Neighbor issue

Disneygeek77 · February 2014

Well I too am a mom and thinking about what I would do if I was in your situation. I know I definitely wouldn't like it if someone called my child fat and a cry baby. However, unless I heard it straight from the horses mouth, I could try to give him a benefit of a doubt. I say this because I know how a parent can say something and a kid take it totally differently. Heck, even adults do the same thing.

My sister had this problem with my nephew. He has a friend that told nephew Santa wasn't real so he asked my sister about it. She said that was't true and Santa is real. Well nephew went back to school and told his friend my sister said he was a liar. Kid went home, told his mom, mom called my sister and chewed her out. My sister tried to explain that she never said that, but the mom wouldn't let it go. Now, my sister probably could have phrased the Santa conversation better, but she has no idea it would have escalated this far. As you can imagine, the kids don't hang out anymore because neither mom wants to deal with the other. But, I suppose this is what happens when you hear things second or third hand through kids.

If it makes you feel better, I struggle with this as well. I mean on one hand, you know you can't always trust what kids say, even DD will tell me things my nephew says and I know she took what he said out of context; but on the other hand, you do want them to feel comfortable talking to you about their feelings and how words can hurt. It is a difficult balance to strike. I also struggle with finding that balance between teaching my kids the difference between standing up for themselves but also knowing when to brush off rude comments because that is a skill even some adults don't have.

As a mom, it is hard to know when you need to step in and say something or just letting your kids handle it on their own especially if you know your child is sensitive. Again, you want them to feel comfortable confiding in you and that you take what they say seriously, but on the other hand eventually they will need to know how handle someone calling them a name or insulting them. Like PPs have mentioned, you also don't want to go too far and be labeled as " that mom " either. Especially when you get your information second or third hand through children.

In your situation, it seems that having a friendship with the neighbor child isn't going to happen. If you feel comfortable taking him to karate because it might be a baby step into them being friends again, then I would do so. Keep your eyes and ears open to see how he treats your child and if you feel this isn't a healthy friendship, then stop.

Tofumonkey · February 2014

Stop assuming you are being ganged up on and bullied. 350 views and not one person has come on to completely agree with you. The few that do post bring a different perspective to yours and you jump all over them. Disneygeek's example of the Santa Claus conversation is probably dead on.

JulienC · February 2014

Thanks Disneygeek77, I agree with you 100%! However the fat comment was true. The neighbor told my husband he did say that but didn't mean it that way. We forgave and the kids continued to play together until the dad decided my kid was a crybaby and then the kid stopped coming over here. We didn't know why and I just assumed he lost interest. I didn't ask the neighbor why, I didn't overreact. I really didn't care. My son did though. I told him there's nothing he can do. On occasion he'd go and knock on his door and he and the kid played inside his house. It was during one of these rare play dates that he told my son his dad didn't want him at their house because he was a crybaby. I know it's REALLY HARD to believe that an adult would tell a kid he's fat and maybe this is partly why some insist I am overreacting (and to some extent I am) but it's true that a grown adult, a Soldier in the Army (who is supposed to live by the Army values with respect being one) did say these things. I don't think many parents would let me get away with calling their kid fat. PLEASE EVERYONE, put yourself in my shoes. If your kid was called fat by your neighbor would you still allow him in his house? Common sense tells me most parents would not. I doubt they'd say anything to their neighbor but I absolutely don't think the majority would trust the guy around their kid. I'm not saying this guy is a jerk to everyone. The neighbor next door sends her kid to play at his house everyday and the adults are very good friends. I've never tried to influence her to dislike him or said anything to her about the incident. She likes them and doesn't have any problems with him so why wouldn't she let her kid play there? But he isn't very nice to my son so as a mother it's my responsibility to protect him. Maybe he senses a weakness in my son but it's not his responsibility to call him out on it. And you know what? My son still wants to play there even though he knows he can't and he clearly understands the kid would tell him no even if he tried. My son was called a crybaby by one of the movers when he was 4 years old. He was outside and the mover heard him crying (can't remember why) and he told him boys don't cry to stop being a crybaby. I didn't say anything although I probably should have. He was also asked if he liked boys by an adult when we went on a bus tour in France because my son said he didn't like girls (what 7 year old wants to tell people who he has a crush on). Can you believe that? Again, I didn't say anything because it didn't seem to faze my son at the time but you better believe some of the other adults said something to him right away including a couple with no kids. I felt like an idiot for not speaking up but I didn't want a confrontation. So you see, I don't think I'm being unreasonable to keep my son away from the neighbor. Maybe on this forum I am but I bet if I asked elsewhere I wouldn't receive all the backlash that I have.

Disneygeek77 · February 2014

Well if a grown man outright told my daughter she was fat and it wasn't something taken out of context, then I would kinda keep an eye out for other bad behavior. If they then said my DD was a crybaby after being hit in the stomach and they didn't want their child to play with mine anymore, I would probably think good riddance and like you tell my kid that sometimes people don't stay friends forever so lets focus on other people we can be friends with.

As far as the rides are concerned, I would do it hesitantly. If the neighbor kid was a jerk too, I would stop. If riding with the neighbor kid only made my child want to be friends again, I would stop. IF my child could understand that giving rides to kids is a nice thing to do, I would continue to do it.

VOR · February 2014

"lalala I can't hear you! You're saying stuff that Idon't want to hear!!!" That's waht I see the OP doing.

JulienC · February 2014

Thankyou Disneygeek77! I think you have put yourself in my shoes and see where I'm coming from! Yes, my son thinks that by me giving the kid a ride it will magically make them become friends but unfortunately a friendship never blossomed. I wish some of the others would be as helpful and considerate of my son's feelings like you have been. Thank you.

Disneygeek77 · February 2014

Well, I think what got people up in arms was the " Do you have kids ? " comment. I can see how that hurt feelings and they are right that this is a public forum and you will get opinions from people with all sorts of backgrounds and experiences. If someone says something you don't agree with, you can simply move on to the next one. Telling someone to stop commenting on a public forum only makes things worse.

And like you said, it is hard to believe that an adult called a child fat, so people might have been trying to see the neighbors point of view or were giving him the benefit of a doubt. I tried to do that too and thought " Well, maybe the neighbor said ' you will get fat if you keep eating like that'." Again, not the best thing to say to a child, but not worth a confrontation either.

R.Wilsonny · February 2014

I don't think anyone here is being inconsiderate of your son's feelings, OP, I think we are just trying to see both sides of the argument as Disneygeek pointed out.

I was going to type more but since you don't seem to want other people's opinions on what is a public forum without attacking their 'credentials', I'm not even going to bother.

Ilumine · February 2014

JulienC said:

Thankyou Disneygeek77! I think you have put yourself in my shoes and see where I'm coming from! Yes, my son thinks that by me giving the kid a ride it will magically make them become friends but unfortunately a friendship never blossomed. I wish some of the others would be as helpful and considerate of my son's feelings like you have been. Thank you.

I want you to know that I have put myself in your shoes. But I ALSO took all of what you initially wrote (remember, you did not post about his "drinking" or other poor attributes), my many years of experience with children and other parents AS a parent (not just an observer) and my experiences as a parent into account when I read and replied to your post.

There are separate issues here, whether YOU think that they are or not.

First was your post about the TWO incidents with the father. Since you have no concrete proof that the father called your son a crybaby (honestly, I believe with almost 100% certainty that the father did not say that, but that this boy pulled whatever comment he could find out of his 9yo ass to justify not having to play with your son anymore) I dismissed it out of hand.

And even if he DID say those words, again you (nor I) do not know the full conversation or context that this father said that. And even if he DID say those words, he DID NOT SAY THEM TO YOUR SON.

A parent can have an "unpleasant" conversation about someone IN the moment and not believe that this moment is sum of a child. Just like an adult can find someone to be "unpleasant" but still be civil or hell, even civil and try to get past it.

That is a part of life that we all go through, in school and in the work place and even on the playground amongst the other moms.

The fact that there was only ONE ACTUAL INCIDENT BETWEEN YOUR SON AND THIS MAN during the entire time your children did interact says a lot about the overall situation.

And thus, on THIS issue, no I do not agree with your view. Not because I do not have kids or am not sympathetic with someone calling my child a name. But because a ONE or even TWO incidents (one totally questionable) does not lead me to think that this man - who again only actually did something in your son's presence ONCE would do something horrid again.

Basically, I could not leap from calling your son fat to being an all over bully. We ALL have bad days and we all say things that we do not mean - even to or in front of other people's kids. That is called being human. And I would like to think that I would be given more than one chance.

As for the second issue at play here - which is the one that is really important and that I DO agree with you on - this kid and your child's friendship or lack there of. It is perfectly clear to me that this other boy does not like your child and does not want to play with him. (the other 4 yo boy has nothing to do with this story and only muddles up the issue). From everything you wrote, he is uninterested or does not like him period (which is probably why he lied to your son, as kids are want to do when put on the spot).

So yes, you should not encourage these two from playing with each other. You need to be honest with your son, especially with the fact that the continual pushing to play is only going to push the kid further away. And you need to make this a learning lesson, that not everyone will like you or needs to like you, but that they need to be polite around you.

Unfortunately, you LOST the moral high ground on that lesson when you told the father that you would not car pool anymore. Bringing the kid to karate is not forcing a friendship, but it is showing BOTH CHILDREN how to be polite, mature and empathetic adults.

I will say this, you are going to need to figure these knee-jerk reactions if you are going to stay in the Army as a spouse. As the wife of an Air Force Chief, learning to interact with people you do not particularly like or that you know may not like you is a must. And it will most definitely trickle down to your son.

I hope that you can take this and really all of our comments and think them over a bit. Because your immediate assumptions that we are either unable to understand or unsympathetic towards a child says a lot about your views of the world. It is sad that you think that everyone is against you, when they are not. And I think that the fact that 90% of us question your views is telling.

Good luck

JulienC · February 2014

You know Illumine, you're right, the kid could have lied to my son and told him his father called him a crybaby because maybe he didn't want to play with my son anymore. It's perfectly clear to me the kid doesn't want to be friends with my son but then he will have to learn a hard lesson that if you're going to treat people disrespectfully there are consequences. If anything I hope that he and his father realize that if they are going to be mean to my son they can't expect me (or anyone else) to willingly go along with doing them any favors. It's a long shot but hey it might make them think about their actions in this scenario.

Illumine, I see your perspective but I don't fully agree with it but I think that's ok because this isn't what these forums are about. I don't necessarily think that because 90% of the people on here don't agree with me that I'm completely in the wrong. Yes, our kids are in the same martial arts class but when I sign my son up for something I'm fully aware that it's MY responsibility to get him there. If there was a chance I couldn't I would either not sign him up or I would ask someone trustworthy to take my son there. I wouldn't allow him to ask anyone and everyone to take him places. The kid bounces back and forth asking me or the neighbor to take him. The neighbor almost always does take him but I noticed last week she didn't, even though she was home. She probably figured I should take him. Her kid isn't in the class so it's very nice that she takes him to the class as well as to school in the morning. But she is good friends with the family, and they let her borrow their car recently to get around when hers broke down. So, they know each other much better than I know either of them. Also, just because the kids mother can't drive doesn't mean she doesn't have any responsibility with getting him places. I walk my son if I can't drive. Just the other day, I walked 2 hours home because I had to drop my car off to get it repaired and my husband wasn't around to give me a ride back home. Sure, I could have asked for a ride but I'm ok with walking and I don't feel comfortable asking anyone for a ride. Don't you think it's odd that the parents allow their kid to get into my car when they don't even talk to me? I don't allow my kid to go with anyone I don't know well.

I am a very reserved person and I choose to keep my distance from people. This is the way I am, the way I have always been, and always will be. Please, people don't try to tell me it's not healthy for me to be this way because this is what works for some people and it works for me. I am also extremely SHY and keep to myself. I don't confront people on a regular basis but if you do something that I deem disrespectful especially towards my son I'll likely say something, although it may not be right away. This incident about my son being called a crybaby happened months ago, in September I think. I let it go then. But to watch my son repeatedly get snubbed between then and now is frustrating. He has tried for the last 5 months to get this kid to play with him. It's not happening and it never will. I find it embarrassing that my son keeps on knocking on their door with no success and it probably has gotten to the point where he is likely a nuisance to them. I'd rather just leave it be and not give the kid a ride because it just gives my son more reason to nag me about going to his house when he knows the kid doesn't really like him.

Illumine, I don't want to offend you but I am a Veteran myself and my husband has had a long Army career. We are not a young inexperienced 21 year old couple, we're adults, and you and I are likely close in age. I already know that there are people who I will like and won't like. I spent 6 years in the Army and let me tell you it isn't fun getting belittled by people especially when you have a reserved personality. There were many times I was mistreated the worst being when I was told by my supervisor that he was embarrassed that everyone in the dental clinic knew I was pregnant. I was 21, my husband and I weren't married yet and I had to listen to him rant because I told one person I was pregnant and somehow it got around and I guess I should have felt ashamed. That was just one incident, there was a lot more that went on. I always kept my mouth shut. Try being a 4ft 9in female in the Army...not fun at all. There are plenty that don't like me because I'm shy and reserved. There's nothing I can do about it because I'm comfortable with myself. I certainly don't confront them and ask them why they dislike me because I realize that's it's likely me who is giving them a negative vibe because that's what people like me do, although we don't even realize it. But you are undermining my ability to make reasonable deductions as you put it. And I am not a helicopter mom. Maybe when it came to this incident I reacted like a bear but many parents would have been offended by the guys comment. Maybe you and the majority of the people on here think it's no big deal what the guy said to my son but judging from what my son told me and how it made him feel I think it was worth addressing. There was never this big confrontation and I didn't force my husband to say anything. It was upsetting to him as it would have been to any other parent and since his job involves disciplining his Soldiers it was only natural for him to respectfully tell the neighbor that his comment was disrespectful. If it makes people feel better I can delete this post since we are just going around and around although I'm not even sure if I can delete it. But, yes Illumine you made me realize that the second comment is likely a lie or got twisted around and that this kid likely only said it because he doesn't like my son. Really why else would you say that to a person's face regardless of who said it. Either way, I'm not forcing a friendship and if this kid really really needed a ride from me, I would still give it to him but I'm not volunteering.

Neighbor issue

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