Hopefully non-flammable circumcision discussion

Mrs_W_Pookie · September 2011

I have always thought that if I had a boy we would have him circumcised because it is a part of our religion (Judiasm). I read something today (not the first time I've read articles on this topic, but the first time something has really resonated) that has changed my mind and caused me to not want to have the procedure done if we have a boy.

The trouble I'm having is how to reconcile this with my religious "beliefs". And do I believe in it just because it's what Judaism says to do?

I spoke with DH today and he said he is also against circumcision, so we're on the same page, but I still feel like I need to justify it against what my religion says. Please help!

luckyinlove11902 · September 2011

Do you mind sharing what you read that has changed your perspective?

MaryJaneWatz · September 2011

What did you read to help change your mind? I'm not really sure I have an opinion on the subject yet so I'm curious to hear both sides.

jenhappy · September 2011

Not sure what help you are looking for. That you should do what you and your husband believe despite what your faith teaches? Kind of hard to comment on since I'm not Jewish nor do I know the reasoning for circumcision in terms of Judaism. It sounds like something you should talk with a rabbi or other faith leader, maybe?

Martiza · September 2011

I would seek out members of the same believes that have not circumcised. I don't fully understand why it is almost a must for those practicing Judaism. I think since you and DH agree, that I would go with your personal mutual feelings versus religious feelings. Again, if I am misspeaking, I apologize.

ClaireDunphy · September 2011

luckyinlove11902:
Do you mind sharing what you read that has changed your perspective?

Yes

How important is your faith to you? How much does religion play a part in the raising of your children & your every day life?

Go with your gut. If you firmly believe that you shouldn't based on the new finding, then don't. He can always be circumsized later. You can't undo circumcision.

Mrs_W_Pookie · September 2011

luckyinlove11902:
Do you mind sharing what you read that has changed your perspective?

!!! WARNING: SCIENTIFIC IMAGES NSFW

http://www.drmomma.org/2011/08/intact-or-circumcised-significant.html

Mrs_W_Pookie · September 2011

jenhappy:
It sounds like something you should talk with a rabbi or other faith leader, maybe?

I was thinking about consulting with the Orthodox Rabbi (who I would assume would circumcise regardless of personal belief / without question, because it is what the religion teaches) and a conservative or reform rabbi.

PantsOffDanceOff · September 2011

Consult with your rabbi, I don't think we can help you with your religious viewpoints.

I don't get the circumcision debate. If you want to do it, do it. If not, then don't. I don't see the problem either way.

Mrs_W_Pookie · September 2011

PantsOffDanceOff:

I don't get the circumcision debate. If you want to do it, do it. If not, then don't. I don't see the problem either way.

I don't either. But it seems to be a very debatable topic and can get quite heated. In reality, whatever one family decides should be no one else's business, but people like to share their "opinions". I've seen it a lot on blogs and the Bump forums.

luckyinlove11902 · September 2011

I didn't really understand the issues with circumcision until reading some recent articles, and after viewing the link you provided I can absolutely understand your hesitation. I think the best advice at this point is to speak to a Rabbi or others in your faith who have chosen not to circumcise. The medical facts are out there, at this point it is a matter of you balancing those with your own beliefs. While I can't say for sure what I would do, I will say that it is understandable and IMO healthy to question your religious practices when they may do more harm than good (I say may, not saying for sure either way). If you speak to your rabbi and the reasoning doesn't outweigh your doubts then I think you will have your answer.

Kristin&Kelly09 · September 2011

Mrs_W_Pookie:
PantsOffDanceOff:

I don't get the circumcision debate. If you want to do it, do it. If not, then don't. I don't see the problem either way.

I don't either. But it seems to be a very debatable topic and can get quite heated. In reality, whatever one family decides should be no one else's business, but people like to share their "opinions". I've seen it a lot on blogs and the Bump forums.

I agree with Pants. To me, the topic of circumcision is like the SAHM vs. WM topic. You have to do what you feel is right for you and your family and no one should make you feel bad for whatever you choose. I really didn't have a preference on the circumcision topic and ultimately left the decision up to DH to make. He decided we wouldn't have him circumcised and I supported that decision.

LXLX · September 2011

PantsOffDanceOff:
Consult with your rabbi, I don't think we can help you with your religious viewpoints.

I don't get the circumcision debate. If you want to do it, do it. If not, then don't. I don't see the problem either way.

Yes

LXLX · September 2011

Mrs_W_Pookie:
I don't either. But it seems to be a very debatable topic and can get quite heated. In reality, whatever one family decides should be no one else's business, but people like to share their "opinions". I've seen it a lot on blogs and the Bump forums.

I completely understand why the debates get heated quickly - it's very easy for both sides to say something extremely offensive no matter how innocently something is meant. Almost anything said about it one way or the other WILL get taken personally.

MaryJaneWatz · September 2011

Thank you for sharing the link, Pookie. It was very informative.

Mrs_W_Pookie · September 2011

The Jewish guilt in articles that I've been reading is NOT helping:

Bris is the sign of the covenant. A boy who is not circumcised has basically lost his spiritual attachment to the Jewish people.

Tongue Tied

MaryJaneWatz · September 2011

Mrs_W_Pookie:
The Jewish guilt in articles that I've been reading is NOT helping:
Bris is the sign of the covenant. A boy who is not circumcised has basically lost his spiritual attachment to the Jewish people.

What is the purpose of circumcision in Judaism? I'm sorry if that is an ignorant question. I'm just having issues understanding why a man's foreskin has anything to do with his relationship with God.

Mrs_W_Pookie · September 2011

MaryJaneWatz:
Mrs_W_Pookie:
The Jewish guilt in articles that I've been reading is NOT helping:
Bris is the sign of the covenant. A boy who is not circumcised has basically lost his spiritual attachment to the Jewish people.

What is the purpose of circumcision in Judaism? I'm sorry if that is an ignorant question. I'm just having issues understanding why a man's foreskin has anything to do with his relationship with God.

As far as I can tell, it is just something G-d told Abraham to do, so he did it. This article might explain more:

http://www.aish.com/jl/l/b/What_is_Circumcision.html

I don't think it's an ignorant question at all. It's why I'm doing so much research.

On a related note, I think the fact that I am doing all this research points to my maternal instinct that this baby is a boy.

MaryJaneWatz · September 2011

Mrs_W_Pookie:
MaryJaneWatz:
Mrs_W_Pookie:
The Jewish guilt in articles that I've been reading is NOT helping:
Bris is the sign of the covenant. A boy who is not circumcised has basically lost his spiritual attachment to the Jewish people.

What is the purpose of circumcision in Judaism? I'm sorry if that is an ignorant question. I'm just having issues understanding why a man's foreskin has anything to do with his relationship with God.
As far as I can tell, it is just something G-d told Abraham to do, so he did it. This article might explain more:
http://www.aish.com/jl/l/b/What_is_Circumcision.html
I don't think it's an ignorant question at all. It's why I'm doing so much research.
On a related note, I think the fact that I am doing all this research points to my maternal instinct that this baby is a boy.

Thanks for that link I never knew Abraham was the founding father of Judaism. The article said he may have circumcised himself, that dude was hardcore. It's very interesting to read the religious aspect but I'm just wondering if it's an outdated practice. I'm interested in what other information you find and what you decide.

chinchilla fiesta · September 2011

I don't have a ton to add since I'm not Jewish but if you guys do have some conversations with you Rabbi would you mind coming back and sharing what his opinion was? I'm honestly curious about it.

duncanpowers · September 2011

If you're looking for an alternative view that will back up your own from within your faith, here are a few quotes from rabbis who agree with you:

http://abchomeopathy.com/forum2.php/273041/

You could also argue that, like Christianity, the 'outward signs of the covenant' have changed over the millennia. Yes, that is what Abraham and the Israelites did in the early days of the religion to signify outwardly that they were Jews. But they also sacrificed animals and burned them, splattered blood on their doorposts annually, and a number of other outward signs that are no longer practiced.

The essential component of any faith is simply that: faith. You don't need an outward sign of it. In the loosest form of Judaism existing today, ie unless you're practicing as Orthodox, etc, that is the last remaining outward sign and only applies to men; in fact, you could argue that the women have already made it past that stage into the 'faith alone' stage since the faith is understood to pass down through the woman. It then stands to reason that it would make no difference religiously if you chose not to circumcise your son, since, regardless of outward signs, you are Jewish and therefore he is also. You are only making the next logical step in the modernization of the faith you practice.

gullterre · September 2011

Kristin&Kelly09:
Mrs_W_Pookie:
PantsOffDanceOff:

I don't get the circumcision debate. If you want to do it, do it. If not, then don't. I don't see the problem either way.

I don't either. But it seems to be a very debatable topic and can get quite heated. In reality, whatever one family decides should be no one else's business, but people like to share their "opinions". I've seen it a lot on blogs and the Bump forums.

I agree with Pants. To me, the topic of circumcision is like the SAHM vs. WM topic. You have to do what you feel is right for you and your family and no one should make you feel bad for whatever you choose. I really didn't have a preference on the circumcision topic and ultimately left the decision up to DH to make. He decided we wouldn't have him circumcised and I supported that decision.

DH and I did exactly the same thing as K&K. I left it up to DH (he is British so you can guess about his parts). He decided NO and I was OK with it. I will just make sure that DS learns how to take care of it as he gets older. As for your religious beliefs, I agree with those who said to speak with a rabbi.

adarlingzta · September 2011

http://www.jewsagainstcircumcision.org/

I dont know if you have seen this or not. I remember seeing it mentioned in various places of discussion.

Whatever you decide will be the right choice for your family.

Mrs_W_Pookie · September 2011

adarlingzta:
http://www.jewsagainstcircumcision.org/
I dont know if you have seen this or not. I remember seeing it mentioned in various places of discussion.
Whatever you decide will be the right choice for your family.

I haven't seen this yet, thank you.

I also want to thank everyone for their input. I will definitely be doing more research into this topic.

Hopefully non-flammable circumcision discussion

Re: Hopefully non-flammable circumcision discussion

Choose Another Board

Search Boards