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Our tech team has launched updates to The Nest today. As a result of these updates, members of the Nest Community will need to change their password in order to continue participating in the community. In addition, The Nest community member's avatars will be replaced with generic default avatars. If you wish to revert to your original avatar, you will need to re-upload it via The Nest.
If you have questions about this, please email help@theknot.com.
Thank you.
Note: This only affects The Nest's community members and will not affect members on The Bump or The Knot.
Two interesting articles in the New York Times
1. For those of you living in France:
Why French Parents Are Superior (in One Way)
2. For those of you raising your kids bilingual:
In the words of Coffee Talk's Linda Richman: Discuss!
Re: Two interesting articles in the New York Times
Caveat: Not a mom
Okay, now that I got that out of the way, I must say that the French/Food/Kids article was spot-on. Why do kids need special menus at restaurants? Why can't they eat what the parents are eating?
If my kids can "only" eat chicken fingers, hotdogs, and fries I will consider myself a failure as a parent. Seriously.
I appreciate kids' menus when we go out. Obviously mine don't eat hotdogs and chicken nuggets (vegetarians), but it's nice to have child sized portions and things that are a bit plainer than the regular menu items.
We normally end up ordering a bunch of veggie sides and they eat those.
Chronically hilarious - you'll split your stitches!
I wrote a book! Bucket list CHECK!
http://notesfortheirtherapist.blogspot.co.uk
From what I've gathered so far Americans in general have poor eating habits so it's not only a matter of the French being better parents on the food front, rather that their food/eating habits is a form of culture. Consequently their approach, not only of parents towards their kids, is different from here, where there isn't a genuine eating "culture". I don't think the average French makes a conscious decision when it comes to feeding their kids what and when, they do it 'cause that's what they know instinctively. It's the same in Italy.
I don't have children and didn't grow up in France but as far as Italy goes children usually eat what the adults eat (and should use table manners, if I may add) which is also culturally a healthy combination of genuine foods. I think obesity and eating-related problems in the US stem from this lack of traditionally healthy approach to food. The education system is also lacking in this sense so it comes down to each individual parent's effort to introduce health at the table for their own children.
I have to agree with the French food served at the "cantine" is great. I've never parented anywhere else but here, so I can't compare. M's school lunches are amazing, there are always 4 "courses" salad, main meal (meat, fish, pasta, couscous with at least 1 vegetable...) a cheese and then a dessert.
The kids sit at small tables of 4 and have their meal together using cutlery, I find it so cute, they look like old people enjoying each other's company.
For a one-year old, I like when I can order him his own food at restaurants. Mostly because it's easier to get finger foods that aren't as messy. It seems like, off the top of my head, restaurants here have a lot of saucy food that can easily make a big mess.
At home, though, he eats what we eat. He actually eats things I don't eat on the more adventurous side because I want him to try a bigger variety of foods than the things I personally like. He likes everything.
I have to be honest, you could have left that caveat out about not being a mom and I would have been able to tell you are not a mom based on the last paragraph. Way to judge.
You have NO idea how hard it is to have a picky child. None. We fed our son everything we ate from the beginning of his table food eating days. He refuses to eat almost everything - and it is 100% not because we are failures or because we don't try hard enough. It is because he is 4 and that is what happens. Kids are stubborn, they exert their independence and they don't always eat what you want them to. Could I only give him foods I want him to eat? Sure, and then I could watch him whittle away to less than then the 4th% in weight he already is.
On the flip side my daughter, who just turned 1, eats everything we put in front of her. We have done everything the exact same way with her. Go figure.
So the next time you think a parent is a failure for feeding their child chicken fingers, hotdogs or fries please stop for a minute and think it could have less to do with the parenting and everything to do with the child.
Sorry, didn't mean to offend. I'm basing my opinion on my own first-hand experience. The only people I know whose kids ONLY eat junk food are not heathy eaters themselves. Junk food abounds in the home. We don't keep that kind of food in our house. The kids appear to never have developed a taste for "real" food.
Example: Dad's grilling homemade burgers, and the kids are whining because they want McDonald's burgers. Mom goes to McDonald's. And the cycle continues. Obviously, parenthood will test every "truth" that I currently hold dear, but I like to think that my kids would have eaten the homemade burger or gone hungry that night.
And this is in no way related to a kids menu at a restaurant. Even if you are the healthiest eater at home you would never let your child indulge in a hot dog at a restaurant? We would never go out to get our son McDonalds (he, in fact, has never had McDonalds) but if I knew he wouldn't eat the burger because he doesn't like it then maybe I would make him a sausage instead. Or a chicken. You pick your battles, and sometimes food is not a battle worth fighting. I have sat at our kitchen table in tears more times than I can count because my son, who is already super small, refuses to eat. Again. And again. And again. It is the hardest thing I have experienced as a parent with him, hands down.
I find the people who are the quickest to judge about a child's eating habits are absolutely the ones without kids themselves.
OK, this is an eye-opener for me ... I only have one kid (the other one is currently in the last rounds of baking), and she is a champ about eating. We did baby-led weaning with her, and we always thought she was a good eater because of it. And because we don't make a big deal about food. I was just assuming that #2 would be just as easy ... I have a feeling I'm in for a rude awakening as far as a lot of parenting things are concerned. I'll just be in denial about that until then ...
No two kids are the same, in any respect. You learn that quickly when you have two
And that isn't to say your second won't be a good eater, just that it isn't a guarantee simply because your first one is.
My post does relate to restaurants in that these kids are obviously eating the junk off the kids' menu when they do go out. It's not a stretch.
Again, I'm sorry to have offended. It sounds like you really are having a tough time with this and that you've tried and tried. I can't imagine how frustrating this must be for you.
But I'm basing my judgement off of MY own firsthand experiences: to me it seems like the parents who are complaining most about their kids' unhealthy preferences are the same ones who post a picture on FB with the kids in the back seat munching on a jumbo bag of Doritos.
Most of the restaurants we go to have healthy options on the kids menu, vegetables instead of fries, fruit instead of dessert, grilled nuggets instead of fried. Kids menus =/= unhealthy.
And of all my friends who have picky eaters - and they are way more in the norm than friends who have good eaters - none of them feed their kids junk on a regular basis. Unless you are living in their house and watching them eat every single meal you really have no idea if those Doritos are a treat or their normal diet.
Fair enough. I obviously don't study kids menus yet - I'm sure I will one day - but I thought they consisted of chicken fingers and fries, etc. And that's the kind of kids menu I was referring to.
And my point is that this is why you shouldn't be so quick to judge, for many reasons.
Point taken. But to clarify, I wouldn't be judging a healthy meal off the kids menu. That sounds like a great idea.
I was referring more to your being a failure as a parent if your kids eat things like chicken fingers and hot dogs.
butting in, but she said eats 'only' chicken nuggets and hot dogs. And I would feel like a failure if my child would only eat junk food too.
I said if my kids would ONLY that those foods. As in nothing else. I have met kids like this. Their parents don't appear to be trying. Why are Doritos - which have no nutritional value - even in your home if you're dealing with this problem?
But in the end, you're right. I'll only know what I'd do or how I'd feel when I actually have a child. And I'm sure karma will make sure that I get a super picky one.
I didn't read many of the responses or even the article but about the whole failure as a parent thing....I had about 700 "rules" about what I was/wasn't going to do when I had a kid. He was never going to eat fast food, he was never going to sleep in our bed, he was never going to private school, blah blah blah, do this or that or the other.
I laugh at those rules now. Looking back at that me makes me smile. Also, I've learned since having a kid, everyone can parent your kid better than you can.
Sometimes you do what you have to do to get by.
Last week, we had to take Quint to the doctor for some fasting bloodwork (meaning that we gave him a snack at 8PM on Sunday night and he couldn't eat anything until after his blood test at 8AM the next day). After the test, we gave him a snack then we were meeting friends at the zoo. He got so distracted, he didn't eat much but a box of raisins and a bag of gold fish (and a little bit of the food to feed the giraffe but that is kind of gross). By the time we got to lunch, he was in full meltdown status (he wouldn't eat anything I gave him - chicken nuggets, fries, chocolate milk, etc) and I didn't really put two and two together until I realized his blood sugar was probably wacked. I realized after a minute what was going on and dragged him to the counter and got him a milkshake. A few sips in and he was fine but I overhead a group of older women behind me say "I can't believe she gave into that temper tantrum with a milkshake. If my child had acted the way he did, I would have hauled him out of here in about two seconds, not bought him a treat." So in other words, don't judge. You have no idea why the parent chose to do what they are doing at that moment.
Also, about eating what we eat, he does but sometimes I don't want to share and the thought of ordering him a $15-$20 entree that he will eat 1/4 of would suck if my other option was a $5 kid meal. I do have a friend with a 4 year old who will only eat filet mignon steak. At first I didn't believe her then we went to a steak place, without him hearing she ordered a regular steak for him, and when it came he tried it and said it wasn't filet mignon
He ate it anyway but I think that is hilarious a 4 year old knows his steak so well.
i am a child of the 80s. Ronald Reagan told me ketchup packets are a vegetable.
Just to jump in here to defend my own parents - my brother went through a phase (it lasted a few months, I think) in which he would only eat hot dogs and PBJs for lunch and dinner. That was it. Any attempt to get him to eat anything else resulted in temper tantrums and, if my parents finally did get him to eat something else, he had worked himself up so much that he ended up throwing it up. So for those few months, he pretty much lived exclusively from hot dogs and PBJs. I don't think my parents are failures. I think they were dealing with a really difficult child the best they could.
So far, DD is a vacuum cleaner. I hope it continues, but I know it could change as she gets older even though I'm doing my best to introduce her to a wide variety of things.
So I thought of one more thing - my kid mainly eats "kid" food but I home make it all so it isn't super processed or unhealthy. I don't home make hot dogs but I do homemake nuggets, fries, use real cheese and homemade bread for grilled cheese, pancakes, etc.
I really love all of this. I'm not yet a parent, but I can totally see this happening with me. This has already happened in other areas of my life--where I said I would never do x or wanted to do y by a certain age. I think the reality of what it is like make things different.
My dad told me once that he always found kids crying to be so annoying--and that everyone told him 'It will be different when you have your own.' He didn't believe them until he had us, but he said it was knowing the context of the crying that helped him--that there was a reason for it and a way to fix it. You don't know the story about other people's children, just like that crazy lady didn't know the backstory with Quint.
While I'm in no way blameless in the parental judging department (in fact, I judged a parent in a department store today so much that I almost told her she was being a total jerk to her daughter), I think this idea of me not knowing context has helped me be kinder to parents around me. I try to remind myself that I don't know where either the child or parent are coming from, and that until I know that, I don't have any right to judge. And probably when I do know the backstory, I will understand, if not agree all the time.
As I'm sitting here waiting for this baby to make his appearance I of course have a lot of ideas in my head about how we are going to raise him, but the reality is we don't kow what he will be like when he gets here and I'm sure most of my ideas will go out the window!
As of this point I am planning to introduce DS to a wide range of foods including fruits and vegetables and hoping for the most part he will eat what we eat. I obviously can make no guarantees that this plan will work but I hope it does!
I do want to point out that even if he is not a picky eater I would be more likely to let him a have a treat/a bit of junk food when we are out of the house (out to dinner/special occasion). This might be the one time a month the kids gets chicken fingers and fries but no one at that restaurant would know what would they?
Also, I'm just tired of everything always being about Americans. I know plenty of American parents who feed their children healthy, well balanced diets and plenty of non-American parents who do not. This is not only an American issue.
obsession: Your comments about the person making comments at the zoo has me so angry. Like you said, since having a kid it seems everyone can parent my kid better than I can. I get so many comments when I'm out with my son. They often conflict, like, don't you think he's too cold? Don't you think he's too warm? It's been only an hour since the last comment, I haven't changed him and the weather hasn't changed. Then there's the comments about things that really don't matter, like how I had my son wearing a shirt that had a small Christmas-themed area on it and it was spring.
oolalalolo: I love what your dad said.
I'm really not a fan of generalized statements about the horrors of the American lifestyle vs. Europeans. I believe you, that lots of families in Italy make their kids eat what they are eating, but I've also worked with enough European families (Italian, French, Swiss, etc) to know that this isn't always the case, the same as it is in the United States.
I worked for an Italian family (mom and dad were expats working in the Geneva banking industry, both parents were from Rome). Mom and dad ate dinner late, around 9, and the girls ate around 7. I made the girls lunch and dinner, 5 days a week according to their Mom's guidelines. The girls would only eat a combination of pasta, cheese, carrots, tomatoes, a few types of meat and sweets. That's it, and that's all their parents made them eat. I worked for a Swiss family that the parents only made their incredibly picky, underweight daughter eat pasta, pizza, and sweets.
I also worked for a British family, who have been noted to have similar horrible eating styles as Americans. Their girls (ages 1 and 4) ate an incredibly diverse diet, with no prepackaged food or junk food (They had sweets, etc but only things we made).
So I don't think "European" families are always better than American families when it comes to eating habits.
The school I work at does this too, I love it! The kids look so cute when they're eating and talking, it's looks like they are really having a great time, and it gives them a good sense of responsibility. Our lunch program is similar too, the meals are not aimed at children, a typical meal would be something like "filet of salmon with basil cream sauce, rice pilaf with vegetables, and a yogurt". We don't have the cheese like in France (too bad!).
This is an example of something I think is much better than the US, the American public school meal program is lacking (though I've been reading that maybe it is getting better, frclb or obsession do you know anything about this?)
This is something I thought of, too, when reading the article. Friends of ours have a daughter a few months older than ours, and she is just like ours, if not more adventurous about eating.
I think, though, that stereotypes like this wouldn't exist if there weren't a grain of truth to it. I think a lot of Americans are led to believe that kids don't like veggies and fruits, and that they need to be tricked into eating them (there are so many cookbooks out there that cater to exactly this). What concerns me the most is probably the way Americans drink ... soda seems to be really ubiquitous, as well as stuff like Capri Sun, Kool-Aid, etc. When I think about the way my mom fed me as a kid ... wow (mac&cheese out of the box, Dinty Moore out of the can, sugary cereals). Here in Germany, it's not common to give kids soda or other stuff like that to drink. A typical drink for kids, besides water, is apple juice mixed with water. Of course, there are exceptions here, too, just like everywhere else in the world.
But I certainly understand what you're saying, and I get pretty sick of the American bashing that goes on a lot in Europe. My in laws are great examples of this; they called our loaf of bread (a whole-wheat loaf of bread like you'd find in the States; they call it toast bread here) "full of chemicals." But they can suck it.
Ditto this. I can't speak for all "Americans,"but this whole attitude about food was definitely the case in the specific immigrant group within the U.S. in which I grew up. While kids' menus were definitely already available in the 80s when I was a kid, I don't remember my parents or aunts or uncles ever making use of them for me or my cousins. We always ate whatever the adults were eating, but in smaller portions.
In France specifically, I will say that most places are accomodating enough to let me order a half portion for DD of something, but this was also the case at ethnic restaurants in NYC. Our favorite Colombian, Thai and Indian restaurants in NYC don't even offer hot dogs and chicken fingers. Not all "American" kids live on a diet exclusively made of processed crap.