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Religious Confusion
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&v=A95sytb4dgg&NR=1
I am copying this link from Cat's post and I am going to continue with it.
Let me be clear: This is not a discussion about Islam and Christianity.
Everyone reading should answer this question for herself: When I speak of my religious beliefs, or non-beliefs, to others, I am prone to confusing them with other worldviews. Yes or no?
It is possible Obama had the word "Muslim" on his mind for whatever reason (maybe he wanted to mention something about it), and it popped out like how any of us suddenly mispeaks.
However, people of faith, who identify themselves as a participant of any of the world's religions, do not suddenly, accidentally call themselves by another name.
I am not going to accidentally call myself an "Atheist" when I am "Jewish," or, "Hindu" when I am "Buddist" or "Muslim" when I am "Christian." It just des not happen.
The issue is not whether or not Obama is a Muslim (for me, at least) it's that if he is indeed an adhereant to this Islamic faith, which it appears in this video that he is, then he lied in the 2008 campaign over and over again about an aspect of his life (refering to having a Christian faith). And, in office he continued that lie by attending Christian church.
Either you are something or you are not. You don't get it confused with something else, especially something as serious and personal as faith. And, Obama is always sure of himself. He is confident. A great speaker. Eloquent. People on this board have said so themselves. People like Obama, do not make mistakes like this unless he was speaking truthfully and the truth popped out.
All politicians stretch the truth and statistics are skewable. Some tell bold-faced lies. But, if this is indeed a lie about faith (and, it seems to be), it cuts to a deeper point than just job records, experience, ect.. Religion, or lack of it, is a fundamental characteristic of a person. Lying about it is highly, highly deceitful.
Re: Religious Confusion
I mean, really? Really? If he were Muslim, don't you think someone would have been able to prove it by now?
This whole argument is ridiculous. People like you are ridiculous.
No, that's different. Somehow. For some reason.
I conceeded that he could have misspoke in the OP within the first few sentences. And, he could have.
However, it is unlikely regarding a topic as deep and personal as one's faith.
In the very least, we can examine this as interesting and keep it in mind as a reference point.
And, I'm not sure when it became "ridiculous," to listen to the POTUS, pay attention, and question his words and actions. Most people would call this being an involved, educated citizen.
I do not take anyone or anything at face value. I'm going to watch and listen and I am going to remember what has been said or done before.
What I have said in my OP has merit. I am sticking to it. Thanks for your discussion point.
Who cares what he said --- he sat in Jeremiah Wright's "church" for years listening to hate speech. It makes me laugh how liberals completely ignore this. The man sat there and listened to hate speech on homosexuality and you think he didn't think the same thing?If someone in my church said all sorts of crazy like that on Sunday morning I definitely would grab my husband and GTFO--never to return. Not sit there for years on end.
Oh wait, nevermind. They have both " evolved" for the sake of votes.
Politicians like Obama don't make mistakes? Like the time he was exhausted and said there were 40 states? There are so many ways that 10 seconds can be explained away. When I'm talking, my brain moves faster than my mouth and I insert words that would normally go in my next sentence.
This board is freaking ridiculous now.
Clearly, you have not read my posts in their entirety. I made it very specific that I was not commenting on Islam vs. anything else. Also, I made it known that I do not care what his religious position is. I care whether or not he is truthful. And, based on this interview, I thought the conversational exchange odd between him and the interviewer. I also never said any type of conspiracy was going on.
Have you watched the video?
And, to address PPs...we all misspeak. Romney introduced Ryan as the future president as one PP aptly pointed out. And, saying there are 40 instead of 50 states could be passed off as being tired (this is a stretch though...really for the POTUS...this is a stretch). Also, to answer another PP, people do have faith and religious questions and doubts all the time. Those are typically kept close or within family. And, Obama could have questions. Again, I am not being critical of this.
Anyway, people usually do NOT mispeak about their closely held beliefs. They just don't. This isn't about one religion versus another. It is about accepting the possibility that this man we elected may have lied about something that is important to many Americans. He may have lied about something deeper than policy and records.
I do not know why there is a refusal to even consider this point. If everybody is so open minded and tolerant, then where is that in terms of ideas? Perfectly. Valid. Ideas.
Can we pretty pretty please turn this thread into either a discussion of the stupid gaffes made by Dubya as POTUS, or the Sarah Palin conspiracy about not being Trig's bio mother? PLEASE?
Oh wait, those two topics would be ridiculous (because everyone says stupid stuff, though Dubya more than most, arguably) or completely unable to be proven either way.
Huh.
You find more than one stupid such misstatement and maybe we'll talk. In the meantime, I'll sit here and humor the idea that Barack Obama actually thinks there are only 40 states. Or I'll humor the idea that actually he's an atheist and it's all an act. That'll be the day.
Where in my response did I insinuate that I thought you were saying anything about Islam vs. another religion? I was saying that your insinuation that this was anything more than just him misspeaking is ridiculous and feeds into the tea party conspiracy theorist BS that Obama is some closet Muslim. Sucks you can't read for comprehension.
Your argument that people don't misspeak about their closely held beliefs is stupid. I often accidentally refer to my daughter by my dog's name or call the washing machine the dishwasher. These are things I know very well, but the human mind carries a heavy load and it's easy for words to be flipped and confused in your mind.
It's funny how certain people ignore your post completely in this thread.
I don't know anything about Wright. But hold on a second - are you saying that a Christian religious leader was speaking out against homosexuality?? SOUND THE ALARMS! That can't be right. I've never heard something so ridiculous as a Christian being against homosexuality.
Oh wait.
But here we are, with a president who (as you say) was told for years in church that homosexuality was wrong. And then he goes ahead and openly supports marriage equality. So... after years of someone telling him that something was wrong, he was able to formulate rational thought on his own and realize that everyone deserves equal marriage rights, regardless of who they love.
Why don't Republicans have this sort of rational thought?
I think my favorite part of her post is that she's upset that Obama took time getting to a point where he could openly support equal marriage, but - while she's so evolved that she would never have listened to such talk in the first place - she's casting her vote for the party that would prefer to see 'traditional marriage' be protected.
She's looking down on someone for taking an action that she seems to support, while she personally works against it. Strange.
Even if he did sit there and believe the same thing, he's either changed his mind (as most rational adults would believe) or he's some secret gay hater behind it all. If the latter is true, it really doesn't bother me as long as he keeps supporting it publicly, repealing DADT, DOMA, etc.
I'm far more fearful of the things Romney and Ryan publicly admit they want to do with this country than I will ever be of all the supposed behind the scenes, super secret motives conservatives accuses Obama of having. The argument that I should feel otherwise is absolutely laughable.