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I laid it out on the table last night
Well, I didn't mean for my conversation with H to go the way it did last night, but I guess that's just what needed to happen.
I told him that I am unhappy in our marriage, and that we are on a road that leads to divorce. I've never actually told him that before. I've dropped some "not so subtle" hints, but never actually said "we are headed for a divorce". I guess I've always been too afraid of what he might do. Surprisingly, he didn't do much but yell.
Not so surprisingly, this morning he told me that he loves me and he wants to make me happy. I told him I would like to believe it, but I've heard those words come out of his mouth too many times before with no action and I'm tired of waiting on empty promises.
So, now he has taken it upon himself to get us a babysitter for tomorrow night so that we can go out on a date. He sent me a text earlier that said "I just talked to XXX and they are going to keep (DS) on Saturday night. What do you want to do for our date?"
I don't want to go out on a date and pretend like we are a happy couple! On one hand I'm kind of proud of myself for finding the courage to tell him what I was really feeling, but on the other hand now that he knows he's going to try to manipulate me into changing my mind again. I don't know if I have the energy to deal with that.
Re: I laid it out on the table last night
I wouldn't go.
Not just out of frustration that he hasn't done anything to fix the problems, but out of fear of what he might do to me when we were alone and out of the house where no one would know where we are.
Is there any hope of fixing things? Why not just tell him that you're ready for a divorce at this point and that you both need to see a lawyer?
I understand what you mean, but what do you expect when you tell someone "we are on the road for divorce?" If that's not what your H wants, then he's going to try to make an effort - which is why you got your date night.
If you want a divorce, then I would just file and tell him that's what you want. If you want counseling / anger management for him, etc.....then you should have told him that at the time.
So, after a night out you are just going to magically forget you are married to a pos? One meal and babysitter and you think you are not strong enough to stand up to the manipulation? If that is the case then don't go, buy your own dinner and stay home with your son. You seem to want to believe you don't have the energy to deal with your own life, well do you have the energy to deal with what your child is going to have to live with during his parents marriage?
You found your voice today, use it to say more of the things that need saying to him.
I did tell him that I wanted counseling. But I also told him that I would set foot in a therapy session with him until he did anger management counseling for himself. He refused to do either one and said instead that I should make a list of 5 things that I want him to change and he would work on it.
The conversation included much more than just the "cliff notes" version I posted here, and lasted well into the wee hours of the morning. I think I'm just a little overwhelmed right now, and haven't been sleeping well lately.
The thing is that I don't believe he's really going to make an effort. I believe that he's going to do just enough to make me think that he is making an effort, and then slowly go back to his old ways just like he has a million times before.
I guess I just need to keep that in mind. Who knows, maybe I do just need to relax and enjoy a night out. I will, however, make sure that at least one trusted person knows where we are going. I may even have someone send me a text at some point in the evening to check in.
Road to divorce?
Really?
You need to go back and rephrase....i want a divorce
Then you say, "No deal. If you're not going to counseling then I'm filing for divorce." And then you actually do it.
Seriously, dude, just pull the freaking trigger already.
Yes, maybe I do. But I am not ready to do that yet. I have to make sure that I can do that in a safe environment where our son cannot be used against me. Last night was not that time. However, maybe this weekend while DS is with the baby sitter and I know he is safe.
It just kind of happened. We were having an argument over something relatively insignificant, and I just blurted it out. He looked at me and sneered and said "So, what are you going to do? Leave me?" and I looked at him and said "that's kind of where this is headed, isn't it?" He asked me what the hell I meant by that and I told him that I would not continue to live like this, and it snowballed from there.
But if you say that you're going to leave him if he doesn't go to counseling/whatever, and he refuses to go and you still stay, then of course he's not going to take you seriously.
I get that you want to keep your son safe. I do. But what are you waiting for at this point? Your husband is going to try and use the baby against you no matter what you do or what level of preparation you've achieved.
You said you've talked to a lawyer, right? What did the lawyer say about what happens if you walk out and take your son? What exactly are you waiting for at this point?
Well, go out for dinner, or a walk, or whatever, and tell him what you do want. Away from the kids.
Going out on a date is not going to magically make your problems disappear. And I would seriously be afraid to go anywhere alone with him. Sure, you can tell a trusted person where you will be, but that is not going to stop him from doing something very bad to you if he wants to. Ok, he would be obvious suspect if he did, but really - some abusers are that sick in the head, that they don't care about the consequences of doing something bad and going to jail for it. It's the 'if I can't have you, no one can' mentality.
I?m sorry - I know he is your husband - but I?m going to straight up tell you that based on what you said before, this guy is an a$$hole. Staying with him for any reason, is harmful to your mental health and your physical health. I realize you think you want to try counseling to save your marriage but this guy, again, is an a$$hole. His refusal to go seek any help for his very obvious abusive problem speaks volumes - he will never change. Oh sure, he makes you think he will, but he will never change. You really need to understand this. I had my abuser do the same thing to me. When I DID cut it off with him and move back in with my parents, he would follow me everywhere, including show up at my job. He followed me to work once, and blocked me right before I got to my building - with a handful of roses - begging me to take him back and THEN asking me to marry him. Another time, he hid on my front porch, waiting for me to leave for work in the morning, then after begging me to just listen to him and let him give me a ride to work, stupidly I got into his car, only to have him drive me to his house and I knew right then what was probably going to happen - I remained calm, and once we got to where his house was and I was let out of the car (the passenger side door was broken, otherwise I would have gotten out at a red light and ran), I just bolted down the street screaming for help from anyone who would hear me. He chased me, caught up to me at a bus stop where there were people, grabbed me and punched me in the face like I was a man. No one did a god damn thing. This was when I was still living in Philly (I?m originally from there). The city of Philadelphia is useless when it comes to domestic violence, BUT because he essentially kidnapped me from my parents, who lived in a different township outside of Philly, I was finally able to take him to court and get the order of protection I needed and the bs stopped. Please, please, I am begging you - leave this a$$hole before something bad happens to you because THAT is where your relationship is heading. Take your son, run away, and don't look back, no matter how much he begs or tells you he will change......HE WILL NEVER CHANGE.
I am a long time lurker on this board and I am familiar with your back-and-forth actions with your "plans". Over the years, people have provided you with practical advice, real outcomes, and unconditional support. You received more care and attention from these ladies than your husband EVER provided to you, yet you chose your husband over the people that cared for you! I truly do not understand your mindset, and I am appalled by the silent insult of not bothering to do something to better with your life and applying the advice that has been provided to you!I truly wish you the best, but at this point, it is now your responsibility to take solid action.
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What happened the the plan that he promised to while you were standing on the steps of your home in the pouring rain refusing to re-enter? The one that included professional therapists and group work who would confront him on his BS and hold him accountable to specific steps/changes to be in a healthy relationship? A five point list to "work on" is a pathetic thing.
You were so proud of that plan, so much so that you moved back into your home after fleeing. How far has he gotten on that plan? Is that therapist from that friend still on vacation, or not answering the phone or something like that?
That was you, right?
Seriously.
He has hit you, yes?
I have done extensive volunteering in family courts, and I've never seen a guy who hits his wife get any type of unsupervised visitation with his children, at least not initially, and certainly not where there's a legitimate fear that he'll kidnap or harm said children. Stop using your son as an excuse to avoid doing what you know you need to do.
You're actually afraid to go out on a "date" with your husband alone in case he hurts you and you think you might be, "on the road that leads to divorce."
The reality is you're on the road that leads to serious physical harm and/or death, and the road that teaches your son it's ok to hit your wife.
No matter how scary it might be, you can choose to divorce this man anytime. You are choosing to stay with him, for reasons I simply don't understand.
You might be on to something, since it is the same song and dance with her and either she is amused by the attention or looking for reasons to stay. Before all the truly abused women say it isn't that easy, yes I know this, but she has had over a year to plan and escape.
Look, I get that you want to do anything you can to save your marriage, and while you know you can't live like this, it's almost impossible to face that your marriage is beyond repair. I get it, because I've been there.
I left an abusive man just under a year ago. When I did, he wanted an email (?!) with a list of things he could work on (sound familiar?). I never sent it, because after going back and forth (which it sounds like you're doing) for months, I filed.
It was the hardest thing I've ever had to do, and I was terrified. However, eight months out, I can absolutely tell you it was the best decision I ever made. It won't be easy, and honestly, you'll probably question yourself for a few days. However, I can tell you that you will have something else that you didn't previously have: the promise and hope of a bright future, safe from this man's abuse. That right there is worth every moment of pain and doubt.
That may be easy for you to say....she's had over a year to plan and escape, but some people's mindset, it takes longer than that to actually have the cojones to do it. I understand people's frustration here that have given advice, but really - someone who ever goes through this might handle it differently than someone else going through the same thing and might have an easier time leaving. That's why it's not so cut and dry. Everyone handles stuff differently.
Whether it's made up or not, the fact that we are all here talking about this and giving advice is good. Who knows - there might be a lurker who reads this board and is dealing with a similar situation but are afraid to post, are afraid of what will happen if they leave - maybe they will see this thread, see the advice, and take it for themselves.
I haven't been here in a long time but last time I was you had a plan to leave him. I think that was almost a year ago. If I am correct you had tried counseling and it hadn't worked.
I was in an abusive marriage for almost 3 years so I know that as many 'plans' as you make you will not leave until you are ready. However, my fear is that there will be a situation where you have no other choice but to leave and you won't be ready. It is dangerous for you to let him know that you are even considering divorce. Even if he hasn't physically abused you in some time, leaving (or threatening to leave) becomes the most dangerous time for women that have been in a relationship with abuse.
I've also posted before that counseling does not work with an abuser and that any counselor who is doing couples counseling while there is known abuse is acting unethically and is not reputable. It is downright dangerous for you to sit in a room with a counselor who will try to tell you what you both need to do to work on the issues in your marriage. His abuse of you is not your issue. That's a personal issue, all him. Nothing that you will or won't do will stop his behavior towards you. You own no part in that. Also, anger management counseling does nothing for an abuser as their issue is not that they cannot control their anger, in fact it's quite the contrary. Abusers are in perfect control. They like that their victim is afraid because it allows them to power over.
I think that deep down you know that you need to leave. But I also know that when you've been controlled by someone else for so long sometimes you just want to be in charge of your own life, even if it is to your own detriment...and in this case to the detriment of your child. I understand. And I'm not judging you because I have been there. I am simply asking for you to be safe and have an emergency plan.
You have laid everything on the table time and time again and he doesn't care, because if he did things would have changed by now.
If you need to chat you can pm me or page me on the TIP board...
First of all, SheSaid there is someone who could use your help on the TIP board. It's the post titled "Help!".
Second, aaaaaaaaaahhhhhhh! Hi! How are you?!
Well, dinner was horrific. I wish I hadn't gone. I couldn't even eat my food. The drive home in the snow was worse. But I survived, and have no new physical injuries. Just in case anyone was wondering.
I'll keep this pretty short. It seems like most of you are tired of listening to me say the same thing over and over again, and the rest can't decide whether I'm real or not. I assure, you, I am real (although I don't expect you to believe that). My problems are real, and you have all helped me in various ways over the last year. Maybe next time I post it will be to say something different.
You are all right, I know what I need to do, I just have to do it. I feel like a part of me is dying, and I'm terrified, but I also know its the right thing. Thanks.
It's scary, it's hard, it's sad BUT...
You are smart. You are brave. You can do it!
I promise you once you take the leap you'll wonder why you waited so long.
My very worst day out of the marriage has still been better than my best day in the marriage. I am so sure it will be the same for you. You'll feel so free to live without any fear or anxiety.
My thoughts and prayers are with you and your kiddo!
I believe you. I think the hardest part of what you are going through is getting to the point where you stop second guessing yourself and finally decide that you are 100% totally and completely done. Done with him, done with the marriage, done with taking his scraps of supposed love, done with the hurt feelings, done with the feeling that you are dying inside, done with setting an example for your child that to take abuse from a spouse is okay. Someday, there will be one thing that he will do to make you realize that NOTHING can be worse that staying. Hopefully, that final thing won't be something that ends up with serious injury or death to you or your child.
If you won't leave for yourself, leave for your child.
I'm sorry to have doubted your real situation. I sincerely wish you strength and hope somehow and very soon you get away from him. Please, continue to update and come back whenever you need support. Hope to hear good news. Good luck.
I think it is more terrifying to stay then to go and that is unfortunate.