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F/U to Intro / Porn Addiction?
I wanted to say thank you to everyone to replied to my intro post. Your replies were very helpful and helped me do some serious thinking and have a productive conversation with my H when he got home from ND on Friday.
H gave DD a bath after dinner on Friday while I did dishes and H skated around the issue all evening until I finally told him we needed to talk about it after DD went to bed.
All week I pressed him for an explanation of why he lied to me and he couldn't give me one. I asked him if there was anything I needed to change/work on in his eyes, and he gave me a couple small things, but nothing he said constituted his lying to me. During one of our conversations, he got very defensive and started grasping at straws to blame me for something. He threw the fact that I smoked a cigarette in my face and smoking bothers him and I know it bothers him. This cigarette I smoked was over 2 years ago before we even started TTC DD. So, being he brought this up, he was definitely grasping at straws here.
Anyway, on Friday night when we sat down and talked, we talked about how our communication needed to improve as well as the little things to make each other feel loved. We talked about the fact that we need to start carving out more time for each other. When we decided that I would go back to school, we had agreed that we would only make it through that chunk of time successfully if we actively made time for each other, went on regular date nights, etc. Well, we didn't follow through (both of us 100% to blame), and we became distant as stress kicked in, and our marriage slowly fell apart, until we made it to where we are today. We talked about his porn watching, and why he did it even though he promised me he wouldn't and then lied about it, and he didn't know what to say. He eventually admitted that he thinks he has a serious problem with it and can't help himself. He said that he doesn't even think about it at this point, just click, click, click and there he is watching something. He said that as soon as he's done, he gets really upset with himself for doing it, but can't seem to help himself. He said he knows it hurts me and doesn't want to do it, but he doesn't know how to stop. I asked him if he was ever tempted at home, and he told me that every time he is home alone, he is tempted to watch it, and it takes all the will power he has to refrain. He started crying and said that he really was having a hard time admitting this to himself and to me, and that he's been trying to ignore it, but he really thinks he might be addicted to porn...that he's had an issue with it as a teenager...that he hates that he lied to me about it, and doesn't know what to do now. I told him that I am here for him and will help him get through this, and when he's out of town, etc, he can call me anytime regardless of what time it is, if he is having an issue with it, but I told him he has to be 100% honest with me. I told him that if he lies to me anymore, I am done. I can forgive a lot of mistakes, and I will work through this with him, but I can not tolerate him lying to me. I have enough people in my life that I can't trust, and my husband shouldn't be one of those people. We have our 1st counseling appointment on 4/12, and I told him that I would leave the porn issue alone until then, at which point, he will need to open up more about it. But, in the meantime, we need to continue working on our communication and other issues.
Has anyone ever dealt with porn addiction? I can't talk to any of my friends or family about this b/c my H is very embarrassed, and it's really not something I'm comfortable talking to others IRL about. H made it very clear that he doesn't want to be labeled an addict, or have to go to meetings or anything. I'm fine with that, and I told him I won't look at him any differently b/c of it, and I really want to help him if he wants help. Are there other resources I should be looking at besides counseling? I've dealt with addiction in my family (my dad's side of the family is filled with drug addicts and alcoholics, and my sister has addiction issues), and my H has certainly been displaying tell-tale signs of addiction, but never imagined we'd be dealing with porn addiction.
Any help would be very appreciated? TIA!
Re: F/U to Intro / Porn Addiction?
I find it to be very odd that he didn't think to get help until you called him out for lying.
This. Seems like a convenient excuse that he just now thinks he has an "addiction" to porn... now that you've confronted him. The fact that he tried (lamely) to throw blame at you before pulling this is pretty
This.
Also, why are you two so desperate to put a big bad name to your marital problems? You seem incapable of understanding that marriages ebb and flow or that it takes effort to stay close to someone.
It reminds me of people who are always searching for a medical reason to blame for being overweight instead of focusing on changing their eating habits and activity level.
Click me, click me!
Currently Reading: Don Quixote by Miguel De Cervantes
I agree, and I asked him about that. He said that he has been denying to himself that it's a problem and never saw it as that much of a problem, but he feels like he has hit rock bottom and afraid he is going to lose me if things don't change.
At this point, I don't know what to think. I need something from him. Him telling me that he's sorry, and he'll change isn't good enough at this point. I need him to open up and I need to see some commitment from him.
I'm not desperate to put a big bad name on our marital problems. I understand that marriages ebb and flow and ours has definitely ebbed and flowed, but at this point, we need some help because what we're doing on our own isn't quite enough. And, yes, I'm pushing for some answers from him, and trying to make sense of everything, but that's because I feel like we need to pinpoint what's wrong (other than just plain losing some of our connection) in order to work on fixing it.
Yeah and this is exactly what I said. It's far easier for you to believe some outside force has snuck into your marriage and that if you only fix this one named issue, you're marriage will be just fine. It's also easy to pin the blame on something that effects primarily him so you can play the part of the supportive, yet downtrodden wife at the mercy of her H's poor addiction.
He's being a troll and quite frankly, you're getting something out of letting him.
Click me, click me!
I think he is telling you what you want to hear. Rather than address the issue of him blatantly disregarding how watching porn makes you FEEL, he wants to escape blame by claiming its an addiction.
It IS interesting to me that he wants to deny being called an addict or go to meetings. Most addicts don't want to admit they are addicts and without significant pushing they won't attend meetings/therapy.
I would recommend seeing a sex therapist together. If your H wants to pin this on porn addiction (though its not affecting his work or daily living it seems) then he should be properly diagnosed and given resources.
If he is just being a disrespectful doucher who wants to watch porn anyway and just doesn't like getting caught-- then it is what it is.
My issue with this whole thing would be his disregard for your feelings in general. You've explained how it makes you feel, he acknowledges that it is a problem and does it anyway. Essentially, his wants are more important than your feelings. If he truly is an addict then the first step is to admit that he has a problem. My bet is that he is NOT a true porn addict. That he is simply looking for a way out so as to appear powerless.
Get a diagnosis from a trained professional, couples therapy (he will have to discuss the porn issue with that anyway) and get to the bottom of this.
Good luck.
I know that we don't simply have just one issue to deal with. We have a lot to work on...and we are trying to work on it. We are trying to spend more time together and working on "getting to know each other" again to rebuild what we lost over the course of the whole last year. But, the last month of crap with the porn, lying, etc, is the icing on the cake that needs to be taken care of as well. I am personally struggling with the porn and the lying...while I know it's not our only problem, it does need to be dealt with. I know there are a lot of people out there that are totally ok with it, and that's fine, but I'm not and I need for H to respect my feelings and be able to own up to things. I know the porn addiction thing may or may not be right, but I'm still trying to figure these things out while also keeping his feelings in mind. If he's pulling the wool over my eyes on this one, shame on me...but if he really has an issue with it, I want to support him. I'm hoping that counseling will help us figure this out either way. Maybe I'm just crazy...
You've been married for 3years but are just now discovering this "porn addiction" and tendency to lie? Stuff like that doesn't pop up overnight...
There's not going to be a instant fix for any of the issues you're having. Counseling is your best bet.
H: I like to watch porn, I enjoy it, and I've been doing it most of my adult life. It deosnt make me think any less of you or make me desire you any less.
Y: Omg, how can you say that, It hurts me so badly. It makes me feel bad about myself.
or
H: I know I cant control myself, i have an addiction and I dont know what to do.
Y: OK I understand that we can get help and cure you of your addiction, We just have to communicate.
Which one would you choose?
The tendency to lie hasn't ever been an issue...he has never really lied to me like this before. And, as far as the porn, this is the first time that he has blatently disregarded my feelings on it.
The thing is, he didn't out and say, I think I'm addicted to porn. I asked him a lot of questions about it on Friday night, and that's where we ended up.
If he is lying to me about it, and he doesn't have a real issue with porn, I don't really know what the solution is...then I guess I'm stuck with a lying liar of a H. Either way, I guess counseling is going to be the route to go.
Good point. I just don't know what to think about it anymore.
Either I have a husband addicted to porn, or I just plain have a lying liar of a husband...
Sooo.... you came to a conclusion and he jumped on it as an excuse. You were leading the witness.
He wants to have the benefit of claiming addiction ("Its not my fault, I have a disease") but not have to do the work of a real addict (going to meetings/therapy and admitting he has an addiction).
I don't buy his BS. He's just an average ass who wants to watch porn, knows you don't like it, does it anyway and got caught with his pants down and doesn't want to take the spanking.
Yeah, I guess he kind of hopped on it. He did say he would go to counseling with me...our first appointment is on 4/12. And, he promised that he would TRY not to do it anymore...but I'm not sure if that's really worth a whole lot of anything at this point. I hope so though...
Ok, this came out a little wrong. I didn't purposely point him in that direction. I asked him some questions, and he answered them, and then said he thought he had a problem.
You planted the seed and he ran with it. He's just using it as an excuse.
Counseling. Even if it is suuuper embarrassing for him (eye f*ckin roll). Start off with couples, and probably add in personal counseling for yourself. You need to analyze why you're so quick to swallow his horseshit excuse AND allow him to summarily dismiss any and all legit treatments for said excuse. You also need to look at both scenarios with both eyes open. Either he told an even bigger, crazier lie or you're spending the rest of your lives together being a martyr looking out for 'relapses'... and in the former scenario, he told that lie INTENDING you to follow through with the scenario in the latter.
If he is for real a porn addict, it is the same as any other addiction and at minimum he needs to go to a 12-step program. If not rehab.
(I am loling at the idea of porn rehab.)
Thanks! We are definitely starting with couples counseling on April 12th and will go from there. At this point, I don't know what to believe from him anymore. I'm probably too easy to accept whatever BS he throws at me b/c I'm just plain sick of it and want things to work out.
I must say, as not funny as I find this whole F'd up situation, I have to lol at porn rehab too...it just sounds...well, messed up!
I'm going to throw myself out there...
I had a previous issue early on in my marriage where I was the lying liar who lied. And any time H came up with a potential "excuse" for me... I hopped on it like it was John Stamos. But I knew that it wasn't true... I just started the waterworks and told H that he had totally hit the nail on the head and "hellllllp me get better!"
Your H is me in this situation. He KNOWS he doesn't have a porn addiction. He just knows what he can say to make you feel sorry for him instead of you being angry at him.
Currently Reading: Don Quixote by Miguel De Cervantes
What you need to do is put your foot down.
Go to the counseling appointments regularly and often.
Figure out and tell him exactly what you expect from him.
Don't let him try to get out of them or after 3 appointments say "Welp I'm cured! No more therapy!"
Get counseling for yourself as an individual.
Figure out what your deal breaker/line in the sand/last straw is in case he doesn't hold up his end of the bargain and stick to it. If that means leaving his ass, so be it. If not, well then resign yourself to a life of being lied to and resenting him.
So, how did you work things out?
Thank you. I really do appreciate it! I have put my foot down on the lying and told him that if he lies to me again that I am out. I am 100% serious on this one, and it is my breaking point. If he lies to me (and I actually catch him), then I am done, and I will be leaving him because I can not tolerate it. I have also told him that if he continues with the porn behind my back, lying to me, and deliberately disregarding my feelings, he needs to know it will hurt me, and I refuse to continue to live my life hurt and miserable. Either it needs to stop, or I will leave. I haven't put an exact number of times that he needs to watch porn or anything like that before I've had enough and I'm gone. But, I definitely will be sticking to my guns on counseling, and will be working on figuring out my expectations and what exactly my breaking point is so I can lay it out for him.
*I* finally had to come clean (to myself and to him) what my issue was and put the blame squarely on my shoulders instead of trying to make myself out to be the victim.
No progress can be made until the liar finally goes "you know what, I'm being an azzhole".
Currently Reading: Don Quixote by Miguel De Cervantes
See, I've never liked this dichotomy. It always portrays honesty as being dependent on having no consequences for anything ever. If that's what it takes for someone to be honest, then of what value is that honesty? It doesn't imply any related integrity, does it?