Our tech team has launched updates to The Nest today. As a result of these updates, members of the Nest Community will need to change their password in order to continue participating in the community. In addition, The Nest community member's avatars will be replaced with generic default avatars. If you wish to revert to your original avatar, you will need to re-upload it via The Nest.
If you have questions about this, please email help@theknot.com.
Thank you.
Note: This only affects The Nest's community members and will not affect members on The Bump or The Knot.
Senior Discounts: A Gift for the Rich
Senior Discounts: A Gift for the Rich
With my Charlie Card Senior Pass, I can still ride the T for 60 cents. At the Kendall Square Cinema, I save $2.00 over the regular ticket price. Amtrak gives me a 15% discount on most trains if I merely show my ID. Wendy?s will take 10% off my tab for a quick burger and golden fries. Best of all, the National Park Service issued me a ?Golden Age Passport? for a token $10 fee that provides a lifetime free pass to all National Parks, forests, and recreational areas.
And here in Massachusetts I am particularly blessed for when I come to pay my Massachusetts state income tax, I don?t have to pay a cent on my Social Security earnings no matter how much other income I might have from wages, interest, dividends, and capital gains.
All of this comes to me for one simple reason. I am more than 62 years old.
Back in 1959, such senior citizen discounts might not have been such a bad idea. The poverty rate for those 65 and older was 35 percent, more than double the rate for those aged 18 to 64. Today, however, the poverty rate for seniors has shrunk to less than 10 percent, only two-thirds the rate of younger adults. According to the Pew Research Center, between 1967 and 2010, median inflation adjusted household income rose by 27 percent for those whose oldest member was 35 or younger and 48 percent for those age 35 to 44. But for those 65 and older, income more than doubled (+109%).
That today?s seniors are doing so well relative to others is due to a number of factors. Increases in Social Security have raised many low income seniors out of poverty. Older folks are staying in the labor force longer and continue to earn wages, some because they need the dough, but many others because they otherwise would be bored to death. Baby boomers, now turning 65 at a rate of 10,000 a day, had the great fortune of buying homes when they were cheap. As such, they not only had good incomes, but now have a tidy nest egg to boot. Those in the older generation who went to college often graduated with little or no debt as tuition and room and board were much more reasonable a few decades back. Today two-thirds of graduating seniors in the country start off with college debt that averages more than $25,000.
All of this means that the gap in net worth between seniors and youngsters is growing exponentially. According to the Pew Research Center, those aged 65 and older head households where the median net worth was nearly $171,000 in 2009. Those younger than age 35 had net worth of less than $3,700. And this wealth gap has increased dramatically since 1984 because the net assets of seniors has increased by 42 percent while the net worth of the younger generation has declined by 68 percent. Even the meltdown in financial markets had little effect on seniors. Those 65 and older saw their net worth decline by 6 percent between 2005 and 2009. Those younger than 35 experienced a 55 percent loss in wealth; those 35-44 a 49 percent loss.
Simply put, those who are now senior citizens are part of the richest generation of Americans of all time and it is unlikely that younger generations will ever have the same incomes or the same wealth.
And yet we continue to shower our seniors with discounts while younger folks have to pay full fare. This is a demographic twist on the growing tradition in the U.S. of the ?rich get richer ?.?
There?s nothing wrong with offering discounts or free passes or giving out some tax breaks. But we should be more careful about who gets them. Some baby boomers can certainly use them because they have not benefited like others. But I am much more concerned about those who are following our generation. Somehow, they need the discounts more than we do.
It may be hard to means-test everyone before we offer them a free ride or a cheaper one, but every time one of us geezers takes advantage of a discount, try to remember how tough it is on the younger generations coming up the pike.
Re: Senior Discounts: A Gift for the Rich
I need IIOY to come in here and post her FB profile pic because it would be perfect here.
I'm uncomfortable with assuming that all old people have the money to pay full price for things - I know that not everyone old person is raking in the dough. But, well, neither are a lot of young people. So as much as I want to stick it to the old fogeys here, it's not so black-and-white.
But what I am very annoyed about is the old man who asked if he gets a senior citizen discount on his lost library card fee. The standard fee for everyone is a fuckingdollar. Pay the fuckingdollar you cheap dumbass.
<a href="http://www.thenest.com/?utm_source=ticker&utm_medium=HTML&utm_campaign=tickers" title="Home DI can't work up even a small amount of outrage. I mean, how many 65+ year olds are headed to the National Parks? I'd guess the discount drives them there, when they might otherwise skip it. Fill up the Denny's at 4:30 for the seniors specials, when it would otherwise be empty? Shopping at Marshalls on Tuesday for that 10% off?
I'd have to see proof that businesses are losing money over these promotions, especially since I think it does the exact opposite and actually increases profits.
Missus, my Dad would totally be one to ask about the library discount. He's also the one that will hold up the line at Burger King if he thinks he was overcharged by 13 cents (My DH is still scarred by that one). But he's also better with $$ than anyone I know. I wish I was as frugal! I still won't argue over 13 cents, though.
<a href="http://www.thenest.com/?utm_source=ticker&utm_medium=HTML&utm_campaign=tickers" title="Home D
Click me, click me!
*nods*
To me, the intent of this article is more to point out the shift in trends relating to age and wealth that needs to happen.
We live in a world with a Social Security System that is unsustainable, due in large part to people living longer, drawing more than they paid in and massive numbers of Baby Boomers. We have systems that were built based upon income data which is simply not accurate anymore - and none of these systems have changed, to the benefit of the seniors and the detriment of the youth.
That was the point I took from this article - not that he's highlighting the actual small discounts. More that we have a system that is geared toward assumptions that aren't accurate.
I think it depends on the source of the discount, too. A discount ride on the MBTA may well be costing the transportation agency TONS in revenue. Its a cash strapped agency for sure.
I just think its interesting to see the history of the senior discount from a needs based perspective.
Lol yes. It hadn't occurred to me that this would turn into a debate about senior discounts. More just the system and how it has changed over time,
My mother and father love to tell me about all of the money they are saving with senior discounts. It some ways, it does piss me off, because my parents are collecting social security, her pension, his pension, they hvae plenty of money saved, and my mother still works.
They love to tell me about how they take PATCO to philly from NJ for something like $0.40, ride SEPTA for dirt cheap, and they do have that national parks golden passport. They have probably been to at least 10 national parks now with that pass and they are actively planning more trips to see more parks.
I am not against senior discounts at for-profit businesses (those businesses can choose to offer discounts to whomever they want), but I am against senior discounts at public institutions/public transit when those people can easily afford the full rate and those institutions are totally cash strapped and cutting back on services. Things like the MBTA, PATCO, SEPTA, national parks, etc.
Trains Across America
Would you like to buy my condo in Salem?
Good point, but I still think that we should re-evaluate the assumptions that make public institutions give all senior citizens some discount.
ETA: rich people often get discounts or freebies they don't need, though. Swag bags for celebrities, donated clothing and jewelry, etc. Obviously this isn't important on a policy level, but it is interesting to think of all the ways in which the rich get perks even though they can afford to go without them.
Also, I wonder if these rates aren't a way to pull in a demographic that wouldn't be interested were it not for the discounts. I'm thinking particularly of national parks, movie theaters and such. Someone above mentioned their parents visiting numerous places, numerous times. I wonder if they would go as often or at all were it not for the discounts.
I know for my IL's, it takes a lot to get them out of the house. Maybe they can afford full price but that doesn't mean they would line up to pay it, kwim?
Click me, click me!
That's really the point I was trying to make. Even with things like public transportation. I'd much rather the old people get on the bus than hop in their car where they could plow me down.
IIOY, you know what I'm talking about.
<a href="http://www.thenest.com/?utm_source=ticker&utm_medium=HTML&utm_campaign=tickers" title="Home D
That's a really good point. The restaurants I worked at that offered a senior menu or senior discount didn't do so because they were concerned about the well being or finances of senior citizens, they did it because they wanted to be competitive with other places who did the same.
I hate shopping on certain days because it is senior discount day at the grocery store and they all pay by check.
That said I'm happy to give them discounted public transport if it means they aren't driving and causing collisions.
Above Us Only Sky
You really think many of these seniors would be driving if they didn't get the public transit discount? My parents would still be taking public transit, they would jsut be paying full price for it. Which they can easily afford.
Trains Across America
Would you like to buy my condo in Salem?
It depends where you live. If you live somewhere that public transport is the norm, then of course most would still use it. But most of us do not live in such places, unfortunately. So yes, i truly believe many would revert to driving since it is the norm in most places.