Let's talk about veal

Alisha_A

Pretty much, yes. There is such a thing as humanely raised veal (at least, so it says) but its not all that prevalent. There are some arguments for humanely raised veal, such as the abundance of male calves from the dairy industry. Here's a good article. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/10/27/AR2009102700563.html

CDMay2006

Sweden+Canada:

CDMay2006:

I don't think i've ever eaten it, and i don't eat any meat products, but to me, the baby-ness doesn't bother me, it's the inhumane treatment for its (short) lifespan.

On a related note, a major contributor to depleted food fish populations is 'harvesting' young fish, so populations are not able to be maintained.

I don't think you can compare lambs or veal to fish though in terms of harvesting the young. Lambs and veal are obviously grown in a 'controlled environment' and I'm pretty sure the farmers knows how to keep the populations maintained. 

I agree with you though, the babyness of lambs/chicken/veal doesn't bother me at all but I do not like the inhumane treatment. That's why I prefer to eat lambs (from my dads farm, I know they've been treated nicely and had a good life) or venison.

In the context, it was exactly the same.  Before my response, the only reason posters cited for not eating it or having concerns about it was that it was babies, not that it was inhumane.  Fish or cow, they are still babies (regardless of the outcome of various slaughter approaches).

Tambcat

Baby fish don't tug at my heartstrings. I wouldn't even know how to tell how old a fish was!

eta: also, at that point in the discussion, we were just giving 4 things that came to mind when we thought of veal - not justifying our decisions to eat or not eat. I thought...

Tambcat

Alisha_A:

  How is this so different than the horror stories of dogs beaten before death to make their meat more tender?

omg.

I had never even heard this.

Mrs Manners

Tambcat:

baby cows, baby cows, baby cows, South Park.

I don't eat it, and I don't think I ever will.

eta: I HAVE eaten it in the past, but that was many years ago. It's good, but I don't suffer without it.

All of this...word for word.

SuperGreen

Baby cows stuffed into crates so small they can't turn around, and then starved.  That's what I think of when I think of veal.  Even before I went vegetarian I never ate veal.  My dad loves it, and it makes me sick to my stomach to watch him eat it.  The night I told my dad DH and I were vegetarians, we went out to eat to celebrate DH graduating from college after 10 years.  Guess what my Dad ordered?  Yup, veal.  He looked right at me when he ordered it too, and said "I'll have the veeeeallll" really slowly while staring at me.

Pescalita

If I had a problem with "baby cows" I wouldn't eat any meat, but I do have a problem with the inhumane way veal is traditionally raised. I haven't eaten it since I found out what it was, but my current CSA does produce humanely-raised veal and vitellone (a little older). We haven't gotten it yet, but I look forward to it.

Alisha_A

Ugh, I hate when people think that stuff is funny. Eat what you want, fine, but you don't have to mock me.

Yes, in some parts of the world where dogs are eaten, they are also beaten severely beforehand, sort of a pre-tenderizing the meat. Awful, isn't it?

Man...this thread is depressing. Sad, hungry little baby cows, tortured dogs. I don't really get how people don't care. Even if you don't have empathy for other living beings, doesn't it just seem wrong to base your diet on foods that suffered? It just seems like ingesting negativity, and i know how crazy that sounds, but that's what it makes me think of.  

MrsTallPaul

I'm not taking a side on this, but I am going to clear up some things.

Meat that is considered "lamb" comes from sheep that are between 5-6 months of age.  At that age, they are between 125-130 pounds and their meat is lean and tender.  After that, they begin to put on fat.  "Mutton" refers to the meat from sheep that are over 1 year of age.

When you buy chicken at the store, you are buying what is called a "broiler chicken".  Broilers are butchered at 6-7 weeks of age.  This is because their meat is at it's optimum at that point.  As they age, the muscle weakens and they put on fat.  When laying hens are butchered, they end up in canned soup, etc.  Commercially raised laying hens only produce for about 6 months or so.

ALL dairy calves are separated from the cow at birth.  The calf is moved to a hutch where it is fed colostrum and later milk from a bottle and then bucket.  The reason the calves are not allowed to suckle is because it causes damage to the teats and introduces bacteria.

Hope this answers some of the questions.    

 

mandapanda18

Baby cows... locked up in  cage with no ability to move... poor baby cows... I'll never eat a baby cow.

 So I grew up on a farm... and a farmer a couple of miles down had veal cows on the edge of his property... my sis and I used to drive down and let them out with the big cow... man did we get in trouble, but their cages were literally 3' x 5' and it was totally animal cruelty.

That being said, I'm not vegetarian, but I'm against cruelty of any kind!

pixieprincss

Thanks for the WaPo link! I saw that a farm near us sold humanely raised veal and was curious what that was all about. I wish they'd given a more credible counter-point than PETA. I tune out every single thing that comes from PETA.

Does any one know why are male cows not used for beef later in life?

foundmylazybum

pixieprincss:

Thanks for the WaPo link! I saw that a farm near us sold humanely raised veal and was curious what that was all about. I wish they'd given a more credible counter-point than PETA. I tune out every single thing that comes from PETA.

Does any one know why are male cows not used for beef later in life?

They become big bulls....to make more cows? And I'm pretty sure steers (Castrated males) can become your next steak...

As indicated by this story in the Denver Post about how grass fed beef comes to your table:

http://www.denverpost.com/food/ci_13440238 

MrsTallPaul

pixieprincss:

Does any one know why are male cows not used for beef later in life?

Steers (castrated males) and market heifers (young females not kept for breeding) are slaughtered at about 18 months of age.  This is what the 99% of the beef you buy in the store comes from.

Bulls (intact males) are used for breeding.  When they are no longer useful for that (several years) they are butchered as well.  Bull meat retains alot of moisture, has a stong flavor, and is very tough and fatty.  Most bull meat ends up in hot dogs and bologna.

I have to laugh whenever I see the adds for the kosher franks - they brag that their cuts of meat come from the front of the animal and not the back.  I realize this is a religious tradition, but the best meat cuts are from the hind-quarter (the butt) of the animal.  Shots are given in the front and shoulder because that is the least desirable cut and will do the least amount of damage.  interesting...

 

jennyk213

Alisha_A:

Man...this thread is depressing. Sad, hungry little baby cows, tortured dogs. I don't really get how people don't care. Even if you don't have empathy for other living beings, doesn't it just seem wrong to base your diet on foods that suffered? It just seems like ingesting negativity, and i know how crazy that sounds, but that's what it makes me think of.  

I completely agree with this. 

I didn't realize what went into veal.  I just don't understand how humans can treat other living creatures so cruelly and then try to justify it.