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Our tech team has launched updates to The Nest today. As a result of these updates, members of the Nest Community will need to change their password in order to continue participating in the community. In addition, The Nest community member's avatars will be replaced with generic default avatars. If you wish to revert to your original avatar, you will need to re-upload it via The Nest.
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Note: This only affects The Nest's community members and will not affect members on The Bump or The Knot.
Our tech team has launched updates to The Nest today. As a result of these updates, members of the Nest Community will need to change their password in order to continue participating in the community. In addition, The Nest community member's avatars will be replaced with generic default avatars. If you wish to revert to your original avatar, you will need to re-upload it via The Nest.
If you have questions about this, please email help@theknot.com.
Thank you.
Note: This only affects The Nest's community members and will not affect members on The Bump or The Knot.
Let's Talk About....
Here's something that will liven up the board. I think it would be fun and interesting for us to read an article and then talk about it, what your opinions are and whether you agree with the article, etc etc
Here's a good one I found on CNN: http://www.cnn.com/2011/US/03/20/pennsylvania.school.testing/index.html?hpt=Sbin
I haven't finished the article yet, but I already have an opinion!
Re: Let's Talk About....
This is a toughie, and I don't think I know enough about the problems in standardized testing to form an educated opinion. Maybe that means I disagree with the ARTICLE itself because it should have provided more information?
I know that my teacher friends are frustrated with all of education revolving around testing, and they feel that they have no individual freedom that our teachers had when we were young. So, if I had to form an opinion with the information I have now, I would say that I think testing does need to be modified to not be the sole determinative factor as to how good a school is, but in the meantime parents probably shouldn't keep their children out of testing rooms and use them as pawns to prove their point.
DISCLAIMER: I reserve the right to change my opinion after hearing what some of you that may know more than me about the subject have to say!
I personally feel that standarized testing is a double edged sword, a catch-22. There are plenty of kids (and adults) that test HORRIBLY on "bubble" tests, but are otherwise extremely bright, and they end up doing better on assignments that use moer creativity. I myself tested very well on standarized testing, but had a lot of friends that were not good at it. It creates a lot of anxiety in some people.
However, I can't really think of any other way to test a school's "effectiveness" without spending a lot more money. The article does state that Obama has allocated $300 million to overhaul the standarized testing protocols which I think is fabulous and hopefully they can find a way to make it better.
In essence, I think standarized testing is a necessary evil, but I think they should find another way to measure a school's success that isn't as rigid as standarized testing is.
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I also am not informed enough on the issue, but it seems to me that there does seem to be more of an emphasis placed on testing and scores now than ever before. I think it'll be a few more years yet before the data can be examined to determine whether this is a good or bad trend for our kids.
What I can say, is that when I was in school, we never really "prepped" per se - I'm sure that whatever was on the tests were included in our curriculum and we were taught that along with other lessons. When spring came, and it was time for tests, I recall our discussing them, but not to the degree that it is done now. It didn't consume our world. And if I don't say so myself, we turned out pretty darned ok!
I agree, Rach, that there seems to be little flexibility in the curriculums these days - preparing for standardized tests seem to take precedence. I'm also not sure if holding out kids is the best option. Not having kids, it's not something I would have ever thought about...but I worry about sending the message to them that they can just "opt out" if they don't like something in life. All things won't turn out to be that way. Also - I'm not that comfortable with the idea of her using "religious" reasons to hold her kids out, when the article doesn't indicate what her faith is, or what the "reason" is. Just MHO!
She said she just used it as an excuse, but she really didn't have a relgious reason. So....she's teaching her kids to lie to get out of things, and I don't like that!
I live in PA and went to school here my entire life. The tests they are talking about are the PSSA's...we had to take them every few years...I think 3rd, 7th & 11th grades? I'm not sure if other states require the students to take them, but I HATED them. It is a full day of testing in math, reading & comprehension and lasts for about a week. When you are in the older grades there are HUGE essay questions that you have to answer. The school always tried to have some fun little treat, but it never helped make the day go any faster.
So in response to your question, I would totally support pulling my child out of standardized testing. It is an exhausting day for the student. The states need to find an easier way to get scores, there has to be a better way!
Edited to add: My teachers always spent several days leading up to the tests to specifically go over the information that would be on the test. Those days were just as awful as the test days because it was information we had already learned and while some teachers made it fun by making Jeoparody games or something out of the info, a lot just gave us practice tests....think SAT prep, but at an elementary/middle/high school level.
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Interesting topic - I do agree that the focus on testing has some disadvantages:
- It "categorizes" students into either good or bad test takers (is that really the mark of a good or bad student?? is it really a reliable and valid measure of what they are learning?)
- It leaves the teacher little freedom to teach the curriculum, instead he or she is forced to "teach the test". Then what skills are the kids really learning? This is especially scary in the beginning grades when they need to learn foundation skills.
I'd be interested to hear from those of you that are teachers, but I think that the reliance on standardized testing has gone too far, and it discourages more than it encourages. I'm not sure what I would have done as a parent though...
On a side note, anyone see the movie "Waiting for Superman"??? Very interesting and very sad...
Ooooo, hot topic! I really do think that standardized tests are important to gauge education around the country. Without these tests, it would be difficult to know how kids in your area compare with the rest of the state or country. If/when I become a parent, I would like to know that my kids are on par with the rest of the country, and if they were not, I'd want to identify the problem early so that they don't fall behind. I guess that was the idea of "no child left behind".
However, even though this program was passed with good intensions, it has NOT been effective and needs drastic remodeling. I remember taking MEAP tests (state-wide Michigan tests) in school, but it is nothing like what kids have to do now. Kids are taking standardized tests WAY more frequently and teachers (at least the ones I know) are feeling pressured to teach for the test so that they don't lose their job or lose funding. We are basically teaching kids how to take meaningless tests, and data show that this is why American kids are falling behind other countries like Finland, which is ranked 1st in primary education and does not have a single standardized test.
Instead, I think standardized tests should be used more as landmarks for the school to make sure their kids are getting a similar education to other kids around the country, but these should be short and broad. I also think that we should not take individual scores too seriously as there is great variability in test-taking abilities, and these do not accurately reflect an individual's education.
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Agreed! I don't think this is acceptable behavior. If parents are concerned, they need to bring it up with their local government, not the school that probably agrees that the tests are not effective.
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We also had these types of tests growing up. I thought we had them like every other year or something like that? Maybe every year. Can't remember. But ours weren't that big of a deal. They were just a test that you took to see what you could comprehend and figure out, rather than study for specific things that would be covered. I didn't mind them, but I was a bright student (ahem, when I tried) and liked this. However, it was really awkward when we got our results because you never wanted to make someone feel bad about how they tested. It was a fun competition though amoung a few of us that wouldn't get our feelings hurt.
I know in Texas they have to pass a standardized test during their senior year before they can graduate. I know it is pretty easy, but Jeff's sister was SUPER stressed about it that year just because what if you are a bad tester. You wouldn't get to graduate? That is stupid.
I think sometimes the schools are putting too much pressure on the teachers to make sure their students pass/do well on these tests instead of focusing on what the students are learning and being taught. Sometimes, though, there are bad teachers. Teachers that are smart, just can't figure out how to relay the information to students (we had one of these in high school), and it might help the school notice something like that and see that it isn't just students complaining for the hell of it.
Like many of you said, it is a double-edged sword. I think it is insane though that some may lose out on some funding if the students don't do well. That sounds like the exact opposite of what you would want to do. If the students are testing poorly as a whole, it might be because they cannot afford quality teachers or textbooks, etc., therefore need maybe some extra funding.
Loving all the discussions here. In MA we have the MCAS which are done I believe in 3rd 5th and 7th grades. Anyone watch the Wire? During one season they focus on Baltimore schools and at one point they force all the teachers to teach nothing but what is on the standarized testing because they need to pass in order to get funding. Obviously there is extra drama added because it's a show, but the underlying messge is clear. Students hate it (I didn't have to take the MCAS because I went to private school, but took something similar) and if I was a teacher then I would hate it too!
I want to see Waiting for Superman SO BAD
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I remember taking these tests growing up too. I hated them with a passion. How do schools in Japan or China test? They seem to be doing better than us so can we take a hint and maybe incorporate some of their tactics?
The article itself was poorly written. And ditto about this lady basically lying to get her kids out of it!
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