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Our tech team has launched updates to The Nest today. As a result of these updates, members of the Nest Community will need to change their password in order to continue participating in the community. In addition, The Nest community member's avatars will be replaced with generic default avatars. If you wish to revert to your original avatar, you will need to re-upload it via The Nest.
If you have questions about this, please email help@theknot.com.
Thank you.
Note: This only affects The Nest's community members and will not affect members on The Bump or The Knot.
Re: S/O Religious zealots...poll!
Here are the best stats I was able to find. They are from a survey done in 2009 and track the percentage of people switching between being Protestant, Catholic, unaffiliated, otherwise affiliated, and switching between Protestant faiths. This study showed that 44% of U.S. adults have switched affiliation from that with which they were raised (though 15% were between different Protestant faiths).
http://pewforum.org/Faith-in-Flux.aspx
Just as an FYI, for those who may not know, the Pew Research Center is generally considered a very solid research group with no social agenda (other than a quest for knowledge
)
Was that a big change? I'm just curious.
I don't know why I have this idea, but I was thinking that Catholics pray to Mary instead of Jesus. Do they? I'm just genuinely curious... it was just always the idea that I had, so I can very well be wrong.
One of the biggest misconceptions about catholics is they worship Mary. This is not true. Without writing a book the best way to think of the "Mary situation" is this. When you have a problem in your life as a Christian you might ask your friends to pray for you, right? Same thing with Mary and all the Saints. We merely ask that the Saints intercede for us. Mary is highly regarded in the Catholic church as the mother of our Saviour but not worshipped.
The only other difference that was a big change is going to confession. Those outside the Catholic Church have a misconception that catholics believe one can sin all you want and as long as you confess it's ok. That's not true either. Just as any other Christian, we try to live our lives free from sin but because we are human it happens. Just as other Christians we should confess and repent. Which we do. Except we confess to God in front of a priest who just tells us that God has absolved our sins and gives us a penitence.
Thanks for this simple explanation. Very interesting.
1. If comfortable, please state if you are Christian, atheist, agnostic, or other (I know I'm missing several, for time's sake bear with me) If you aren't comfortable, pass this question: I consider myself a non-demoninational Christian
2. If someone were to try to get you to attend their church in a non-pushy way, what would be your response? I would let them know although I appreciate them thinking of me I am very happy at my church home
3. An employee of a store begins to preach to you. Do you go to her manager, or handle it between you and him/her? I would probably just let the employee know that I would rather not discuss that topic and then be on my way.
4. Do you have the same beliefs as your parents? I do, although I think mine are more lax than theirs.
5. What makes you believe/not believe in God? I grew up in the same church that I still worship in. Through out my teenage years I questioned were or not what I was being taught was the truth. I studied many religions during that time and found out that I do believe what my church was teaching. Through my faith I believe.
6. If you choose to have children or already have them, what will you do if their beliefs are different than yours? We will raise our kids the same religion as we are but I will encourage them to find out what they believe just as my parents encouraged me. If they choose to believe different then I will fully support them because I know that is who they are.
1. If comfortable, please state if you are Christian, atheist, agnostic, or other (I know I'm missing several, for time's sake bear with me) If you aren't comfortable, pass this question: Christian (Baptist to be more specific)
2. If someone were to try to get you to attend their church in a non-pushy way, what would be your response? I would just mention that DH and I finally found a home church and we're very happy there.
3. An employee of a store begins to preach to you. Do you go to her manager, or handle it between you and him/her? I would probably just handle it between us two.
4. Do you have the same beliefs as your parents? My mom was raised Methodist and my dad was raised baptist, neither really attend church. But my parents didn't raise me or my brother in church or really talk to us at all about religion. We both just happened to start going to a baptist church with friends and that's where we became Christians.
5. What makes you believe/not believe in God? I have always thought there was a God. But since the night I was saved, there has never been a doubt in my mind. I remember sitting there with my now-husband and my BFF when I decided to accept Jesus into my life. They told me that everything in my life, from that moment on, would be different. The way I viewed things, praying, reading the bible, talking to friends/family...everything. Honestly, at first, I didn't believe them. But they were right. Every little thing changed. Also, noticing the difference in my life and attitude when I push Jesus to the side and don't go to church and don't pray as much. It amazes how much joy and peace I have when I put Him at the center of my life, compared to how down and stressed I feel when I choose to ignore Him. Those are just some reasons why I know God exists. It's kind of a tough question, since it's a very gray area when you try to explain it to other people.
6. If you choose to have children or already have them, what will you do if their beliefs are different than yours? Honestly, this scares me to death. We will raise our kids in church and we will always teach them about Jesus and everything we believe in. And hopefully, they we can do this in a way that won't push them away. I wouldn't care as much if they chose a different denomination, as long as the basic beliefs were the same. If they chose a different religion, we would definitely support them, but it would honestly break my heart knowing they didn't have the joy that God provides.
Kaylee & Cole 06.14.08
8/6/11 First 5k! OG&E Expo Run 34:47
9/3/11 Brookhaven Run 5k 34:18
9/17/11 Healthy Sooners Fun Run 5k 33:38
10/15/11 Susan G. Komen Race for the Cure 33:31
10/29/11 Monster Dash 5k 32:06 PR!
11/11/11 Veteran's Day Run 11k in Dallas 1:13:15 Instant PR!
1/28/12 Texas Half Marathon 2:38:03 Instant PR!
3/25/12 Earlywine Dash
I didn't ever say that I would close them off from anything. As a child, I learned about different faiths, and I still believed that Christianity made sense. They were actually taught at church. The other faiths weren't portrayed as crazy or wrong, they were just different from what the church believes.
I also don't want to make you think that I'm one of those religious zealots, but I believe in heaven and hell. I believe that one of the ways to get into heaven is to accept Jesus...so I'd really like for my son to join me there after we're both gone.
It's the only choice for me. It's the only choice I'll find correct in my thinking. It doesn't mean that I won't be tolerant or accepting of others, or that I'll teach Bentley to spew hatred and bigotry on those who don't align with his thinking. I think Bentley will regard others' opinions highly, but ultimately will make his own decision. If it is different than mine, I will be upset because it is his salvation we're talking about. (Once again, this is my belief, and I respect if it is not yours).
I think that all parents have areas that they find important for their kids to maintain the same standard of beliefs. Christianity may not be the one that you think is important to make sure they share. But, you may think that charitable giving is of extreme importance to you, and you want your child to share that same belief. If your child grew up, after watching you be so generous and selfless to others, and bought himself extravagant gifts and lived a life of travel and luxury, wouldn't you be shocked that he didn't think that it was also important to give to others? His way of life isn't wrong, but it certainly isn't what you taught him/her...and to me, that would be disappointing.
I am getting long winded, but ultimately I am his parent and I want what's best for him. If he chooses a different path, he will not be shunned...just will always be encouraged by his family to be a Christian and find the peace that comes with having a life centered around God.
Hopefully my answer will make sense, I'm not very good at writing out my feelings/beliefs. I know what I believe, I'm just not good at expressing it.
Anyway, DH and I will raise our children in church, we will teach them what we believe. But we believe that becoming a Christian is something one must decide on his/her own. When I became a Christian, I didn't really know about other religions, but I could feel God calling me (it's a very powerful feeling that's very hard to explain). Christianity made (makes) sense, and that's why I chose it. I wasn't aware of other options, but there's no doubt in my mind that I made the right decision. DH and I will just pray that when/if our children decide to become Christians, they choose to do so because they can feel God's calling. We will try our hardest not to ever pressure them into becoming a Christian, because that is not the way it should be, we will let them decide on their own. If they ask about other religions, we will certainly teach them or let them research about them, but we probably won't be the ones to bring it up.
IMHO (not trying to be rude or offend anyone), but people who don't believe in God/gods don't really have anything to lose if their children decide to be Christian, Buddhist, Muslim, etc. as long as their children aren't hurting anyone, disrespecting anyone, etc. But for a Christian, for your child to choose not to be a Christian or if they choose a different religion (a religion with a different God, I'm not really talking about different denominations) is devistating. That means your child will not experience how wonderful a relationship with God is and that your child will not go to Heaven. Now, I'm not saying that someone who chooses a different religion (or no religion) is going to be some terrible person with no morals, because that's not true, but knowing they will not experience eternal life would be heartbreaking.
Kaylee & Cole 06.14.08
8/6/11 First 5k! OG&E Expo Run 34:47
9/3/11 Brookhaven Run 5k 34:18
9/17/11 Healthy Sooners Fun Run 5k 33:38
10/15/11 Susan G. Komen Race for the Cure 33:31
10/29/11 Monster Dash 5k 32:06 PR!
11/11/11 Veteran's Day Run 11k in Dallas 1:13:15 Instant PR!
1/28/12 Texas Half Marathon 2:38:03 Instant PR!
3/25/12 Earlywine Dash
Can I just say - I'm so proud of how respectful everyone is trying to be with this topic. I think we're running the gamut with beliefs here, and it just makes me happy with how this discussion is going.
Sorry gang, just had to sap for a minute.
As to the first paragraph I quoted, I didn't mean to imply that you in particular (or anyone on this board) would shield your child from other faiths. But that is how a lot of other religious people do raise their children, which just doesn't make sense to me.
As to the second, I guess I think this comparison comes down to whether you think your child must share your faith (or have any faith at all) to be a good person. In your example about charitable giving, I have to say that I think helping others IS part of being a moral person. If my children grow up to be selfish and to value their own lifestyle to the exclusion of giving to those who are less fortunate, I would be disappointed because, honestly, I would feel that they hadn't turned out to be very good people.
My point is that, if you never know about any other religions, you have no way of knowing if your experience is unique or exclusive to the particular religion you happen to be exposed to. How do you know that, had you been born in India or Saudi Arabia instead of here, you wouldn't have felt the same powerful feeling in regard to Vishnu or Allah?
Since I believe those strong feelings came/come from God and God alone, and since I don't believe in any other God/gods/higher powers, I don't believe I would have had those powerful feelings in any other religion, even if I had not been exposed to Christianity first.
Kaylee & Cole 06.14.08
8/6/11 First 5k! OG&E Expo Run 34:47
9/3/11 Brookhaven Run 5k 34:18
9/17/11 Healthy Sooners Fun Run 5k 33:38
10/15/11 Susan G. Komen Race for the Cure 33:31
10/29/11 Monster Dash 5k 32:06 PR!
11/11/11 Veteran's Day Run 11k in Dallas 1:13:15 Instant PR!
1/28/12 Texas Half Marathon 2:38:03 Instant PR!
3/25/12 Earlywine Dash
But "God" is just the idea of a higher power. In your view "God" is the Christian god because that's the one you were told about. The point of my original question as well as my response to you is that it makes no sense to me how someone who hasn't been exposed to the ideas of other gods can know that the god of the culture they are raised in or exposed to is really the one true god (or gods). If there is really one all-powerful god, then why does where you are born and what culture you are raised in factor so heavily into what god(s) you end up worshipping?
I also wanted to mention, since you and BoyMom both mentioned concern about your children going to heaven, that the idea of heaven and hell is another one of the things that actually contributes to my inability to believe in the common conception of God. I absolutely cannot fathom that a supposedly benevolent god would allow unkind people who believe in him to go to heaven while sending good people who can't look past the problems and inconsistencies with religion to hell.
I'm waaaay late to this, but this is one aspect of my life I have given a lot of thought to and I feel like articulating my feelings and joining the discussion.
1. If comfortable, please state if you are Christian, atheist, agnostic, or other (I know I'm missing several, for time's sake bear with me) If you aren't comfortable, pass this question:
I would define myself as agnostic. I do believe in a god/higher power/etc. but I know, and am totally comfortable with, that there are simply things I don't and can't understand about him/her/it.
Elizabeth Gilbert pretty much summed up my feelings on this in the book Eat, Pray, Love. "Culturally, though not theologically, I'm a Christian... I can't swallow that one fixed rule of Christianity insisting that Christ is the only path to God. Strictly speaking, then, I cannot call myself a Christian."
I don't believe ANY particular religion or sect to be right. I do think that those who spew hate or bigotry in the name of god have it horribly, horribly wrong.
2. If someone were to try to get you to attend their church in a non-pushy way, what would be your response?
I would thank them for the invitation and say I wasn't looking for a church.
3. An employee of a store begins to preach to you. Do you go to her manager, or handle it between you and him/her?
I think it depends on where I am and how severe it is. I've worked too many years in retail to let in slide, though.
4. Do you have the same beliefs as your parents?
I was raised Catholic, but very loosely, and my mom was more into it than my dad. They currently don't attend church, but I imagine my mom would still identify Catholic. I'm fairly certain my dad leans towards feeling similar to me, but we have never discussed it.
5. What makes you believe/not believe in God?
This whole "god" thing has been a long-time struggle for me. As I said, I was raised Catholic, but not strictly. I was really into when I was a tween. By the time I was 18 or so, I was toying with atheism, but was scared of that. Then I dated a fairly religious Southern Baptist and attended church with him for 3+ years, considered myself a believer, but never converted. I think some of the hyprocisy I saw in him led me to reject religion after we split. It has taken some years of reading, thinking, etc, to get to where I am now. Trust me, I am the type that likes to know EVERYTHING, and it has taken time for me to be comfortable that I don't. I no longer think of believing or not believing in god in terms of him as a strict fatherly type in a throne in the sky, and that makes believing in something actually easier.
6. If you choose to have children or already have them, what will you do if their beliefs are different than yours?
I think I'm fairly open-minded, so I hope that I would be accepting of the beliefs of my children. Most likely, my hypothetical future children won't be raised with a particular religion. I think it's possible to teach them love and compassion without religion. If they did choose to embrace a particular religious belief, I would want those beliefs to have been well thought out and considered. If my children were to participate in a religion or church that was in any way bigoted or non-inclusive, I would be very disappointed.
6. If you choose to have children or already have them, what will you do if their beliefs are different than yours? B will grow up in a Christian home with loving parents who pray for him and with him, encourage a relationship with God, and take him to church faithfully. I will be very sad if something that is so important to me and his dad does not find importance to him. I will always try to encourage a relationship with God, until the day I die. He is my son, and not a stranger, so I think it's okay to impress the beliefs I feel to be so important on him.
2. If someone were to try to get you to attend their church in a non-pushy way, what would be your response? Depending on the friend and the church, I may be willing to take them up on their offer. Although, I do remember going with to an Evangelical church with my BFF in MS and it scared the crap out of me--since then I've always been a little uneasy about going to churches I'm not familiar with.
3. An employee of a store begins to preach to you. Do you go to her manager, or handle it between you and him/her? I would change the subject and/or tell the employee I wasn't there to discuss religion.
4. Do you have the same beliefs as your parents? No. I was raised Christian by my Christian mom. However, my step-dad is Muslim so once they got married she began to study/take on some of those beliefs (she hasn't and won't convert though).
5. What makes you believe/not believe in God? Faith. I just have faith that God is at work in this world. I take comfort in knowing that, no matter what, I'm not alone and that I'm not in control. 6. If you choose to have children or already have them, what will you do if their beliefs are different than yours? I couldn't articulate my thoughts as well as BoyMom did, so I quoted her. If our child(ren) end up believing differently than I, I will be a little sad, but I will support them.
Replying to this is kind of intimidating, I'm not going to lie, because I don't pretend have an absolute knowledge on any of this. I can really only turn to the Bible...
But. In regards to this--> If there is really one all-powerful god, then why does where you are born and what culture you are raised in factor so heavily into what god(s) you end up worshipping?
28 For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from observing the law.29 Is God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles too? Yes, of Gentiles too,30 since there is only one God, who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through that same faith. - Romans 3
I honestly believe that if you are raised in some remote part of the world where Christianity (or any religion for that matter) has yet to be introduced, you go to heaven. I believe this because in Matthew 5:8 it says that the pure in heart are blessed and will see God.
And in regards to God being a "bad God" because he "allows unkind people who believe in him to go to heaven while sending good people... to hell."
22 This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference,23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,24 and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus. - Romans 3
I think it is the people who deliberately turn from God, who embrace the sin nature they were born into... Those are the folks who go to hell. Christians are called to live perfect lives, because we are made in the image of God, but as you will see below, we all sin and fall short. So yea, even unkind Christians can go to heaven.
That's just what I believe.
I know you don't "know" me very well and we have never met in person, so you can't really attest to the kind of person I am, but I think I am a pretty pure-hearted person. I have not deliberately turned from god, but I have never been able to believe. I have had times in my life where I wanted to, but I just can't reconcile some of the stuff in the Bible or the idea of a god who basically "saves" you (or not) based on whether you follow him blindly with the idea of an omniscient, omni-benevolent god. Do you believe people like me go to hell?
No, I don't think that people like you go to hell.
I'm not about to "d@mn people to hell" though- that's just what I think would happen to me if I wasn't living my life for God. I think, for people like you, who have tried to have faith, God never gives up wanting to have a relationship with you. For people who don't believe in God period, they probably don't believe in Heaven or hell in the first place... and I just don't think anything happens when they die.
It's really difficult to have conversations like these, because I know full well that non-believers read what I am saying and think to themselves, "That poor girl... Hasn't she read Animal Farm?"
Oh well.
I honestly think nothing of the sort. I personally know some amazingly brilliant and well-read people who are believers, not to mention all of the people I don't know personally but whom I "know" as statesmen, philanthropists, philosophers, etc. It's not the path down which my search for truth and meaning in life has taken me, but I still have a lot of respect for other people who are honestly making the same search, whether our paths are the same or not.
If it helps, JLimberg, I don't think that about you either. People that believe in God definitely does not equal naivety in my book, I promise.
Agreed. Everyone has to make a decision how to lead their lives. It is impossible for us all to 100% agree on how we should. Just because we disagree on the existence of a higher power doesn't mean that one is smarter than the other. I respect people's faith; I just don't have it myself.
I really don't know the answer to this question. So I'm not going to try to make up some answer and pretend I know lol. I guess it just comes down to faith. I have learned about other religions and other gods, but to me, the Christian God makes the most sense. (On a side note, I do find it interesting how nearly every single country has at least a small population of some type of Christians https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/fields/2122.html )
Again, I'm not really sure what the answer to this is either. I don't know who will go to Heaven and who will go to hell. I do believe one must have a relationship with Jesus to go to heaven, but I also think there are exceptions, although I don't know what the exceptions are, I think only God can decide. I agree that it is a very hard concept to believe that God would allow evil in our world and allow people to go to hell. That's something that a lot of Christians even struggle with. But I believe God allows sin in our lives because he wants us to choose Him. I don't think He wants us to all be perfect little robots who are programed to do good things and to worship Him. He wants us to want to have a relationship with Him. And for that to happen, that means there are going to be people who choose not to follow Him.
I'm not trying to get all preachy haha, that's just the way I see things.
Kaylee & Cole 06.14.08
8/6/11 First 5k! OG&E Expo Run 34:47
9/3/11 Brookhaven Run 5k 34:18
9/17/11 Healthy Sooners Fun Run 5k 33:38
10/15/11 Susan G. Komen Race for the Cure 33:31
10/29/11 Monster Dash 5k 32:06 PR!
11/11/11 Veteran's Day Run 11k in Dallas 1:13:15 Instant PR!
1/28/12 Texas Half Marathon 2:38:03 Instant PR!
3/25/12 Earlywine Dash
I, too, agree! This whole thread, though 'controversial', is giving me the warm fuzzies.
I didn't think you were at all. I really appreciate your sharing your perspective!