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Fighting about sex (UPDATED)
Hello all. I am not a regular poster here, but need some advice.
The long story short: DH and I have been together for nearly 6 years, marred for 4. In the early years of our relationship, we had sex nearly every day, sometimes multiple times per day. By the time we got married, we were probably having sex 2-3 times per week.
Then we started TTC. It took us almost 1.5 years and multiple pregnancy losses to get pregnant with our DD. Sex became painful for me during pregnancy and continued to be painful after delivery. We didn't successfully have sex (intercourse) for over a year. We did, however, fight a LOT about sex. Finally, in July 2012, I was diagnosed with vaginismus and began physical therapy and emotional therapy to help me recover. DH also started therapy and we did marriage counseling a few times.
By November 2012 I was able to have sex again, and was released from physical therapy because I was "cured". I also stopped going to individual therapy because we were paying out-of-pocket, it was expensive, and I didn't feel like it was helping me any more.
Since then, DH and I have been having sex 1-2 times per month. Sex is still painful for me at times and requires a lot of mental preparation and relaxation for me to enjoy it even a little. DH wants sex much more frequently than I do, which is leading to continued fighting between us. He obsesses over how much sex we are (not) having, sulks and pouts when more than a week or two passes with no sex, which causes me to feel pressured to "perform" which makes me want sex even less. Don't get me wrong, I want to want to have sex with DH, but with everything that has happened, I just don't want it very often. Plus, at this point in our lives, we have a toddler who still wakes 1-4 times per night (and I am the one getting up with her all night long), I work 2 part-time jobs and stay home with DD the rest of the time, and with all of that, I am flat-out exhausted most of the time. Sex feels like a chore and something I have to do to keep DH happy, instead of something that is carefree and fun like it used to be. DH wants things to go back to the way "we used to be". I think its unrealistic at this point in our lives to expect sex multiple times per week, and just want to find a middle ground where we aren't fighting all the time.
I'm sorry that is so long. I just don't know where to go from here. I have been to various doctors who have told me I've healed normally from delivery, and that medically nothing is wrong. I'm frustrated that this continues to be such an issue for DH and I. I feel like this is just a phase, and that things will continue to improve and this too shall pass, but DH is obviously miserable and our marriage is definitely suffering. He says he would never leave me over this, but I hate living like this, constantly stressing about him being mad at me because I can't/don't have sex enough.
I guess I don't even know what I am asking. Has anyone been through something similar? What did you do to get your sex lives back in sync?
Where do we go from here?
UPDATE: So, we had another terrible, gigantic fight last night. DH refuses to go to marriage counseling because "talking won't fix it". He says this is my problem, and if its not a physical problem then its a mental problem and that he doesn't think going to marriage counseling will help that. I told him if he wants this marriage to work, we need to be doing something. He had no response, and no suggestions. I am beyond upset and frustrated, and feel completely helpless. I don't know what else to do.
Re: Fighting about sex (UPDATED)
BFP 5/9/10. U/S - no heartbeat 6/2/10 (7 weeks). Induced miscarriage 6/7/10.
Chemical pregnancies 12/2/10, 1/3/11, and 2/7/11.
dx: RPL due to poor quality uterine lining; begin progesterone January 2011
BFP 3/10/11. EDD 11/19/11. E arrived 11/15/11!
Loss Blog | Life Blog
BFP 5/9/10. U/S - no heartbeat 6/2/10 (7 weeks). Induced miscarriage 6/7/10.
Chemical pregnancies 12/2/10, 1/3/11, and 2/7/11.
dx: RPL due to poor quality uterine lining; begin progesterone January 2011
BFP 3/10/11. EDD 11/19/11. E arrived 11/15/11!
Loss Blog | Life Blog
Well you have had multiple pregnancy losses and aren't having sex, so if he wants to "fix" things then he needs to go. Find someone you both like and are comfortable seeing. DH and I used a married couple to work through our losses, DH really liked have the advice/perspective of both people.
FWIW I get his frustration, I can't imagine waiting so long for your spouse to go get checked out to see why sex is painful. As you said it is mental and if it started with your pregnancy I wonder how much of it is related to the losses you have experienced. Your fear of loosing your DD could have triggered a physical response that has continued. I think making an effort to continue woking through this shows him that you do want a physical relationship with him and is well worth the money. I would resist blaming having a toddler on your lack of sex, that probably is not going to help your communication. That said he needs to communicate without acting like a baby, sounds like he is frustrated and feeling rejected.
Baby Boy loved for 15 weeks, 5/31/11
Baby Girl loved for 16.5 weeks. 3/1/12
Back to the counselor, immediately.
He needs to also grow up and start realizing that parenthood changes everything.
He obsesses over how much sex we are (not) having, sulks and pouts when more than a week or two passes with no sex, which causes me to feel pressured to "perform" which makes me want sex even less. Don't get me wrong, I want to want to have sex with DH, but with everything that has happened, I just don't want it very often.
His behavior needs to end and end now.
You are also not a blow up doll.
What's wrong with masturbation? What happened -- did his hands drop off when he married you?
Counseling for the both of you -- and I also see a lot of immaturity attached to his problem. I do not think a counselor of any kind can fix that.:(
Everything you said are the same thoughts I have had/expressed to him. Thank you for validating that.
BFP 5/9/10. U/S - no heartbeat 6/2/10 (7 weeks). Induced miscarriage 6/7/10.
Chemical pregnancies 12/2/10, 1/3/11, and 2/7/11.
dx: RPL due to poor quality uterine lining; begin progesterone January 2011
BFP 3/10/11. EDD 11/19/11. E arrived 11/15/11!
Loss Blog | Life Blog
I didn't elaborate in my original post (since it was getting so long), but I did bring the issue of pain during sex up to my OB multiple times during pregnancy, and at two separate visits prior to finally begging him to refer me to the pelvic floor specialist in July. My OB was a huge douche thorughout the whole ordeal, telling me we just needed to use lube, that it was normal, then blaming it on breastfeeding, then telling me I would just have to suck it up because nothing was physically wrong with me. (And yes, I plan on finding a new OB for the future!) I still don't think he believes anything was wrong. And I am so frustrated it took me seven months (after DD's birth) to be referred to the specialist!
I do think it would be beneficial to talk to someone. I would just have to convince him to go. He is the one who doesn't want to talk. He just wants it to magically be fixed.
BFP 5/9/10. U/S - no heartbeat 6/2/10 (7 weeks). Induced miscarriage 6/7/10.
Chemical pregnancies 12/2/10, 1/3/11, and 2/7/11.
dx: RPL due to poor quality uterine lining; begin progesterone January 2011
BFP 3/10/11. EDD 11/19/11. E arrived 11/15/11!
Loss Blog | Life Blog
Well with that new information, never mind. You should start going without him and ask the specialist for a new OB rec. Toddlers change things but not this much. Sounds like you have a physical issue to work through, plus finding your parenting rhythm and I am guessing grief.
Baby Boy loved for 15 weeks, 5/31/11
Baby Girl loved for 16.5 weeks. 3/1/12
The PPs seem to have the bases covered re: counseling and continuing to explore what might be the cause of your continued anxiety and pain. Also re: your husband needing to stop "pouting" about not having enough sex (because, presumably, he isn't thirteen years old).
I'd like to add another thought to the mix. Along the same lines of the expression "use it or lose it", I have observed that the longer I go without having sex, the more painful it is when I do have sex again. I know a couple of other women who have reported the same thing, and I know that it becomes more common as we get older, and it seems likely that your body's physical exhaustion due to having a one-year-old not sleeping through the night (hang in there, man it sucks, I feel you) would be a factor, too.
If that is a contributing factor in the pain and anxiety you are experiencing, something that might help, as totally un-romantic as it sounds, is scheduled sex. Once a week, no matter how tired you are, or which episode of your favorite TV show is on, etc. Have a glass of wine, light some candles, lube up and go. My friend calls it "smile therapy". If you make yourself do it, you can actually get to a place where you really do want to do it. When you force yourself to smile, smiling releases endorphins, and pretty soon you will be smiling for real.
Also, and not for nothing -- if intercourse is painful, what about manual and oral sex? You guys have to do something to start digging yourselves out of this hole, because you're in a vicious cycle right now, as you pointed out.
Good luck!
Have you tried taking sex off the table? You still make it a point to touch, make out like you use to but without sex. Meaning it is not an option. Take the pressure off and decrease anxiety. If you are feeling it them you can without telling him take matter into your own hands. Just a thought.
I know when we had a sex rut the more DH looked like he wanted sex the less I did. Every time he did anything I thought "He is only doing X because he wants to have sex." I had to sit down and spell it all out for him and he backed off, which lead to less stress and more desire.
Baby Boy loved for 15 weeks, 5/31/11
Baby Girl loved for 16.5 weeks. 3/1/12
I remember you from PGAL
DH and I have had similar issues. I have a lot of pelvic floor pain issues. I also have a disease that feels like I have a UTI except I don't. I have meds and they make me feel better but still in some pain. Sex is often times off the menu.
DH knew about these issues before we got married but they have gotten a lot worse since then. There were times that DH was upset and pouty about not having sex enough. I nicely told him to STFU and get over it. I was also completely honest with him about how his actions made me feel. I told him that when I was unable to have sex because of pain and all he did was complain about not getting sex, that it made me feel like he cared about sex more than me. I told him it made me feel objectified and made me think of him like a selfish child. I told him that even when I felt great that the idea of having sex with someone who was acting the way he was, was a complete turn off. When I put it that way he realized how he was acting and started acting differently. He became more compassionate and I became more willing to "help" him out when I was in too much pain for sex.
A few months ago DH had a vasectomy so he got to experience being in too much pain for sex. I think it was then that he really "got it".
I was thinking the same thing.
TTC since September 2012
I was also thinking about this. What about a BJ?
I know it sounds simple, but it might help things.
When you've been married this long, you need a ticker to remind you.
Baby Boy M - 08/01/2013
I'm going to some what disagree with some of the PP's here who say he should stop pouting and suck it up.
I'm not at all saying that you should suck it up and have sex whenever he wants it since it is painful for you. I'm also not saying that he should make you feel bad about it, which from the sound of your post, it sounds like that's not his intention. However, it is important to recognize that you both have needs. Men naturally have a stronger sex drive than most women. Just as women tend to connect and experience intimacy through sharing experiences/talking, men tend to find intimacy through physical contact with their partner. There's nothing wrong with this, men and women are just wired differently.
You both have needs in this scenario. You need time to heal and find relief from your pain, and he needs to experience intimacy. To blow him off completely as being insensitive is not the right way to go. Even if you tell him nicely to shut up, he might interpret it as you not caring about his needs.
Explain to him how his reactions make you feel. I don't think he'll blow you off, and I think he cares about your feelings. However, as some other PP's have said, offer alternative solutions to penetrative sex. Even if you're tired, it doesn't take much energy to give him oral or a hand job. Try this for a while. If your pain is associated with anxiety, having sex by alternative methods may help you to relax and start getting more in to the mood. Once you feel more in the mood, you may not have so much pain.
BFP 5/9/10. U/S - no heartbeat 6/2/10 (7 weeks). Induced miscarriage 6/7/10.
Chemical pregnancies 12/2/10, 1/3/11, and 2/7/11.
dx: RPL due to poor quality uterine lining; begin progesterone January 2011
BFP 3/10/11. EDD 11/19/11. E arrived 11/15/11!
Loss Blog | Life Blog
Do you have interstitial cystitis? I do & it can be very painful.
If you are still around for suggestions:
Vaginal massage really helps with pain! It turns out down there gets some mad muscle cramps. If it hurts, ask him to be gentler. It will probably hurt a bit as it gets rubbed but then the pain will go away.
Make it clear to your DH that what encourages sex is loving, touching, and relaxation. Tell him the more patient and relaxing he is, the more comforted you'll feel with him. This has turned into a trust issue. Make it clear you can be trusted- share how much you used to love having sex with him, tell him that it won't be fixed tomorrow but with his help, you can both work toward fixing the problem. Show him you have a plan that you both agree on.
BFP 5/9/10. U/S - no heartbeat 6/2/10 (7 weeks). Induced miscarriage 6/7/10.
Chemical pregnancies 12/2/10, 1/3/11, and 2/7/11.
dx: RPL due to poor quality uterine lining; begin progesterone January 2011
BFP 3/10/11. EDD 11/19/11. E arrived 11/15/11!
Loss Blog | Life Blog
Um, well, the way he's responding to "your problem" is encouraging it! It's like he's kicking somebody with a broken leg and expecting them to get better. He needs to learn how to cope and communicate. Why is it so hard for him to realize that you need to work together on fixing this? If you were in physical therapy he would play a supportive role, right? A mental problem involves both of you!
How would he like to have sex if it hurt HIM? This attitude just goes back to the whole "frigid wife" BS stereotypes.
I hope that you are in individual counseling...
I told him both of these things this last night, to no avail. I would like to go back to counseling, but unless I can find someone who is covered by my insurance, we literally cannot afford it. We are already budgeted to the dime, as he is in school and I work part-time/stay home with our daughter (day care costs more than I make per month).
ETA: I have not found any therapists here who accept mine/any private insurance.
BFP 5/9/10. U/S - no heartbeat 6/2/10 (7 weeks). Induced miscarriage 6/7/10.
Chemical pregnancies 12/2/10, 1/3/11, and 2/7/11.
dx: RPL due to poor quality uterine lining; begin progesterone January 2011
BFP 3/10/11. EDD 11/19/11. E arrived 11/15/11!
Loss Blog | Life Blog
UPDATE: So, we had another terrible, gigantic fight last night. DH refuses to go to marriage counseling because "talking won't fix it". He says this is my problem, and if its not a physical problem then its a mental problem and that he doesn't think going to marriage counseling will help that. I told him if he wants this marriage to work, we need to be doing something. He had no response, and no suggestions. I am beyond upset and frustrated, and feel completely helpless. I don't know what else to do.
How clueless and not to mention rotten.
ANY problem that affects you -- or him -- is an OUR PROBLEM. YOu and he are to face it jointly and work on the solution together.
I have no idea how a counselor of any kind can get this guy to grow up: that's not happening. Immaturity on his part is also a big contributing factor here.
If he has refused counseling, it's not likely he's emotionally committed to the marriage anymore.
You've tried just about everything. Maybe it is time for you to file, take the kiddo and move on.
Sorry for your troubles.
I'm going to disagree with the crowd here. It's completely understandable to not want sex frequently if it's hurting you. But you said you stopping physical therapy because it had gotten better...now it only hurts occasionally. It sounds like you don't want to have sex...perhaps out of fear that it will hurt? I'm not sure.
But regardless, marriage is compromise. And just like you want him to understand your feelings and fear, you need to understand his needs. He is trying. He's telling you what his needs are. He could go looking for it somewhere else, but he's not. He's trying to make it work. You need to compromise.
BJs, anal, HJs...be creative. Also, is there any way you can compromise on how often you do it? Maybe even schedule sex...like a PP suggested?
I don't think it's reasonable for you to expect him to just accept that you want sex once a month or less. And I don't think you need counseling. I think you need very basic compromise and communication skills. Save your money, buy a couple of bottles of wine, some lube, and lingerie...and go f*** your husband.
I think you both need to work this out together and not individually. You are both in this battle together and you must fight to win. He needs to be able to help you, he needs to help you remain calm despite all.
Have you tried Dilators? I know that it works for most women. Dilators are of different sizes. You start by inserting the smallest size, after some time, you remove it and then you insert a larger size and so on. I think you should read it up online. But you are not to use it when anxious as anxiety will nit help you to achieve your goal. Then i really think you should use it after some foreplay which will normally put you in the mood, in this case, you might not even feel it when the dilator is being inserted into your vagina.
PLUS in my own opinion, i think your Husband should do the insertion of the Dilators.
Good Luck with it. I really pray it works for you.