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Can't stand my FIL's...warning, long
FI and I have been together for over a year and a half, engaged for a year. I first met his family about 2 months after we began dating. In the beginning, I could tell his family wasn't what I was used to but it didn't bother me too much, I just ignored what would normally bother me (his father belching at me before he introduced himself, etc). Over the next few months though, his two sisters started engaging in passive aggressive behavior - just little remarks then they both kind of ganged up and told me he lied to me about his ex (the one before me), that she was really important to him (he said she wasn't, they lived in separate states so didn't see other much), that they were together for a year (he said 4 or 5 months), on and on. I ignored them because I knew what they were doing.
When we got engaged, they kicked it into high gear. They started making remarks like "I'm surprised he's with you, he usually likes women with big boobs" (I'm 38DD btw so I just rolled my eyes), or "he usually likes thinner girls", etc. They would make fun of my religion, politics, etc right in front of me knowing how I feel but pretending they didn't know. Then when they "apologized", I just smiled and said "no worries, I've heard much worse before, that's nothing" which really pissed them off (lol).I told him, he would say things like, "oh, they didn't mean it like that" or I "misunderstood". I was getting super frustrated but I knew he was VERY close to his family (almost weirdly so) and he's kind of clueless about how women can work (the women in his family are VERY manipulative and cruel). They constantly put him down and call him stupid, etc which makes me angrier than when they say things about me but I figure he's a big boy and while I defend him, I know ultimately it's up to him how he responds to that.
Fast forward to last fall. His family constantly puts things on FB about religion and politics and usually they're totally offensive to me but I ignore them because I figure, it's their FB and I just stopped looking. No biggie. I made the mistake, however, of posting a CARTOON picture and the next thing I know is I get a text around midnight that night saying "You better get your sh*t in check before you make a HUGE f*cking mistake" from his youngest sister (24). I had NO CLUE what that was about. I asked my FI who was sitting next to me, what the heck? I thought maybe she meant to send it to someone else or something, did not know. So he texts her (I get really bad service where we live and I'm shocked that got through) and asks her what that's about. No response. He calls his parents where she lives and gets his mom. He asks her about it and his mom says "well, she shouldn't have put that on FB". Um...what? She basically rants about how I had no right to post anything they didn't like and his sister was protecting the family. My FI tells her he thinks it sounds like a threat. His mother basically didn't care, that I "deserve" what I get. They hang up, he texts his sister, says you can't threaten my fiance and not expect a response from me. She replies the next morning and from there is a full on text war between them. She sends like 6 texts to his one for the next 2 days calling me things like slut, skank, wh*ore, b*tch, c*nt, on and on, says he needs to get rid of me and get back with his ex (the one they previously told me was a "psycho b*tch"), that if she sees me again and I dare to even open my mouth, I'll regret it, etc etc. His parents back her up on this as does his older sister. We don't go to Thanksgiving and he spends only a few hours at Christmas up there. This is STILL going on.
Every couple months, his youngest sister would launch into an unprovoked attack of me and call me all these names again and lie about me. He changed his phone number about 3 months ago and forbid his parents (whom he gave it to because at that point he was still saying their defense of her was just them trying to keep the family together) from giving it to her. So far I don't think they have or we'd have heard from her.
A couple months ago, his grandpa died and we went to the funeral. VERY uncomfortable. I was obviously not welcome but my FI wanted me there and I went for him. At the visitation, guess who shows up? His ex. His family greets her like she's the long lost daughter and hugs her, cries on her, tells her loudly "thank God you're here!" and more. Next day, she texts my FI telling him she wants him back, they belong together, etc. I was livid. I completely believe they put her up to it. My FI isn't so sure about that but also won't say it's not possible. I get tired of the behavior, his mother glared at me at funeral like she wanted to kill me and had said some things by text, blaming me for this so I sent an email. I told her I didn't believe her when she said she didn't have anything to do with it, that I was not going to put up with being threatened anymore, that my FI never did anything wrong and would not put up with being blamed and if that meant they weren't part of our future we were fine with that. Discussed with FI, who read it, we tweaked it together and sent it. They showed up at our house the next day, Saturday (I was working), IN THE HOUSE. My FI was downstairs doing laundry, he comes upstairs and they're in the living room. The house had been locked. FI was so surprised he didn't toss them out, they stayed for awhile and apparently went on and on about how awful I was. Later, he told them (I heard him) that he shouldn't have let them stay, that was a mistake on his part, he should have thrown them out so he recognized he should not have let them stay at all. He also told them on the phone (on speaker, and yeah, they knew) the next day that they are never to show up like that again. His dad responded with saying it's not just FI's house, FI said, no, it's mine and OP's. They said no, she doesn't have any rights, she doesn't belong there, it's partly our house because we're family. Umm...yeah, okay. FI was in shock. They got into a yelling match on the phone in which he told them to never come again, to stay away, that it is OUR house, they have NO rights, etc. They responded to the conversation by sending a letter saying I'm unworthy of being in their family, I'm a liar, I'm stupid, I'm a schemer who's out to separate their son from his family, on and on. FI responded back with a letter defending me and going off on them. They since wrote an equally stupid email back which we've ignored. It is RIDICULOUS.
FI was incredibly close to his family and for a long time ignored a lot until he finally had to see what they were doing. We went to counseling this spring for this very issue and the counselor told him, this is not normal behaviour and no matter who he dates, they will most likely run them off too and have probably in the past. Since them, FI and I have gotten along a LOT better and FI has had NO direct contact with family at all except for texts when his parents text him whining and blaming me for the whole thing. Considering he used to (and me too) see them almost every week and certainly every holiday, this is huge. I know he's trying and he's given up a lot for me but I don't know if I can handle this crazy family in my life forever and it terrifies me to think of our kids dealing with any of it. Basically...is it too much to ask to ask that he cut off ALL contact (change phone numbers and not give to ANYONE, reject emails, letters, etc) with all members who have participated in this, for good?
Re: Can't stand my FIL's...warning, long
OK, first off, paragraphs are your friend. Geeze that was hard to read.
Second, WHY are you guys, especially your FI still in contact with these people? If my dh EVER let his family get away with sh*t like this I'd have no hard time telling him to choose, me or them. This is all a mess.
Yes, you said he defends you, but if he really respected you, he would have said his peace to them and never texted/e-mailed/called them again when they keep up this crap. The first time should have been the last time.
FET - transferred two embryos (boy and girl) - Nov 2014 - BFP!
If my family members did anything close to what your FI's did, they would have been out of my life. No question, no one and I mean no one talks to my husband / fiance like that. I wouldn't care if they were my parents, siblings, granparents, cousins etc, They would know I would not tolerate that for one minute. I also wouldn't mess with any text, emails, phone calls what have you. I would tell them once and only once " We are done."
And yes, paragraphs are you friend.
I wouldn't have put up with this long enough to get engaged.
There are plenty to truly good men in the world who would not have let this go on for more than year before making a tiny attempt to stop it. I suggest you go look for one them.
If you don't take that advice, change the locks on your house, put up No Trespassing signs and call the cops the next time they break into your house (and trust me, there *will* be a next time).
Basically...is it too much to ask to ask that he cut off ALL contact (change phone numbers and not give to ANYONE, reject emails, letters, etc) with all members who have participated in this, for good?
You shouldn't have to ask him to do this. If he's serious about making you the number one priority in his life, then he should not be dealing with people who mentally/verbally abuse you in any way, shape or form. And that should be his decision, without you prompting or begging him to do so.
If he's still willing to keep up communication with people who treat you this way - especially considering that they also treat HIM like crap - then you will never be number one in his life.
You either need to accept that this is the way it will always be and get used to being treated like shiit (and remember that any kids you bring into this mess will also suffer because of all this), or you need to get out of this mess right now. It's better to get out now than to go through a messy divorce later.
put the wedding on hold then. He needs to prove to you with his actions ( not just words) that you are the top priority in his life and that he won't tolerate anyone trating you badly, especially his fmaily.
Oh and yes, what they did is definitely serious enough for him to cut off all contact with them.
Remember he has to do it now, before you get married, not after.
Oh BTW, I am just curious.
What was the cartoon that your posted on FB about ?
This! Run, run away fast. And try to use paragraphs...I must have been in a really good mood since I actually read that...
They sound like horrible people! I would not, under any circumstances, marry your FI until all this is worked out.
Good luck!
Another vote for postponing until he has completely cut them off.
This really isn't a MIL/SIL problem, this is a FI problem.
Unless he has gone, at minimum, six to twelve months without speaking to them or engaging them in any fashion whatsoever, don't marry into this mess.
He may have made huge strides in dealing with them, but he still has a long way to go. You've gotten sucked into their bizarre antics right along with him. Text wars and email wars and snailmail wars and who knows what-all...that's absolutely absurd behavior for anybody who's not in junior high. You know what they say about wrestling with a pig, right? You both get dirty and the pig enjoys it.
The only appropriate response to their behavior is to walk away/hang up/kick them out. If they have a key to your place, change the locks tomorrow. If they have your fiance's cell number, change it tomorrow. If they have your phone number, change it tomorrow.
And you're dead right that you don't want your children dealing with this. These people will say awful things about you to them and undermine you as a parent in every way possible.
Quite frankly, there are men in the world without horrible family situations. Unless you see some major changes on his part (and until he's undergone some serious therapy to help him sort out why he stood for that treatment for as long as he did), this is a situation that marriage will only make worse.
I'm curious about the cartoon. Was it in any way offensive? Did it put down other religions / political viewpoints / ethnic groups / etc.? Because so often people make the mistake of putting things on facebook and just expecting everyone else to AGREE with them, and getting all huffy when someone else has an opposing view.
As for the family - your FI still does not stand up to them. I'm not sure how people who act like that had a key to your home, but I would change the locks and install a security system - seriously! And your FI has not made "great strides" if he accepts that his family just breaks into his home! He had no problem with it until AFTER you got home. He truly has no b*lls.
I would never allow people, even family, to treat someone I love (or even a platonic friend of mine) like his family has treated you. I hope you don't have a date set. Your FI is not ready for marriage. He still has a LOT of growing up to do emotionally. Counseling may help him to create a "new normal" and set boundries.
Go back an re-edit with paragraphs. I tried to read this thing four times today before I had the sit-down time to devote to it.
I think it is too much to ask, but not too much to expect. You are making it sound as if, while not quite there yet, your FI is making improvements about letting them have less and less face time with him and, hopefully, less and less influence. If he's lived a life time in this type of strong-woman (not meant complimentary) demand/control type thing, you have to give him some time and tools. Since counseling helped last time, I suggest you continue to go with him at this point. My guess is, you'll get what you want *and* you won't ever be able to be twisted in his mind as just another strong-arm woman demanding/controlling his life. You'll be more of the support and partner in this - which I know is what you are/want to be.
Encourage him not to respond to texts, assure him he's not obligated to answer for anything or even to defend the relationship at this point...he is allowed to ignore because together the two of you are all that matters.
Having said that, right now he is not ready to be married. And these folks are *not* your in-laws. Allow him to get stronger and proven in this area before your relationship goes further.
Ditto for both. His family was why I broke off my own engagement.
I know everyone who doesn't know us personally says get out - everyone who does know us says not so fast. We are really good together in pretty much every other way. We "got" each other from the beginning. We've had our rough patches but, other than his family, we've worked through them and we're much stronger for it. The only problem we have now is the family. They raised their kids to be dependent on them. When I met FI, his mom was paying his bills (his money, but she was doing it, he had no idea how much things were, who to pay, didn't even have access to his own checks, etc), buying his groceries, coming over to clean his house...he was basically a child, though he had a B.A., a good job and a farm with a house he'd built himself. His sisters are a lot the same, even though one is married with a child. Needless to say, that didn't last long, especially once we started living together. WE clean our home, WE do our grocery shopping and WE pay our bills and basically are a functioning adult couple. So when I say great strides have been made, believe me, it's amazing. My mom was horrified before and now she likes him and says he's come a long way. She supports me either way (asking him to cut contact or not), but wouldn't do it herself. She says she thinks someday they might come around and that, while for now and for a long time there should be NO contact, she can see why he would not want to say never.
I have not seen anyone in his family since September. They call, he does not answer. Really, the only thing left is texting and emailing. I told him the whole texting and email war was juvenile and we needed to stop participating because it made us as guilty of perpetuating this fiasco as them. However, he says he feels like if he doesn't defend me and our relationship, they will take his silence as acceptance of their lies and he can't stand the idea that they or anyone else would think that he agrees with them. But that's what's driving me nuts. They text, he texts back defending me, etc.and it seems never ending. I think it's kind of like with a child with them - bad attention is better than no attention.
Was the cartoon offensive? To some, I'm sure. I don't allow people on my FB though, who I don't know well and who haven't been forewarned that I'm politically strong minded. What it was (and I'm prepared for the lynching), I read this article online on my break at work. It was about a school that required its students to wear purple shirts that read "gay pride" on them. A couple of students instead wore shirts that said "straight pride" on them and these students were sent home and suspended. That bothered me no end, as I don't see why anyone can't be proud of who THEY are, not be forced to be proud of who OTHER people are. Anyways, I posted a little cartoon of a boy and girl (like the stick figures you see on a bathroom door) and it said straight pride - the same pic the kids had worn on their shirts. I had intended to link the article on my FB but had run out of time on my break and had to put it off. I only have about 20 people on there, didn't figure it'd be a big deal, never occurred to me. I have gay friends on there by the way, and asked them later if it bothered them as I was prepared to apologize and they said they didn't care, they knew me and knew it wasn't hateful or anything. I also meant to link it later, but forgot, which if you know me, is not surprising.
Apparently FI's sister and mom texted him that day and told him to tell me I had "better take it down right now". He was at work, I was at work, he didn't see the huge deal and he told them I have every right to post whatever I want. He has a gay uncle and cousin, neither of whom were on my FB, and apparently since then, his sister has told them I hate gays and I pretty much want all gays dead. Um, no. FI and I both found it ironic that they were upset about the cartoon pic but his cousin, sisters, and other relatives routinely post things about how stupid conservatives and christians are (both of which FI and I are and they know this), how they shouldn't be allowed to breed, how they shouldn't be allowed to vote, on and on, basically we should go off and die. They write HUGE long posts and notes about this almost daily. We ignored it because it's their FB, their opinion and it's annoying (mostly because some of them seem aimed at us and they go out of their way to ask if we read them) but not a big deal. But whoa, they freak out over a picture. They accused me (with this picture) of inciting hatred of gays, of making gay teens kill themselves, of making straight teens kill gay teens, of being a bully and trying to make all the gay people kill themselves, etc, etc. I think it was a slight overreaction but maybe that's just me. Anyways, that's what the picture was but I don't even think the problem was the picture anyways, I think it was an excuse for them to flip out on me.
Okay, I think I got it now. You found yourself a project/renovation BF instead of waiting for the right one and now you aren't happy that your project isn't going as quickly as you wanted.
So you would marry him if he was exactly the same as he was the day you met him? With his Momma doing everything for him and him being happy with that? Because you've spent a good deal of the posts explaining how he's changed since you've been dating. My point was to find someone that doesn't need to change in order to be what you want.
And yes, it IS to much for YOU to ask him to break off all contact. The point is that this is a decision HE needs to make for himself, not as a response to an ultimatum from you. And the point many of us have been trying to make is that since HE was yet to make this choice, after this long, HE doesn't want to make that choice--and very few reasonable people would accept that and stick around.