September 2009 Weddings
Dear Community,
Our tech team has launched updates to The Nest today. As a result of these updates, members of the Nest Community will need to change their password in order to continue participating in the community. In addition, The Nest community member's avatars will be replaced with generic default avatars. If you wish to revert to your original avatar, you will need to re-upload it via The Nest.
If you have questions about this, please email help@theknot.com.
Thank you.
Note: This only affects The Nest's community members and will not affect members on The Bump or The Knot.
Our tech team has launched updates to The Nest today. As a result of these updates, members of the Nest Community will need to change their password in order to continue participating in the community. In addition, The Nest community member's avatars will be replaced with generic default avatars. If you wish to revert to your original avatar, you will need to re-upload it via The Nest.
If you have questions about this, please email help@theknot.com.
Thank you.
Note: This only affects The Nest's community members and will not affect members on The Bump or The Knot.
Carpool Thursday
If you were on the Penn State board of trustees, would you let Joe Paterno retire after the season or would you require his (and President Graham Spanier's) immediate resignation over the alleged sexual abuse scandal and subsequent cover up?
ETA: Since the news release that Paterno and Spanier have both been let go, let me revise the question: Do you agree with the board of trustee's decision? Also, Mike McQueary (the current wide receiver coach and recruiter for PSU football), has come forth as the unnamed graduate assistant who witnessed an assault on a 10YO boy in the locker room and was the one who told Paterno the next day. Should McQueary also be fired for not contacting the police after actually witnessing a crime in progress?
Re: Carpool Thursday
I will start by saying I have only caught bits and pieces of this story (what I could stomach of it) and he absolutely should be fired.
He was told that a child was abused and while he did report it, he knew that nothing further was done. He should have at that point gone to the police but instead did not. I have no idea how a person could go on living knowing this kind of information and not do a damn thing about it.
I'm not completely full on the legality of everything, (and I don't really give a danm about Joe Pa or Penn State football), and I did read the 23 page grand jury report.
So, going on that:
1. I don't think Joe should be fired; he should be allowed to go through to the end of his contract (expires next year).
2. Even though all he did was report it to his superiors, legally that's all he had to do.
3. Morally, I don't agree at all with what he neglected to do, BUT Joe couldn't have called the police anyway. Anything he would have told the police or CPS, would be hear-say. They would have to talk directly with the graduate assistant who witnessed the events. Granted, if I were in his position, I would have called the police anyway and hounded that GA until he gave his report.
4. I'm a mandatory reporter and last year I had suspected a child of being abused. I had never called CYS before and went to our social worker to tell her of my suspicions. She offered to call the report for me, but needed a signed statement from me (the original reporter). So, even IF Joe went to the police, he would still need some sort of confirmation from the grad assistant.
5. Had the grad assistant immediately called campus police, Joe Pa wouldn't have been involved in the first place.
However, I do think the President should immediately resign. He's the top of the chain of command and 2 incidents were reported up the ladder to him and HE did nothing. Didn't contact the original reporters, didn't follow up with Curley or Schultz, didn't even revoke Sandusky's ability to have free range of the Penn State campus even though he was retired. That I don't think is reconcilable.
See, I don't know if PA has a law like that or not. Because technically, if my neighbor tells me that he saw his uncle rape a little boy and I call the police, what would the police do? Probably nothing...especially if my neighbor doesn't want to talk to the police. So, had Paterno called the police, they would take the report and unless the GA spoke with them, legally nothing could have been done.
But, it would have looked better on Paterno if he did at least attempt this. I don't know how you can hear something like that and not at least try to help.
I do wonder if McQueary (the grad assistant, turned current PSU coach) will lose his job as well, since he SAW it happen and all he did was tell Paterno?
ETA: To answer my updated question: I think McQueary should be fired as well. How do you witness something like that and your gut reaction isn't to yank the creeper off the little boy and kick said creeper in the junk????? How do you calmly walk away, call your dad, and then tell your coach a day later?
see, at least in CO, this is incorrect. If you call the police or social services and report something like this, then they are obligated to at least investigate, because it involves a minor. Now, if it wasn't a minor, I can't guarentee that something would come of it.
Me being a mandatory reporter, I have to report ANYTHING I hear as it relates to any kind of abuse as a minor. If I have the name of the offender or the name of the child - call legally HAS to be made.
And I can't imagine not calling the police even if I wasn't a mandatory reporter. I'd rather call and give them all the information I had and be told "well, we'll look into it but there's not much we can do" so I at least know I did all I could to help.
Ugh, this whole thing makes me sick... and to make matters worse, it's my alma mater.
When I hear about the story on my local news station, I feel like it's only a local/state-wide story. But when it see it all over major news stations... It's a bit sickening. I'm don't feel embarrassment because I'm very proud of my education and the experience I had when I attended. However, I'm beyond disappointed in how this situation was handled and makes me question people who were well respected on campus.
I love JoePa, don't get me wrong... And I can't say what was going through his mind when he decided not to follow through on reporting anything... but I have lost some respect for him because he was such an idolized figure in the Penn State community. I think the board took the appropriate actions.
I'm with Neuner on this one, I think anyone who knew about this should be implicated with any charges. I think it's our duty as responsible adults to protect children... even if it's just a suspicion of something. I hope and pray that if anyone ever suspected my daughter and other future children as victims of abuse, they would speak up and report it. I think there is a very special place in he!! for people who harm children and I can't even begin to imagine why an adult would do that to a child.
Sarge, I also see eye-to-eye with you about how McQueary didn't handle the situation. I don't get why he didn't do anything right then and there to stop it. And why didn't he go straight to the police?
The only reason I can fathom as to why so many protected Sandusky is because he was a friend and someone they respected. There has to be a line though, the well-being of that child and all the others should have come first... It's a real shame that no one did anything sooner.
My Acme Box last update 3/28/11
Exactly what Neuner said.
Also, who cares if there is a law or not. The concern should be doing whatever you can, like reporting it to the people who can investigate, not whether or not they're going to actually investigate. And the excuse of "well, even if I do report it they aren't going to do anything about it so I might as well not waste the time to report it" speaks to the apathy of the world. Everyone has a moral obligation to protect those who are not in a position to protect themselves, like children, as per the tacit rules of our "civilized" society. To me everyone who knew what was happening (which is apparently A LOT of people) and did nothing to stop it, report it, etc. failed as humans, in so many ways, its heartbreaking.
Oh, I agree with that totally. But it makes you think about WHY some of the people didn't report it. Working in one of the poorest counties in the state of PA, I've seen a LOT of mishandling of situations that involve child neglect/abuse. Just recently there was a news story about a man who beat his g/f's 2 year old so badly for crying that the child had to be admitted to the hospital and died as a result of his injuries. The man has since been arrested and I think the DA may be pursuing the death penalty...however momma.....no charges. Not even child endangerment. It really makes you sick.
I think I said somewhere up there that I (morally) can't get behind Joe Pa on this. Even if it's a friend, if someone came to me and said they witnessed so-and-so doing sick and nasty things with a small child, my first reaction would be, "Did you call the police?" And if the answer is no, my next step would be to dial 911 and report the sonofabitch.
I will be uber-pissed though, if McQueary isn't fired as well. Do what you will with Paterno, but to not discipline the dude that WALKED AWAY from it while it was happening it just reprehensible. Granted the dude was a GA at the time (and the argument is that being a GA, there wasn't much he could do besides tell his supervisor, Paterno), but I still don't understand how you can just walk away.
Same with the janitor who walked away. And I think the janitor may have my deepest seeded hatred (aside from Sandusky) because the janitor had only been working there for 6 months (long after Sandusky had retired) and had no clue who Sandusky was. For all he knew the guy in the locker room was just a hobo off the street molesting a little boy. Why isn't your first reaction to beat the bloody hell out of the guy??? Who in their right mind walks away?? That's what I can't wrap my mind around.