fall on you to be the "bigger person"? Why can't SHE be the bigger person and apologize?
If her son getting married won't make her apologize, giving in at this point will only tell her she can do whatever.she.wants and it.doesn't.matter. She.will.never.be.held.accountable.
It wasn't either of our moms, but I stood my ground w/ my aunt when it came to my wedding. She is someone who I don't like and don't care for and has exhibitied some pretty poor behavior in her life, and we stood firm.
I stand behind what I say. I don't see why you're wedding, one of the biggest days in your life, is where YOU need to give in ..
~Benjamin Franklin
DS dx with celiac disease 5/28/10
Thank you all so much for your thoughtful answers. You have re-affirmined my faith in our decision not to invite her. I truly appreciate the time you took to relate your personal experiences - it helps to know that I'm not the only person dealing with this type of situation!
You are marrying a good man. I applaud him for standing up for you.
Take the high road? Your dad must have lost his mind. Your futureMIL has done nothing but treat you bad from day one. And, setting yourself up for problems in the future? I think that if you just invite her to the wedding, you are basically showing her that you will basically bend over and take it up the butt from now until the end of time.
I keep coming up with things I want to say to this, because there's so much here that I think is just completely ridiculous, but the only encompassing argument I can come up with is this:
No.
It's not being immature to refuse to invite someone to your wedding who will most likely make a scene and will be like a little black raincloud on your day. Why should you even worry about that on one of the most important days of your life? It's not being immature, it's being realistic.
Your FI needs to talk to his dad. His dad says that's just the way she is and you guys should get over it? No, how about she gets over being that way? Or how about he addresses the issue with the main culprit...the woman he's married to.
I think your FIL is a lot of the problem. He takes the path of least resistance. Sounds like he always has. And unfortunately, he sees you and your FI as the path of least resistance. Which is why MIL's behavior has been permitted to continue all these years instead of him standing up to her. Now he's in the unfortunate position of missing his son's wedding because his wife is a shrew. I think now is the golden time for him to realize what his fear of confrontation has cost him, and will continue to cost him in the future.
Absolutely do not back down. Or you'll always be the path of least resistance in the future.
My DH and I went through the exact same thing with my MIL, and it has been peaceful not having her causing problems, although occasionally she still whines and complains to my SIL who then calls and causes problems but she is easily handled. ut understand that this was years of abuse and coming to the realization she would never change which eventually led to us not going around each other anymore.
I think your dad was suggesting that it could come back to bite you if your husband starts to resent you for not inviting his mother. Is there any way that your FIL would take responsibility for your MIL, meaning if she starts ANY kind of drama he takes her and leaves quietly? Good Luck
I can see why many people wouldn't go the route of direct confrontation and would prefer the many layers of go-betweens. I just think that sets up for extra drama when there's already enough drama to go around. I think it is healthier for a wife, even if she's already being supported by her DH (in this case an FI), to speak her mind directly to the individual causing conflict. I don't think proper treatment should be demanded for a day, as in selling an invite to the wedding in exchange for an apology, but rather that her position as wife will demand ongoing respect. You can't get respect by proxy. Father and son talking to one another is fine, but this is a control issue with the mother, and therefore I think the father needs to be removed altogether from the conversation - asking to speak directly to the woman at the center of the fuss is going to put her on the hot plate, and make it clear that she can't hide behind her husband, that the days of getting her way because her husband is accommodating to her rudeness are over, at least as far as the OP is concerned. And, yes, people who are that controlling (speaking here of FMIL) are going to up the anty if there isn't any properly handled confrontation now...she's not going to go back to neutral after the wedding. (My mother is like this FMIL of the OPs, she will stew and plot and come back with something even more disgusting to put upon them.) Where I disagree with the OPs father and FFIL of just having an open invitation, I think that the OP needs to gain the spot of "you will talk to me directly" instead of through the channels that have allowed the FMIL to reign in the past.
So FIL thinks throwing money at you will buy your acceptance of MIL's rude behavior? This must reeaalllly be unsettling for them, since you (and their son) apparently aren't "everyone" and won't sell your principles. Good for your FI for supporting you.
I'm not going to pretend that inviting who you want to the wedding is easy, especially when they are being awful. But just consider this:
Obviously, MIL wants to be there, otherwise, FIL wouldn't be trying so hard. Are you ready to have her, not matter what happens in the future NOT have been a part of the one and only one wedding. Even if she apologizes later... Just consider. This one decision is, unfortunately, not one you can change after the wedding. And she may change her mind after the wedding... and then will have another reason to throw something in your face, feel guilty about, etc. Missing a Christmas with her, you may see her 10 Christmases later, but a wedding is once...
I'm not saying to invite her or not to, but since she is such an immediate member of the family, just make sure you won't regret the decision you make for that one and only day.
If her attitude is already angry at everyone, putting an apology as an ultimatum for this one event may make her indignant even more rather than actually sorry for what she has said. Your husband is awesomely supportive, but if this is his mom, are you both ready to say forever that one of your mothers wasnt there. Just food for thought.
I look back and regret some I invited and some i didn't. Just make sure you can live with yourself after that day and forever.
What she said! It's unfortunate, but you know what if she can't suck it up and apologize for the sake of her son's happiness that just goes to show where her priorities are.. selfish if you ask me