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Please read this thread. Thank you.
Please Read This Story, Thank You
by Linton Weeks
Politeness seems to be falling by the wayside these days, with phrases like "you're welcome" replaced by the more casual "you bet" or "no problem." Good manners were more the norm in 1960, when these kids at a junior theatrical school learned how to curtsy and bow.
Listen to the conversations around you ? colleagues at the office, customers in the coffeehouse line, those who serve you, those you serve, the people you meet each day. "Give me a tall latte." "Hand me that hammer." "Have a good one."
Notice anything missing? The traditional magic words "please" and "thank you" that many people learn as children appear to be disappearing.
Lisa Gache, co-founder of Beverly Hills Manners in Los Angeles, has noticed the gradual vanishing of courteous language. She blames the casualty on the casual. "The slow erosion of the 'magic words' in our everyday vernacular," says Gache, who coaches people to be more civil, "has to do with the predilection toward all things casual in our society today. Casual conversation, casual dress and casual behavior have hijacked practically all areas of life, and I do not think it is doing anyone a service."
Other polite phrases also seem to be falling by the wayside. "You're welcome," for instance. Say "thank you" to someone these days, and instead of hearing "you're welcome," you're more liable to hear: "Sure." "No problem." "You bet." "Enjoy." Or a long list of replies that replace the traditional "you're welcome."
Instead of saying "thank you," people say "got it." Or "have a good one." Or, more often, nothing at all. And in lieu of saying "no, thank you," reactions such as "I'm good" are increasingly common.
"The responses 'have a good one,' 'I'm good' or 'you bet,' do not carry the same sentiment or convey the same conviction as when we are sincerely expressing our gratitude or thanks," Gache says. "They feel less invested, almost as if they are painful to utter under our breath."
Please excuse us for asking the questions: Are we just finding new ways to say old, polite phrases? Are good manners merely morphing? Or are they fading away altogether?
Becoming More Rude
"Simple things that we took for granted as children no longer seem to count," says Gregory E. Smith, a psychiatrist and blogger in Augusta, Ga. Smith says he has noticed a tectonic shift during his 25 years of practicing medicine. "Saying please and thank you, asking permission, offering unsolicited help, and following up on solutions to problems are no longer as important."
He also has observed a drastic change in everyday transactions. "Go through any drive-through at a fast-food restaurant in America. Go through any checkout line in a grocery store. Stand in line at a convenience store. If you are very lucky, the person waiting on you will make eye contact. Maybe they will speak. More likely, they will hand you your drink and bag while looking back over their shoulder, never even acknowledging your personhood much less your status as a customer."
Simple things that we took for granted as children no longer seem to count.
- Gregory E. Smith, psychiatrist
The checkout person "will check you out," Smith says, "all the while being 'checked out' emotionally from the situation. Worst of all, as I experienced in an airport in the last couple of years, a kiosk worker will blandly bag your item, swipe your debit card, hand you your receipt, all while having a conversation on her cellphone. Amazing. Outrageous."
Research backs up Smith's anecdotal observations. In 2011, some 76 percent of people surveyed by Rasmussen Reports said Americans are becoming more rude and less civil.
Margaret Lacey, on the other hand, finds that many people are quite well-mannered in her everyday life. A sophomore at the College of Charleston ? in the South Carolina city that is often cited as one of the most courteous in the country ? Lacey notes that people can be polite without trotting out the traditional niceties.
She describes a typically routine encounter: "At the grocery store cafe down the street, I go get a coffee every morning," Lacey says. "This morning I walked in and they said, 'Good morning, will you have the usual?' I smiled and said, 'Yes, please.' They asked me how my morning had been while making my coffee. On the way out the door they said, 'Enjoy. See you tomorrow.' "
She doesn't expect people to utter the same old same olds.
Timeless Principles, Changing Manners
Neither does etiquette maven Cindy Post Senning, a director of the Emily Post Institute in Burlington, Vt. The institute, dedicated to promoting etiquette and civility, was established more than 60 years ago by Emily Post, who wrote a landmark book on manners, Etiquette, in 1922.
To Senning ? who is Emily Post's great-granddaughter ? etiquette and courtesy encompass two interrelated and essential components: principles and manners. "The principles of respect, consideration and honesty are universal and timeless," she says. But "manners change over time and from culture to culture."
To strengthen relationships, she says, "we need to articulate these principles in all our interactions. It is respectful to make requests rather than demands, to show gratitude and appreciation, to greet others, to give our complete attention, to acknowledge appreciation shown, to acknowledge and show respect for age, standing, importance."
However, when it comes to the actual articulation, she says, "the words we use do change."
For example, Senning says, it is important to show respect for other people by greeting them when you first see them ? in the hallway, at a meeting, on the street. The form of greeting, though, has morphed over time.
"How do you do?" became "Hello, how are you?" which eventually changed into "Hello, how are things?" Or "How's it going?"
As a result of the metamorphosis, Senning says, "today it would sound a little stilted and perhaps even disrespectful if a sarcastic tone is used to say 'How do you do?' "
And what about other popular substitutions, such as "no problem" for "you're welcome"?
Senning says she prefers the latter, "but if the appreciation is expressed in a genuine manner, I do not see its use as a loss of courtesy."
She agrees with Smith, the psychiatrist, and many others that the phrase "you're welcome" has long been the commonly accepted courteous response. But she also acknowledges that the norms ? and the manners and the mores ? may change.
"What won't change," she adds, "is the importance of acknowledging appreciation expressed."
http://www.npr.org/2012/03/09/148295675/please-read-this-story-thank-you
I'm a big please and thank you fan. I've had people (often in the workplace, sometimes just in social life) tell me that I don't "need" to say please or thank you... but, really, is it a "need" thing, or is it merely a nice way to interact, to grease the wheels?
We encourage (but don't necessarily require) the kids use please and thank you. I was super gratified, last night, when we were out and someone at a store gave the girl a freebie, and she said "thank you" without prompting. 
I am the 99%.
Re: Please read this thread. Thank you.
the decline of manners started according to this article when women got the pill... causation (PI).
Above Us Only Sky
One thing that irritated the HELL out of me about my XH is that he never said please and thank you when we were eating out. He never even gave the server a smile. I thought it was kind of rude.
Not why we divorced, but that always stood out.
<a href="http://www.thenest.com/?utm_source=ticker&utm_medium=HTML&utm_campaign=tickers" title="Home D
Exactly. No problem is not rude in many situations. Although I am anti sir and ma'am but the rest I agree with
The informal replacement words don't bother me. They're conveying the same sentiment in a different manner and, to me at least, the sentiment is what counts.
To add my own brag, babyliu says "tank you" every time someone hands her anything. About a week ago she started saying "weecome" when you tell her thank you. Good party manners.
Absolutely as to "please" and "thank you" in our house. I withhold things until the request is made in the proper manner ("May I please have...").
I think I know what you mean about "no problem" versus "you're welcome." If I opt for "YW" rather than "NP" or "no worries," I tend to be rather chipper as I say it, just to lighten it up a bit, if that makes sense. I also tend to say, "happy to help!"
I think this story is poppyc0ck, thank you.
Are people ruder than ever? Maybe, maybe not. But I think the words/phrases used to rephrase please and thank you are employed because we like things to be informal and friendly. I fail to see how saying "no problem" versus saying "you're welcome" means that people are getting ruder. When I say "no problem" when helping patrons at work, I do it to make me and my staff seem friendlier and (perhaps) not so stuffy.
What's rude is not saying *anything* for a situation where please and thank you (or other similar phrases) is expected.
<a href="http://www.thenest.com/?utm_source=ticker&utm_medium=HTML&utm_campaign=tickers" title="Home DThis whole thing was a bit dramatic and over the top. The parts above stood out. Look, someone is doing their job and is probably in a rush and being watched by their manager. I don't really need them to "acknowledge my personhood" neither do I need them to be emotionally checked in to checking out my groceries.
I think manners are important and people should be polite. But I don't think it's so bad that "please" and "thank you" aren't being used all the time.
I had a conversation with a guy from New Zealand once and he was talking about how circular English could be. For instance, at his (Spanish) mother-in-law's house he would say, "Can I get a cup of coffee?" and she would just look at him, knowing what he meant, but making him ask for it. She was waiting for a "I would like a coffee" or "give me a coffee, please."
For me, "can I get a ___" seems nicer and more polite than the more straightforward "give me a ____" and the please at the end doesn't change that. I guess my point is that you can still be polite without using those exact words. Not to say we shouldn't use them, but I don't think it does any good to be stuck on those specific words if times are changing.
To put it more succinctly...I don't think this is a big problem.
Thank yous are overrated.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=swPcFyhDMpk
Snort!
H thinks I'm rude, although I meticulously use my please and thank you, b/c I grew up in an, um, less friendly environment. You just don't engage people. He, otoh, smiles at everyone and gives a cheery hello. Dude, stangers, on the sidewalk, don't talk to them!
I was once teaching a business communication class when a student told me that in his business he has people say "with pleasure" rather than "no problem." His point was that he didn't want them using 2 negatives to express a polite sentiment. That kind of stuck with me, when I'm in a customer service type situation. H uses it, too, once I shared that with him. But I don't see "no problem" as rude.
I don't think the replacement words this article points out are are a bad thing. Saying "no problem" instead of "you're welcome" doesn't bother me, nor does "How's it going" instead of "Hello, how are you". I think overall, today's culture/society has become less formal. That's not a bad thing. I think you can convey the same sentiment in a less formal way. If I'm ordering food, I will usually say something along the lines of "May I please have" or "Can I please have..."
There is a big difference to me between those replacement words and demands, which I do hear. I have had students come in to my office and say to me "Dr. Emily, I'm going to need you to give me the notes from the class I missed." or "Dr. Emily, you have to look at this and tell me where my errors are." Excuse me? I don't "have" to or "need" to do anything. When I order food, I never say "Get me a..." Those types of things, IMO, are extremely rude.
I couldn't stop saying "sir" or "ma'am" even if I wanted to--they're ingrained in me. It always blows me away when I see people in these type of posts say they're insulting.
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I have told MH that if I am ever one of those jackass people that just stops in the middle of a public place and stands in the middle of everyone that is trying to move, he has my full permission to shove me.
I scoffed at how service employees are rude to customers (because when I worked in retail, I had a LOT of people who were rude to me). But then I remembered - they are. Like throwing my change on the counter in front of me? When I worked retail I always made a point to put the bills in someone's hand, then the change on top. I read once that physical transactions like that actually stimulate part of your brain that makes you think the other person cares. Duh! I don't want to have to scoop my nickles up one by one off the counter because you can't be bothered to actually touch my hand. I bathe daily, I promise.
I am guilty of the "no problem" or "yup!" or "anytime!" thing when people say thank you. I've noticed and I want to work on it.
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It does to me, too, and I think that it's because "you're welcome" gets used as code for "you should be thanking me." When I was growing up, the "you're welcome" refrain was used as a reward for when I remembered to say thank you, with an approving emphasis. I hear it used sort of smugly by people, like when you go to the DMV for some BS problem, wait an hour in line, have a surly clerk barely make eye contact with you while they sort out something you should have been able to do on the phone, and when you say thank you, they give you a haughty, deadpan, "You're welcome" like you inconvenienced them.
I often reach for an alternative to YW -- "no problem," "no worries" or "of course," because I don't want it to sound that way when I say it.
But when people walk 4 abreast, hogging the sidewalk, without looking forward, and I know they're on a collision course with me, I often stand my ground and stiffen my shoulder. Hey, not my fault you weren't looking where you were going. The world doesn't actually revolve around you, jackass. I'm not going to jump in the street just to avoid bumping into you.
What was that about people being more rude?
I'd scoff at the article, but something happened a couple of months ago that gives me pause.
Every week my gpa and I go out to lunch at a certain restaurant. We know all the servers at this restaurant, and they all know us. One day we were checking out and one of them going by said, "We're all glad to see you both when you stop in. You're always so nice!" Another one chimed in, "Agreed. A lot of people aren't as pleasant to deal with as you guys are."
Which got me to wondering what we were doing to warrant this behavior. Sometimes our food is wrong and we have to send it back. We say something if the wait is getting too long, etc. Then I wondered if it's because we always say, "Yes please." "No, thank you." etc. during service.
I dunno, it was weird, but it was nice to be told we were nice people. :oD
COMPLETELY AGREE.
If you are in a full parking lot and someone sees you getting into your car, please don't spend 5 minutes on your makeup. For that matter, if you are the one waiting for the parking spot, please don't block traffic for those 5 minutes.
If you share a wall with neighbors, please don't hammer nails into the wall at 1am. Society's dictated "quiet hours" are basically 10 or 11pm - 6 or 7am. Even though I go to bed by 9:30 most nights (because I'm up before 5), I won't be that mad if you are making noise outside, because that's out of the norm. I WILL be a little cranky if you wake me up at 3am because you are singing along to Tina Turner, badly.
If you share a laundry room, please do not leave your laundry in the washer for 2 days. For that matter, please don't strew litter on the floor. (Yes, personal experience.)
Please don't flick cigarette butts out your window at my car. First, I don't want it to land on my car. Second, our storm drains lead to the ocean, and eventually, the huge garbage pile in the pacific.
I think my biggest failure as a parent, eventually, would be if my children were super self-involved. I could live with most other things.
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This post is so funny. On F&B there is a post with the title "Find me some nude flats". It irked the hell out of me. Like, can you ask? Not command. The board isn't a damn search engine.
I think working in service related businesses, I've tried to stay genuinely polite to people. Especially at my PT job. I try to go above the "Have a nice day" to relate to something with the customer. "Enjoy the weather" "I hope breakfast is amazing (when they buy some cookware or a spatula or dishes)".
I pay attention to people's voice inflections as well. It's funny to me that people's voices in retail go like a few octaves higher when greeting a customer. They could be talking in a completely normal voice to their co-worker, then all chirpy "Hello there!"
We were taught to say please and thank you. I slip up often enough, but still try to make them regular parts of my vocab.
Zuma Zoom
Looking your superior directly in the eye is also rude in Japan, IIRC. But trust me, most of these people aren't Japanese.
Also, I hate to say it, but in my home town, people usually WERE pretty nice when I worked in retail. It's only in Los Angeles that I noticed that people were consistantly rude.
I will also brag that when someone asks, "Hi, how are you today?" I will say, "Fine, thanks, how are you?" They will usually then respond. I don't think people ask most cashiers that. Even my husband, when they say, "Have a good day!" says, "We will!" WTF is that? My parents always said, "Thank you, you too!" or something similar.
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Manners and responsibility are things that I'm really focusing on with Bean. Colors, numbers, letters, etc. can be learned from a billion different sources, but manners aren't curricular. I just think that it's part of my responsibility as a parent to teach him how to pick up after himself, take care of himself, and express concern for others.
Please, thank you, and you're welcome are big in our house. Bigger with me than with my husband (Southern vs. Midwest upbringings). But I'm also working on making sure that Bean says hello/hi/good morning and bye-bye/ ni-night as well. I think that recognizing another person with a greeting and farewell is polite and a good thing to do, and it also reminds Bean that he is not the center of the universe, that there are other people, and he MUST recognize them, as well as speak when spoken to. We're working on ma'am and sir, also, but he mostly adds Mama, Daddy, or Nanny (my mom) to the ends of answers, which we're okay with.
Volenti, you hit the nail on the head. I say "no problem" to make sure that the person I'm responding to knows that I mean it.
I bet the person that wrote this article uses "You're welcome" in the a$$hole manner you mentioned.
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Oh, and here's my anecdote that I shared on MM. Please/thank you don't make something polite.
A couple weeks ago we were out with a group for drinks/live music and eventually dinner. One guy brought his kid, about 8-10 years old (side-eye to that in the first place). My friend's meal arrived, with waffle fries. Kid asks her for one. She has never met this kid before.
Dad overhears. He reminds the kid, how do you ask? Kid: Can I have some, please. He then proceeds to scoop up a shitton of ketchup. Dad reminds the kid to say thank you.
My friend sat there with a huge WTF look on her face the whole time. I burst out with inappropriately loud laughter.
I may have gently pushed aside someone in the subway stairwell the other day who would not move and was talking with a friend who was also blocking it - after I said, "excuse me" and she still didn't move.
I love when a couple is holding hands and they won't move to single file for the 10 seconds it takes to pass someone on the sidewalk. Come on. My H and I will walk single file, YOU walk single file, then all of us can fit on the sidewalk.
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