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Advice regarding IL issues (kind of long)
Hey guys,
I'm a long time lurker, first time poster here. I read this board a lot and get a lot of great advice from responders of other people's posts, so I thought I'd ask a simple question. First, of course, a little background.
My DH and I have been married for a little over a year, together for four years before that, and have known each other since we were probably five. We grew up together, were best friends in high school, lost touch for a few years in college, and then found each other again. My IL do not have a great relationship with me or DH. DH has never been super close with his parents and he and his mother always butted heads, but their relationship seemed to improve when he moved out. As for my relationship with the ILs, it used to be okay and I used to enjoy spending time with them, but when we moved across the country for my residency training for a year, she got really pissed and that's where I think she realized I was not a doormat and wouldn't conform to the way she wanted our lives to be and we would not live somewhere just because she wanted us to live there. We moved back a year later, as we both have family in the area, and we were engaged; the relationship with ILs (especially MIL) just seemed to continue to decline as our wedding came closer. My MIL basically felt that our wedding equated to the same feelings she would have if DH were dying (wtf..?!), even though their relationship was much better than before. She tried making the day (or the whole year?!) leading up to our wedding about her.. that's a whole separate story, and though it relates to our current issues, I'd rather not rehash everything unless anyone has any specific questions.
I am a family oriented person and I have a large family that we see probably once a week (DH loves visiting, I have told him many times that we don't always have to go, but he likes to hang out with my grandfather and extended family for Sunday dinner). However, I also believe in spending time with your SO's (whether it be boy/girlfriend, IL, or otherwise) if that is the norm of the relationship, so we used to visit IL at least once a week to spend time with them as well. We don't live far from either of our families, so it was never an issue to pop by for a few minutes for a cup of coffee on our way home, or whatever.
Anyhow, point of this statement is to say that MIL was in fact not losing her son (as though he were dying), she was in fact gaining a daughter. However, she is very melodramatic and likes to "stir things up" and be difficult (even though we try to compromise, whether its on spending holiday time or a weekend day or a birthday with her), and I believe she thrives off of making drama for herself. We've tried and tried, but MIL (and FIL) are extremely controlling and manipulative to the point where we decided that we can't keep visiting them all the time anymore.
One recent example of MILs crazy behavior happened just last week: basically, DH's grandmother is moving down to an assisted living home near DH's uncle (2 hrs away). Grandmother still has AC units in her windows, but its starting to get cold out, so obviously they need to be taken out soon. DH calls his mother up to invite ILs over for coffee. MIL responds that she and FIL had to hire the kid across the street to take out ACs (disregards the invitation), and says that they are busy waiting for this kid to take out ACs (FIL recently hurt his back and isn't supposed to lift anything too heavy at the moment). DH says "Oh, why didn't you ask me, I would have helped you." MIL starts screaming at DH over the phone and says, "We're tired of having to ask you to help us, you should just offer and do things for us! I shouldn't have to ask for your help!" So a few words (not many, literally DH yelled back that he isn't a mind reader) were spoken and MIL hangs up on DH. This is not the first time a situation has happened where they claim to need help with something, but get upset and scream at DH because he wasn't there even though he had no idea they needed help. They are not elderly and are healthy (other than FILs recent back injury).
Now, I know this doesn't seem like a huge deal or something to cut ties over (it's an AC unit FFS), and we understand that FIL couldn't do this on his own because of his back, but this on top of every other boundary they have crossed has really just given us (especially me) a bad taste in our mouths. ILs (especially MIL) also make really snide comments about me and to me, most of which DH will respond to if he hears them, or I will respond if I have something to say about it. DH has really been on my side about his parents. In the beginning, he didn't understand or catch some of the rude comments or things that ILs said or realize how controlling they were (situations like the AC units that had to be done now or they would scream at him), but he is now realizing that this is a really toxic and one-sided relationship. I have to add, we are always the ones to call and invite them over or ask if they are busy so we can spend time with them or offer to pick up coffee or have them over for dinner, etc. His parents NEVER call, NEVER invite us over. Well... they used to invite just DH over if I was working late, but he refused because he thought they were being rude by purposely inviting only him when I was at work late -- they have never once invited both of us over for dinner other than a birthday.. and even then, they tried to celebrate DH's birthday this past year by bringing over a cake for him the day before his actual birthday because they knew I was at work. DH told them he didn't want cake the day before because he wanted to celebrate with his wife 
They got pissed and left. But the funny thing is, they always *** if we don't come over or if we don't invite them over one week -- the phone works both ways and its not like we go more than one or two weeks without seeing them. It's frustrating to have to be the initiators all the time, but then have them get pissed if we happen to be busy one weekend but they don't call or try to visit on their own time.
Okay, so sorry for the long explanation, but so much has happened and we've really tried so hard to have them be a part of our lives because they complain if we don't have them over, but then they also seem to push us away from them. So, I mentioned, DH has realized how toxic this relationship is and how manipulative and controlling and just downright mean his parents can be, so we (mostly he, they are his parents) decided that we just can't visit as often or be as available to them anymore. It just makes us anxious because every visit something is said or they disapprove of something or they accuse DH of not caring about them -- it's a vicious cycle. So my question is this -- should DH talk to his parents and say, "Hey, mom and dad, because of your crazy azz behavior and your bad attitudes and the fact that you make me feel guilty for not doing your every bidding, KAL and I will not be coming over as often"?? Or should we just stop visiting and if they ask, then we can explain? As much as DH and ILs have hashed it out, and this is no new information, I feel like they really just don't get it.
We are kind of at a loss in how to approach the ILs about this or whether we should just not see them again until Thanksgiving and if they ask why we've been distant we can explain. WWFMD?
Sorry for the length, and thanks for reading if you got through the whole thing. And thanks in advance for the advice!!
Re: Advice regarding IL issues (kind of long)
You need to steer clear of all toxic people.
This includes the ILs that are giving you trouble.
Close, but no cigar:
So my question is this -- should DH talk to his parents and say, "Hey, mom and dad, because of your crazy azz behavior and your bad attitudes and the fact that you make me feel guilty for not doing your every bidding, KAL and I will not be coming over as often"??
He should tell them, "We will NOT be visiting you, nor have any contact with you until you clean up your acts and treat my wife politely and civilly. What hurts my wife hurts me and if you don't like it that we won't be speaking or calling, too bad."
And too bad indeed. Maybe that'll be their wake up call.
Sorry for your troubles.
Thanks for the advice and the nice thoughts. I know I've painted DH and I in a good light, and I know we aren't perfect either. I feel bad having come to this conclusion (not visiting or seeing ILs as often), but DH and I both feel that this is the best thing for us, since it's always so awkward and we are so anxious because we know *something* is going to happen or be said while we are there. Previously, we could kind of shrug it off, and I personally am at a point where I just don't even talk to them unless I am directly spoken to. But it has gotten to a point where they are just awful to both of us a majority of the time, but the next time we see them, they act like nothing happened before. We don't share any important information with them anymore either because they are so nosy and in our business, it's extremely frustrating (ex. we are looking for a new car, if we told them, they'd be all "oh, you should buy this car, if you don't, it's a shame, it's a great car, we love it, etc. etc. etc." and then they will proceed to be upset if we actually didn't buy the car they liked.. I know this because this is what happened when we bought our house, when I bought my new car prior to us getting married, when I was looking for a new job... so we learned our lesson and stopped sharing information).
I just wonder if ILs will even get it, though? I think if DH confronts them, they will only be even worse to us, but if he doesn't confront them, they will just continue to be horrible on the occassions that they do see us? It's just difficult and it's really sad and I really feel for DH. He is really so good to his parents even though they treat him like crap.
Another issue I've been thinking about -- what do we do when we have kids??! DH and I don't have any yet and aren't really planning just yet, but we want to start trying probably starting in the late spring, early summer. For those of you who have ILs like this, do you even let your kids visit alone with them??? I know it will be a long time before our kids will understand ILs comments and crazy behavior, but I can't help thinking that I don't want my kids around that kind of situation. Thanks for all the advice! And sorry if this is kind of a post and run... it's midnight here and I have work tomorrow! (Boo...)
Great.
If not, it is THEIR problem. Let 'em live with the fact that they permanently alienated you and your H, all because they've chosen to be nasty, divisive and rotten.
"I just wonder if ILs will even get it, though?"
They will NEVER get it, unless they go get serious counseling.
"I think if DH confronts them, they will only be even worse to us, but if he doesn't confront them, they will just continue to be horrible on the occassions that they do see us? "
Yes, if DH confronts them, they WILL give him crap. The treatment will be the same (probably worse) as he's used to. Better to be up front with them and establish your boundaries and stick to them than allow yourselves to be walked all over time and time again. Distance yourself and cut contact if you need to.
"For those of you who have ILs like this, do you even let your kids visit alone with them???"
I won't be letting them see my kids unsupervised. I don't want their toxic behavior affecting my children.
Talk to a counselor, get help. These people have too much of a negative influence on your life, is it really worth it to keep taking the abuse?
They sound really tiresome.
But I think a big part of this is trying to force parity on his family when they just aren't like your family. I'd leave this to him to sort out; it sounds like he's doing pretty well.
I think he was wrong not to accept an occasional solo invitation if you're busy. Throwing his mom this bone might help her dial back her behavior a bit. Would him celebrating his birthday with his parents the night before somehow ruin a celebration on the day of with you? I don't get it. Both you and DH seem stuck on how you want things without taking into consideration that his parents aren't like your nice family.
Just because he's a married man doesn't mean she shouldn't get to have her son to herself once in a while. I adore my niece's SO and her XDH, but I also like to see her without them (and without DH or DS) once in a while.
I agree that he should accept the occasional solo invite, and he did at first. However, MIL purposely invites him when I am not around so that things can be the way before we were married (which she has actually said to DH on one of the occasions she had him over for dinner, so I am not making assumptions). She refuses to invite me over at any time. For his birthday, they purposely visited and brought a cake to our house to celebrate without me. It wasn't a mistake and they knew I wasn't home. We were at their house the day before and they didn't acknowledge his birthday, asked if they should come over the next day to celebrate, even though it wasn't his actual birthday. DH said, "Well, KAL is working late and I'd rather have everyone around." They showed up with a cake anyway. It didn't really ruin his birthday, we kind of laughed about it after.. but it's the fact that they don't ever want me around EVER that is frustrating. That's the point with the birthday cake thing...
We understand they aren't like my family, but as mentioned, if we don't visit, they complain about how long it's been since the last time we visited, etc. But when we *do* visit, they load on the crap. Nothing is ever good enough for them. Even if DH does visit without me, they find something to harp on him for. So even then, they just make everything difficult.
Thanks for the advice, guys.
And I actually think the time that your kids don't understand what they are saying is the exact time that you set VERY firm boundaries. They say unacceptable things in the presence of your kids? Then they don't get to see your kids - with or without you. Start from day 1. Don't wait until your kids can understand.
You don't owe them access to your kids, or a relationship w/ your kids.
~Benjamin Franklin
DS dx with celiac disease 5/28/10
Usually on a reply I never quote someone else but THIS....and well said. The sheer amount of stress that unaccepting ILs can cause is ridiculous. In my opinion, there is a difference between family and people who share DNA, I have friends I consider family because they have been there through good and bad and supported me even if they didn't like my decisions.
I would not make a formal decree, I would just let it pan out on its own, eventually they will get the picture and when they ask about it then explain that it seems as if every encounter is another opportunity for them to run you down. Hopefully they will pick up on it without having to have that conversation and adjust accordingly. I am so sorry you have to go through this too, I know my ILs have caused me many of tears and heart ache, I really hope yours don't have the opportunity to get to you the way mine got to me. Good Luck
Usually on a reply I never quote someone else but THIS....and well said. The sheer amount of stress that unaccepting ILs can cause is ridiculous. In my opinion, there is a difference between family and people who share DNA, I have friends I consider family because they have been there through good and bad and supported me even if they didn't like my decisions.
I would not make a formal decree, I would just let it pan out on its own, eventually they will get the picture and when they ask about it then explain that it seems as if every encounter is another opportunity for them to run you down. Hopefully they will pick up on it without having to have that conversation and adjust accordingly. I am so sorry you have to go through this too, I know my ILs have caused me many of tears and heart ache, I really hope yours don't have the opportunity to get to you the way mine got to me. Good Luck
Usually on a reply I never quote someone else but THIS....and well said. The sheer amount of stress that unaccepting ILs can cause is ridiculous. In my opinion, there is a difference between family and people who share DNA, I have friends I consider family because they have been there through good and bad and supported me even if they didn't like my decisions.
I would not make a formal decree, I would just let it pan out on its own, eventually they will get the picture and when they ask about it then explain that it seems as if every encounter is another opportunity for them to run you down. Hopefully they will pick up on it without having to have that conversation and adjust accordingly. I am so sorry you have to go through this too, I know my ILs have caused me many of tears and heart ache, I really hope yours don't have the opportunity to get to you the way mine got to me. Good Luck
Your ILs should hire the kid across the street to take out the AC units. DH seems nice enough but he doesn't have to do every little chore for them and they SHOULD get a helpful kid from time to time for minor stuff. That's what adults do.
Next time they can't come over for coffee because they are waiting for something like this, DH should jsut say "Okay, catch you another time."
Stop explaining, it never works, just do as you wish. Learn to shrug more.