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Need advice re: inlaws getting in the middle of sibling issues.
I have posted a few times looking for suggestions on how to deal with DH's brother/wife and DH's parents acting as a go between delivering unwanted gifts from them.
Quickly: DH's older brother is a bully. He has been a jerk/bully to DH since they were little, he's been the same to me since before we were married, and he was a bully to our daughter once. After that we cut all communication with BIL/SIL. The inlaws do not understand why we won't have anything to do with BIL/SIL and continue to make excuses for BIL's behaviour. MIL says she feels in the middle. I feel she is putting herself in the middle.
Last fall Inlaws brought gifts from BIL/SIL after we had told them (inlaws and BIL) that we would not be acepting gifts from them at all.
FIL was told by me to take the gifts back with them (they had traveled a few hours) and was told again we were not accepting gifts. I said if you and MIL do not want to be in the middle do not put yourselves there. If BIL wants to sent something it's on him, not you to make that happen.
After that MIL/FIL visited again and again brought gifts from BIL for our children. DH talked to him mother and told her we were not accepting gifts from BIL because of how badly he has treated our family. MIL cried and asked why DH was singling her out when FIL packed the gifts too. DH said he was told last time (MIL knew too) and this time MIL is being told. However it was more like the 5th time they had been told about this.
I was furious with them that weekend. More though about something else. DH was madder than I was and it took a lot for him to stand up for himself, something he has not been able to do much of since MIL is very pushy/bossy with her opinions.
DH had emailed with his parents twice since then which was about 3 months ago.
The last email MIL send ended with "we hope you are still not as angry with us as you were in December. It made for a very disapointing visit".
No accountablilty on her part for the disapointment and no appology not that we are expecting one. Just blame on DH as if it was his fault.
DH doesn't know if he want's to respond as it's stressing him out. I feel our boundries are just begining to be set with them and something has to be said.
Thanks for reading my novel 
Re: Need advice re: inlaws getting in the middle of sibling issues.
Ditto this.
I also think your H needs to say "if you insist on bringing BILs gifts with you when you come here, perhaps it is best if you do not visit at all."
You could also take the gifts, then throw them in the trash, unopened.
First, ditto Kuus.
Second, and I'm sure I said this to you before (I do remember your story) - stop explaining things to them. They show up w/ gifts? When they leave, hand them the gifts back. No explanation, no drama. Just "we're not accepting these". THEY get upset and whatever? Don't get sucked in. "We're not accepting these". Over and over and over.
They know perfectly well what the situation is. They KNOW. They are simply choosing to ignore and they are probably hoping that "this time" will be the time you'll give in.
You don't need to "explain" it to them again. It only opens the door for drama.
~Benjamin Franklin
DS dx with celiac disease 5/28/10
You know words dont' work. THis is a case where actions may truly speak louder....
~Benjamin Franklin
DS dx with celiac disease 5/28/10
I'm not familiar with your backstory, so maybe I'm missing something here.
But I think that I'd take the gifts, and drop them off at Goodwill and use them as a tax write-off. I get that you're not accepting them on principle, but hell - if they keep sending them anyway, who cares? Use it to your advantage.
you've explained 5 trillion times. next time they show up and bring the gifts put the gifts in the garbage right then.
if they ask why tell them-we've asked you for years to respect our postition on not accepting gifts and it has continued-this is how we'll deal with them from now on and the situation is no longer up for discussion'.
and really? your DH needs to CALL his mother in response to that email. not email-call. emails tones can be taken the wrong way etc.. something like this needs to be discussed over the phone if not in person. he doesn't need to explain anymore-youve done that-but he needs to get his mom off of your backs about it.
i dont remember the back story either but i'm not sure why you won't accept gifts from bil for your kid(s). i dont know if your issue with him has anything to do with it really.....but that's up to you.
I couldn't agree more w/ pp's suggestions.
You just have to take a step back and realize that they are hoping one time you guys will cave in.
FWIW, H & I went through something similar years ago with his bro. It took time, but the key is standing your ground. They can either accept it and be supportive of your feelings/stance, or don't. GL!
In a very similar situation (identical, really) I took the gifts, boxed them up unopened, and mailed them back to BIL and SIL with a note that said "Thank you for your trouble, but I cannot possibly accept these. Sue Sue".
That takes your MIL and FIL out of the middle; makes for no explanation/fight/disappointment necessary to anyone, at all, ever; and you don't accept gifts from pigs.
It is really not your MIL and FIL's job to return unwanted gifts to your BIL (and yes, I know, it's not their job to deliver them either but there you are). Take charge of your own returns.
Yes, I'm sure you did tell me to stop explaining. I'm going to show DH all these posts. He's a people pleaser and when his mom cries he trys to make things better and he definetly over explained but I think this time it was more for him then for her.
I am really really hoping this is the end of it. Though I know I said that last time too.
ah THATS the problem. your DH needs to be less of a 'mom pleaser' and more of a 'point getter acrosser'. capice?
Yes, I know that is a problem. As per my question, what should he say to her?
It's not a hundred dollars to return gifts. Go to the post office and mail them back, cheapest rate possible; and forget about it.
Your dh is playing the biggest role in this, and is perpetuating what it is he says he does not want.If he wants things to change, he has to change; meaning he has to quit just telling his mama not to bring him gifts from BIL, and start with the source of same, meaning BIL.
He should say to his mom "thanks for delivering these' and then send them back to his brother unopened, with a note telling him not to send these anymore, and if he has anything to say to him, to say it to him and not try to go through mom.
I dont' know-it's hard to say since I dont know her or DH or FIL. your dh has known them his whole life!!! he should know how to tell them what he's thinking.
It is $100 CAD. 4 kids x 2 gift bags each is a lot. Well, that was Christmas so it would just be $25 for birthday gifts. But still, tossing them out is a better option
He's told BIL to stop sending gifts and to stop sending anything through his parents. BIL ignores us and plays victim with MIL/FIL. Before this they have snuck things in when DH isn't looking and I've delt with it...even though DH should have.
This is the first time DH has been the one to say anything to his parents, usually he just lets them walk all over him/us which is why this is a big deal that he spoke up. I already know this is an issue, it's not news to me. We'd like him to continue of setting boundries with his parents which is why I came here looking for advice.
Next time we will just toss gifts out in front of MIL/FIL.
Thanks for your input, I really appreciate it.
I would not mail them back. I would trash them or drive them to goodwill.
If you don't want to communicate with / aren't speaking to BIL, then even sending the gifts back is a form of communication - it just lets BIL know that if he sends gifts with your ILS, he will get a response from you.
It's like returning the phone call of the guy who is stalking you. The smart move is to delete the message and ignore. Every time.
Are your IL's maybe pretending you accept the gifts and therefor BIL keeps sending them? I just cant fathom these people would continue to send gifts to someone who continuously returns them.
I would make it very simple, #1 next time IL's bring gifts mail them back with a note regardless of the cost (isnt it worth $100 to end this), and bring MIL with you to ship them so she knows this was done AND #2 have DH inform IL's the next time they show up with gifts from BIL they will not be welcome in your home.
And I ship UPS frequently, it shouldnt cost anywhere near $100. $50 at most unless they are huge and heavy gifts.
i agree. if you don't want them, donate them. save them for blue/brown santa at christmas time. i don't know your mil, of course, but it can't be fun for her to be asked to bring these gifts she knows you don't want. it's probably hard for her to refuse to take the gifts since your bil/sil know she's going to your house. at least she can say, yes, i took them the gifts. personally, i think it's your problem, and you shouldn't chew out your mil for bringing gifts she's been asked to bring. especially since you know your bil is a bully and probably wouldn't be at all nice if she refused. it seems kind of like a case of don't kill the messenger. just take them and donate them.
eta: although i understand why you might want to throw the gifts in the trash in front of you inlaws, i think throwing them away is wasteful and slightly petty. instead of mailing back the gifts, donate them to goodwill and mail the donation receipt to your bil.
I really love Sue_Sue's idea, I think that it would only take one time, and would have a great impact. If shipping is really that much, is there a similar option with the same amount of power? Like donating them to a charity that can give you a receipt of what you donated, you can send BIL the detailed receipt, and explain any gift sent will be donated to charity. Or you can send a picture of you donating the gift to something like Toys for Tots. It borders on issues (legal and moral), that I don't know clearly enough to suggest fully, but they are options you could look into if you are unwilling to send them back.
Seems like a good way to spend $100.
I would be willing to eat Roma Noddles for a few days to cover that cost.
If you're too cheap to spend the money to mail them back, donate the gifts and mail the receipt to them, so they can't even say you got a tax deduction for it. But leave your inlaws out of it.
Take nothing from people who behave badly to you.
I think the first time MIL/FIL didn't tell them we refused the gifts. She is pretty sneaky and if not asked a direct question won't tell the whole truth.
The last time BIL/SIL were emailed to tell them the gifts (and the ones before that) were refused and to stop putting MIL/FIL in the middle by sending gifts with them. I hoped that by doing that BIL would question MIL on it and they would both be on the same page and stop. They have also been told in person to not contact us or send presents. If that hasn't stopped it then mailing gifts back won't either and it will just waste my money. I am in Canada, shipping is different here and as I've mailed packages before it would be that much.
Unfortunelty, having to set boundries for my family means demanding respect from MIL/FIL. If they do not respect our wishes ie: no contact with BIL/SIL then they will be asked to take the gifts out of our home.
What I am hoping is that since I emailed BIL/SIL the last time to tell them the gifts (and previous) had been refused that they got the hint. I said in my email that we would be refusing any gifts from them though MIL/FIL and that any letters or gifts mailed would be thrown in the garbage.
Mailing the gifts back would just be a waste of my money. If that email, the face to face and the gifts already being refused didn't work I think all these suggestions would just feed his ego.
It could go on for ever :P
No contact is no contact. They will be thrown out as we said to BIL/SIL/MIL/FIL.
Thanks for your reply.
It would not be cheap, it would be a waste of my money. Plus, chances are it would just fuel him to keep doing it.
At this point it is a respect issue to DH and I. They do not respect that we do not want anything to do with BIL/SIL. By bringing the gifts it's just another jab that they don't respect our choice. Expecially sad is they are in total denial that DD was bullied when they were there when it happened. We are just trying to protect our children from having to grow up how DH did.
My original post was to get suggestions on what to say to MIL/FIL about this. Thank you to those of you who answered that.
My answer would be
'Im sorry youre disappointed, Im disappointed that you are unable to respect the boundaries I have explained to you. In fact until you are able to do so, maybe its best if you dont visit again"
I didnt realize you were in Canada so that totally makes sense. As far as your IL's not respecting your wishes, my MIL is very much like that. Though our situation is very different its still a lack of respect that's the issue. We deal with it by excluding her and not sharing anything with her because we know she will not oblige. We know she will not change so we changed the way we deal with her, we exclude her!!! Its best to inform the IL's before they come next... If you come with gifts from BIL you will not be welcomed in our home so dont put us in the position where we'd have to ask you to leave. And if they show up with gifts, stick with it and dont let them in.
We had issues with DH's parents "triangulating" the relationships... meaning they put themselves in the middle and were trying to relay message back and forth and try to "fix" everything. Really they meddled... and it made things so much worse.
The truth is that your IL's shouldn't be in the middle. It isn't theirs to fix. They shouldn't have had a time with your family ruined because they put themselves in the middle... it is their choice to be there and their choice to escape. And by sending presents with them, your BIL/SIL are playing this game too. But, I am afraid to say that you guys are also playing it by keeping the IL's in the middle by refusing gifts to their faces.
You have to stop playing the game. You MUST skip the IL's and send a message to BIL/SIL somehow that you have cut ties for a reason (don't bother stating it), and you are not interested in gifts, and they should stop sending them with IL's and putting them in the middle of the relationship between the siblings. You will donate to goodwill any further gifts that are sent....write it or tell them....BIL/SIL.
If IL's bring gifts... take them to send back... donate to the poor or unfortunate or whatever you see fit... but you can't expect them to take them back for you and be out of the middle of this battle.
Good luck...this sucks and I hope you all find a way out of this mess.