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Am I a jerk? (long)
For those of you who aren't friends with me on FB, I posted the following yesterday morning:
Might lose my *** if I see any teachers complaining about going back to work after a three month vacation. Just saying.
Last night, I got the following response from the husband of a friend. She's a teacher (and our Realtor):
Yeah, it's a pretty sweet deal to get 7 weeks off. It isn't exactly 3 months but whatever. You should take a 40% cut in salary and try it. It's awesome.
I responded to say that I don't make anywhere near 40% more than the teachers I know, but that I meant no offense by the comment. He came back again with more stuff about how teachers' jobs are hard, low earning potential, etc., etc.
I never suggested teachers' jobs are easy. There are PLENTY of teachers I know that have expressed their excitement about going back to school. But there are a few that every year, without fail, write these Facebook statuses about how tough it is going back to school, when many of us work jobs we dislike, for salaries that might not be any better, and don't get our summers off.
Add to that the fact that we're working with his wife on attempting to buy a home -- which will now be awkward -- and I really feel like he should have kept his mouth shut.
Am I wrong here?
Re: Am I a jerk? (long)
I'm not denying that there was some snark. It was a rainy crappy morning and I was in the mood to complain. But to jump to the suggestion that I was demeaning the entire profession of teaching seems to be a bit extreme.
And again, given the fact that we're working with his wife, I feel like he should have kept it to himself.
I saw the back and forth on this and personally I thought he was way defensive. I took it as you were merely saying you were annoyed about the whole "boo hoo I have to go to work" aspect of it. He got all crazy talking about how hard the job is, what the pay is, etc. These are things you never even mentioned.
I personally agree with you. This year isn't nearly as bad as last year but its annoying when they all complain that summer is over and they have to go back to work. We all have jobs that suck, don't pay enough, are hard...a lot of us don't want to work. We just don't complain about it.
My little nuggets
My little nuggets
I totally agree.
Also, is it really a "pay cut" if you have off? And let's not forget about the time off between Christmas and New Years.
I get super annoyed when teachers complain about having to pay for their own benefits and not getting raises. Hey, I pay for my health insurance, why should I have to pay for yours too?
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#2 10.23.13 EDD
Also, per his other comments, maybe I should go back to school to become a teacher because even the starting salary he mentioned is more than I make and I've been working full time for almost 10 years!
#1 12.11.11
#2 10.23.13 EDD
teachers or those who know teachers- can you please answer a question for me re: pay cut?
i thought that some/most/all teachers had the option of taking a lower salary and being paid 12 months/year or taking the higher salary for 10 months/year. is that not true?
either way, dh works on campaigns and we treat it as 18 months of work followed by 6 months (usually shorter) out of work. this is a known and it is just how we budget. we know how much we need to save for the months following a campaign. don't most teachers do the same? or was this some sort of additional 40% pay cut?
I think he is just assuming that people who work in the private sector are making more than his wife. I don't think he was suggesting that the summer off represents a pay cut. But I could be wrong.
And JenD, I'm with you -- it's more than I make in salary too.
Jess, I don't think you were out of line with your comment. Teachers are so used to defending themselves (it's a pretty thankless job) that maybe some people, like your realtor's husband, took it the wrong way.
I'm glad you said this... it's been driving me nuts!!!!! I get so annoyed when I see these "back to school" posts and although I want to say something, I never do. I have a lot of friends who are teachers and I hear it all the time about how they only get like 4 sick days a year and I want to point out that I get NONE! I am an attorney and work 60-70 hours a week and if I take a day off I have to make up all the hours for vacation or if I am sick! I also only get 2 weeks of vacation a year... and yes I make a good bit more than they do on paper but I also have $160k in student loans and if you take my salary divided by the number of hours I work I'm pretty sure I make less an hour than many of my teaching friends... especially if you subtract my student loans! So the salary argument holds very little water with me. I'm not saying their job isn't hard but come on, I've read that after all the vacations, holidays and summers, they work like 260 days a year (37 weeks) (not including those in admin who work more). That's more than a quarter of the year off!
Sorry but I needed the vent! It's that kind of day for me as well!
ETA: I agree with PP that it is a thankless job and that it is very hard... I by no means meant to imply that I thought it was an easy job, just that there are lots of thankless difficult jobs that don't pay well and don't give many of the perks that teachers get.
This.
And I get the sense that you're not saying "poor teachers have the summer off wah wah" AND "your jobs are so easy/unimportant"
You can respect the work of teachers AND think it's a sweet deal that they get the summer off/wish you didn't see all of the complaints about going back to school.
I have a mom friend who is a teacher and this summer was her first with a baby, so going back to work was especially hard for her. She was dreading it but at the same time said how lucky she was that she could have the time with her babe.
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#2 10.23.13 EDD
#1 12.11.11
#2 10.23.13 EDD
Yes, exactly.
DOWN WITH TEACHERS AND YOUR UNION.
no really i get bitter.
Ditto everyone else.
What burns me up the most is that he's mentioning salaries because somehow he thinks his wife is severely underpaid, but what he doesn't realize is that many people with college educations make much, much less. I'd say $41K as a starting salary is pretty damn good in this economy. I almost commented after that, but refrained. :-P
And um, pensions. HELLO. My MIL retired at 58 and doesn't have to work another day in her life and is living pretty easy. Do I have a pension? Will my husband? Hell no.
AMEN SISTER! Add to a teacher's salary the monthly fee that MOST people pay for health insurance and a decent contribution to a retirement plan and you'd have a nice salary. Not to say that I wouldnt like to give some smarmy business man's bonus to a good teacher or fireman instead, but thats a whole other topic.
My uncle also retired from teaching in the DC area and currently owns 5 houses and is looking for more property just to avoid paying taxes on all the money he has sitting around. It is HIGHLY unlikely that I will EVER be in that position!!
Maybe your realtor/teacher is sensitive and thought the comment was a passive aggressive dig at her so the husband was sticking up for her. I agree it was not the best idea to get into an argument on FB with one of your wife's clients but I'm going to play devil's advocate here. Teachers have a right to vent about their job whether they get more time off a year then others do or not. It's certainly a perk to the job but teachers work just as much (if not more) than most others do because of all the work they take home.
There are also many teachers who take a second job during the summer because they need the extra money. Not all teachers sit at the pool all summer. It does annoy me when people constantly complain about their job, no matter what it is, but a vent here and there really isn't a big deal.
What bothers me is some teachers complain about being unemployed during the summer. You should expect that you're going to have to budget or take a summer job if you're a teacher. I used to work as a bill collector for a credit card company and I can't tell you how many teachers we would have delinquent in the summer and the excuse was always the same...I'm unemployed until Sept. That pissed me off to no end.
Ditto. And every holiday off, and a week at Christmas and Easter? And home by 3:30? Yes!
Every year around June and September I contemplate getting my teaching certification.
Jess, I don't think you were being jerky at all. Before this economy maybe I would have had sympathy, but not anymore. Most people work hard, are underpaid, under appreciated, and have to fight to get any time off. Forget about a pension. I work in the pension industry, it's sad.
by my math they are making more than $1k a week (before taxes) plus the pension .... that's more than a lot of other people!
ETA- per week that they work I mean.
OMG.. this this THIS. I have a lot of respect for teachers and what they do, but it pisses me off when teachers strike because they haven't gotten a raise. Guess what, I've been with my company for over 4 years and haven't received a raise. And I am pretty sure my benefits are WAAAAAY crappier then yours. I have a bunch of out-of-work friends with teaching degrees who would love to have your job. Suck. It. UP.
My SIL is a teacher and complains about this. One time I said to her '..and how long have you worked for this school district? 8 years? How is this a surprise to you every year?"
If I knew I wasn't going to get paid for 7 weeks or whatever (::cough maternity leave cough:::) I would put money aside every paycheck to help cover the bills for that time.
I teach in a private school and we have a 401K, but the school no longer contributes to it...in lieu of giving us a raise. So whatever is in my 401K is what I personally put in there. No pension plan and our benefits suck (and super pricey). Thankfully I am on DH's insurance.
Late to the game...but as your resident teacher I feel compelled to reply.
Jess, I am not FB friends with you, but if I read your post I would detect some snark. BUT I think teachers, in general, are on the defensive about the time off that we get. I try not to say a word about it because even DH makes the "must be nice" comments...and he's completely joking!
Teaching in a private international boarding school, I have even less of a school year than public and most private schools. We work 33 weeks...start up tomorrow and will be finished by Memorial Day weekend, with 10 days off for Thanksgiving, 17 days off at Christmas and another 17 days for spring break (all to give international students enough time to fly home to China or wherever). Wow...it really sounds like a lot after writing it out! That said, because we're a boarding school, our academic day is much longer to make up for the time off. We start at 7:30 and the official academic day ends at 5:00. We get a 20 minute break in the morning and no real lunch break - we are required to supervise our lunch table every day and eat with the boys. We are all required to supervise an after-school activity or sport until at least 5:00 - which counts towards our school day. Then teachers who live in the dorm have to be at dinner, run study hall, and supervise dorm chores...and stay in the hall until lights out. So they work roughly 7:15am to 11:00pm 2 nights a week and every third weekend. I always justify our long vacations with that information - those teachers work long hours multiple days a week, every third weekend and live in an apartment attached to a dorm full of teenage boys. It's certainly not a lifestyle that anyone can do...including me - I live away from campus and considered "day staff" so I don't have anywhere close to the residential responsibilities the dorm parents have.
Obviously I am in a unique situation where I work. And even being a private school, where tuition costs $45,000 a year (that's right!!!), I have a pathetic salary (less than tuition) and get the bare minimum of a raise every year - but at least I got one this year. Even my master's degree meant nothing for a salary increase. And if my husband didn't have the job that he had and the corresponding salary, I would have to quit the job I absolutely love and find something that pays better. So in many ways, I am lucky to be able to do what I do. I am very grateful and will have a very hard time leaving if the time ever came.
Hopefully this doesn't come across snarky or defensive. Every job is hard in it's own way - so this certainly wasn't meant to be all "I work harder than you". I wouldn't trade places with anyone right now. I am so excited to be back in school.