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In support of 2bBush!!
Sasha, I think your letter to Dr Laura was beautiful. You are very fortunate to be able to stay at home and I am glad you are doing so. I wish more moms had the desire and ability. I understand that not everyone can be home and I wish everyone that wanted to could.I also am a stay at home wife/mother and I think it is a very important job.
I am very sorry that so many people did not read your letter as it was intended. I read it as a love letter to your husband and daughter. Thank you very much for sharing it and having the courage to stand up for us stay at home wife/moms.
To those that put her down, step back and re-read it. You were offended by one or two lines but if you skip those, you must admit the rest was a wonderful description of a mom loving her daughter.
Re: In support of 2bBush!!
My internet is running slower than a snail and the fact that I've sat here long enough to let it open tells you that I feel pretty strongly about this subject.
I don't think anyone will argue that she loves her daughter and that yes, the experiences she talks about are out of true love for her family. However, it's easy to say just skip over those few lines .... the problem with that is those few lines are pretty central to her entire letter. Without those few lines I don't think anyone would have been offended by her statements. It is those few lines that have everyone in an uproar. It is those few lines that take it from "wow, she really enjoys staying home and being a mom" and "she's having such a great experience being home" and "good for her for giving up a job that wasn't as rewarding to her as being a mom" and taking it to "what a self righteous person who is slamming working moms."
Parenting is not an easy job whether you stay home or you don't. I don't think any of the moms on here would say that being a stay at home mom isn't a full time job or that it's easy. At the same time, some of them enjoy working (and are better moms because they do) and yes, there are probably some that wish they could stay home instead of going to a job that doesn't make them happy.
The point is, those few lines were put in her letter. They are very charcteristic of Dr. Laura's beliefs. Funny to me that Dr.Laura is a working woman who is essentially saying women should focus more on their families and less on their work ... wonder if she takes her own advice (although I do admit to listening and knowing very little about her).
It's easy to say "just ignore those few lines" but at the end of the day, those one or two lines are central to the letter and are exactly what offended everyone and, in my personal opinion, were put in there (and posted on here) to do exactly that, offend. She could have simply written the letter recounting her experiences with smashed banana and licking walls without stating that working moms should rethink their choices.
Funny - when the original post went up, I wondered when Nikolleta was going to jump on in defense of it. And when I say defend, I mean project a similarly condescending tone.
Please just stop with the sanctimonious crap. A love letter to your family is one that expresses love - it does not denigrate others for their perfectly fantastic and reasonable choices.
Who made you the motherhood police? And why do you think you are a better mother than anyone else because you SAH? Your superior attitude has been pretty evident in your posts for a while, BTW.
I particularly love your line about wishing more mothers had the desire and the ability to SAH. Condescend much? What a load of crap.
And if you are happy with your choice to SAH, why on earth do you feel that some random poster has the "the courage to stand up" for you?
Last - is this honestly how you are raising your daughter? With these beliefs? Because if you are - forget SAH vs. Working. Your daughter has a much bigger problems to deal with.
WOW, Alisa. What did I ever do to offend you? You were waiting for me in particular to respond? I am not sure how I caused this much anger from you. I never had a negative opinion about you and I am very surprised and hurt that you seem to have so much negativity towards me.
I liked her letter to her daughter. I think those couple of lines brought the letter down and I suggested skipping those. I think it would be nice if everyone who wanted to stay home could. I think it would be nice if more people wanted to as it is something I enjoy. I think it would be nice if more people liked ER so that the series would not have ended. I think it would be nice if more people liked mint n chip ice cream so we could go eat it together. Stop reading into everything to fuel some sort of fire you have going.
I NEVER stated I was a better mom or put down working moms. Please don't put words in my mouth.
Kali, thank you for your response that was not screaming at me. Your point is taken and was well explained. I can see where those two lines would offend and I assume/ hope 2bBush wishes she had reworded them. It just seemed that 2bBush was getting beaten on pretty hard about those 2 lines and nothing else was being said at all about the rest of the letter.
First off, I never get angry about any posts on the Nest. Life is way too short. If anyone on here is actually getting angry, they need to get off the Nest.
Second, your professed astonishment and sadness is negated by the obvious condescension in your previous post.
people were offended by "just those one or two lines" because those lines WERE OFFENSIVE. ?and anyone who knows me is fully aware that it takes quite a lot to piss me off.
look, i'm a SAHM too. ?i love it. ?but it's certainly not for everyone. ?i'm also a former working mom who HAD to work. ?the part she wrote about how "no one HAS to go back to work" was completely, totally, 100% ass backwards. ?especially in this economy, where everyone is affected one way or another, that was just thoughtless and insensitive.
i stand by what i said before - if that letter could offend someone as sweet and forgiving as mia, it was most definitely deserving of the wrath it received.?
"I wish more moms had the desire and ability." This offended me. After Natalie was born, I thought..sure, now I have two under two and I'd like to try to be a SAHM...DESIRE (check).
I gave it 5 months before I discovered that I was stressed that I: 1) could not contribute financially, when at one time, I made more than 50% of our combined income, 2) wanted to live for more than making sure we had enough toilet paper in the house, and 3) because I felt valued when I could carry on lengthy discussions about depreciation and income tax projections. Does this mean I am money hungry, too egotistic to worry about household paper goods, or rolling in self-justification in the corporate world? (wow where did this come from?)
I also sought out medical help for post-partum depression. Not only for the above but also having to come to terms that I couldn't be a SAHM. That maybe I would be better as a work at the office mom.
ABILITY? I guess according to some standards, I can NOT check this off the list...hence, I am not worthy.
Just my 2-cents. Thank you for reading.
Whether it was one word, two sentences, or the entire letter that offended people, it's sort of up to to each person to decide if they are going to be able to move on past the offensive parts and read the rest of the letter without judgement. So, telling us to re-read the letter and omit those two sentences is offensive in itself.
Those two sentences offended me to the point that I could not read anymore of her letter with a level head. Her letter, as described by you as a "wonderful description of a mom loving her daughter", could have been written in a variety of ways that didn't condescend working mothers. And certainly, what kind of reaction could she have expected by posting that letter to a board full of moms, both working and not? It was just plain asinine.
And to say "I wish more moms had the desire and ability" to stay home is also offensive. Get off your high horses ladies...what works for you doesn't necessarily work for others...so stop judging.
I am going to respond even though I have a feeling that I shouldn't.
I was not offended by her letter...to be honest, I read it and was kind of bored by it. Maybe I didn't get what she was trying to say or maybe I am just ignorant or dumb. I think it was her opinion, which like others on here is just that. Her opinion. Nothing more, nothing less.
When I was working, I was making good money, we ate out almost ever night and went on vacation-something that I have not done in 2+ years. I could buy what I wanted when I wanted it. It is a scarafice Matt and I both made. He picks up the slack by working a ton of hours and there are days when I am so fed up with being stuck at home eating minced meat and rice....but that is my choice and what I decided was important to me.
I would/could never EVER think someone was wrong by choosing to work, weather it is because of need or want. I know many, many moms who are amazing who go to work every day to help support their family and I know many amazing moms who stay home with their children. Staying home is not for everyone.....just like working is not for everyone.
okay, i can't even believe that i missed the fact that YOU made this statement, and just assumed that it was part of the original cracksmoking letter that was posted. ?unbelievable.
i'm with mindy. ?how on earth did either of you think that such statements, posted on a board full of both SAHMs and working moms, would go over swimmingly? ?it may have been a "love letter," but it was also quite a btchslap for damn near anyone else who isn't your husband and kid.?
do NOT lump those of us who stay at home and don't talk down to working moms in with the likes of this nonsense. ?
People may take things out of context easily, but in this case the words came straight from her and there is no correcting or erasing that.
I do not have children, but can honestly say all of the ladies on here SAHM or Working mom have the same amount of love and devotion to their children.
She also knew the risks of posting on the nest and if she for a minute thought that someone was not going to disagree with her letter, then maybe she should have not posted it.
Maybe the thought of " I LOVE BEING A STAY AT HOME MOM" should be your last post. This is essentially what you keep trying to explain , but it seems you keep putting your foot in your mouth trying to justify why you made your choices. Each time by the way, has just re-offended those of us on the board.
I am soooo not judging anyone and I am sorry if it read that way. It is the complete opposite of what I meant. It sucks when what you write gets taken the wrong way. You try to clarify and people keep jumping on you.
This is as plain and clear as I can make it.
Some moms have to work.
Some moms don't have to work but do because they want to.
Some moms have to stay home. (cost of childcare does not = their income)
Some moms want to stay home.
All of these moms have one very important thing in common. They love their babies and children and are doing what they feel is best for their babies, partners and families. I respect them all. If they write about enjoying an aspect of motherhood, I applaud them. The point is to enjoy and cherish every moment we have with our little ones.
Speaking to you specifically, because Sasha isn't even here anymore, it appears.
What upset me about your post was the "wishing more moms had the desire and ability" to stay home. Why should that matter to you? Just because I (using myself only in this example) don't have the desire to stay home with Gavin each day shouldn't matter to you, or anyone else. It doesn't make me any less or better of a mom, either. It makes me a mom, just like you.
So, it feels like you are judging when you make comments like that, when it really shouldn't make any difference to you. Just like it shouldn't matter to you that I never liked ER and I don't like mint chocolate chip ice cream.
nickoletta, thanks for your support. I'm sorry you bore the brunt of criticism for my letter. I don't want to continue to add fuel to the fire, but I do feel very strongly about the subject of staying home with my baby. I feel very strongly that mothers should want to stay home with their children and be their primary caregivers during the day. A day care provider can provide excellent care for children -they can be fond of or be very attached to your kids, but they will never, NEVER love your child the way you do. It's a simple as that.
And yes, I do believe that no mom "has to" go back to work. I know moms who "want to" go back, but say that they "have to." That's fine --I don't expect anyone to suddenly stop enjoying her job because she has a baby. I enjoyed my job tremendously, I enjoyed my byline, the recognition I got --and yes, it was terribly "fulfilling." I wanted to go back and work from home, but I didn't "have to". And now that's I've quit, I'm perfectly happy with identity as "just mom" and it's also terribly fulfilling. But if that isn't your choice, so be it --I don't have to agree. And to argue the financial "have to": I have friends who went back to work because their husbands couldn't be good men and assume the responsibility of providing for their families --even when these moms desperately wanted to stay home-- and so mom arranged for family to watch the kids while she went back to help provide financially. And no, I don't consider that "having to" go back to work.
Besides, my letter was not intended as a direct criticism of working mothers. It was, as the post was titled, intended for SAHM and fans of Dr. Laura. Many SAHMs don't feel as though they recieve the kind of support that working moms do; working moms are patted on the back and SAHMs are made to feel like traitors to the women's movement. My letter was for like-minded moms. Many of you may not like Dr. Laura, nor agree with her, but I happen to respect and admire her very much. I admire that she put her career to the side when she raised her son, and pursued it in the evenings, when her husband -his father- was home to care for him. I admire that she consistently puts children's interests first. I posted the link to my letter because I was honored that a nationally-syndicated radio host and best-selling author chose to post my letter on her site (and read it on the air, I later learned) so that the MILLIONS of like-minded moms in her audience could read and hear it.
There is no appeasing everyone, and I didn't intend to offend anyone, but I'm not apologizing for posting something I feel so very strongly about.
The saddest thing about Sascha's last post is that she is right - there ARE millions of women just as stupid as she is.
I would hope that your friends' husbands are BETTER men than you think. After all, these men are your friends too, right?
It is interesting that you judge them for their families' decisions to have two working parents...so much so to state whether or not they are good versus bad. Do you pity them? Do they in return pity you?
Holy hell, are we in 1950 or 2009???
I have friends who went back to work because their husbands couldn't be good men and assume the responsibility of providing for their families
Really??? REALLY??? Couldn't be good men??? I'm so floored by that statement I don't know where to go!
I happened to go to college, get a degree and now run my own business. Why?? Why?? Because I *WANT* to! I didn't ever want to have to rely on someone else to pay my bills. Ever. Not single. Not married. Ever. Now that I am married and my husband has his own business I still love my work.
I am one of those "care providers" you talked about. I have over 60 children in my care. I do love them, however I will agree with you on one point. In 99% of cases we don't love them as if they are our own. I sure hope no one loves a child more than their own parent. However, that doesn't make a parent bad just because they work. I have plenty of parents that would royally screw up their kids if they were with them 24/7. Just trust me on that one. They are better parents because they work outside the home.
What I do find interesting in this whole thing is where is Dad?? It's ok for dad to miss out on these crucial moments? It's ok for him to go to work and have to come home and hear his wife tell him about all the glorious things his child did that day? How is that fair? Why does it get to be mom that stays home and not dad? I know an equal number of men who are more caring, loving and nurturing than mom. So in those cases should Dad stay home?
Seriously, wake up!! This is 2009! Our mothers and our grandmothers and great grandmothers, etc worked hard for us to get to where we are today ... and you know what, we still have work to do! It wasn't too many years ago that women couldn't vote. Birthcontrol wasn't really an option. Should we take all of our rights, our freedom, our choices away and just go back to the way it was ... women get married, have babies, rely on their husbands and never have a say? I realize you might think that's a stretch, but it's not!
I'm happy you like spending time with your child and you enjoy being a mother. I would be more upset if you didn't. However, I think you need to go back into your hole and realize that every person in this world, whether man or woman, has to make choices and sacrafices for themselves and their families. YOU are not one to judge that (and that's exactly what you're doing here). Not every man can have a job that will pay him $100,000+ per year that will allow his family to live so his wife can stay home. There are men out there who make significantly less but have jobs that make it easier for YOU to stay home, who provide necessary services but they don't make enough to be in your words a "good man" and allow his wife to stay home.
Good for you for having strong beliefs. Good for you for raising your daughter. I just hope you find what you're looking for when it comes to educating your daughter ... there aren't too many schools that still teach Home Ec and sewing and cooking and what not. Those days are long gone.
LOL! I don't so much care what you think, I just wish you actually did think.
TTC #1 since Oct. 2010. Tests normal.
jbelle
Thank you Diana.
Sasha,
I don't even know where to go with your post. You are absolutely entitled to your own opinion but when you start judging while sharing your opinion, well that's where you go wrong and get all the likes of us pissed off!
I have friends who went back to work because their husbands couldn't be good men and assume the responsibility of providing for their families --even when these moms desperately wanted to stay home-- and so mom arranged for family to watch the kids while she went back to help provide financially. And no, I don't consider that "having to" go back to work.
This is judging! I doubt you know the entire situation that led to these women having to go back to work. And saying that these men are not "good men"....why, because they don't earn enough? What should they do, go and get a 2nd and, possibly, 3rd job so that they can be "good men" to provide for their family......but miss out on seeing their children grow up???
You are a selfish....selfish person if that is what you believe and I really feel sorry for you...and your husband if that is the kind of crazy beliefs/pressure you put on him.
And, if you are raising your daughter to believe that she needs a man to be a "good man" and provide for her...I feel sorry for your daughter too.
ditto!
Ditto Ditto - Mindy and Kalichick!
Poor little Blair... raised by a total idiot.
Ditto
2bBush, It must be nice living in that bubble. I hope to one day join you! You should spend some time reading the paper or watching the news and becoming well aware that there is high unemployment right now and the so-called "not good men" that aren't taking care of these wives, well, if they worked in real estate their entire industry was wiped out! Step out of the bubble for a second.
I am an avid daily listener of Dr. Laura AND a working mom. But you're living in Dr. Laura's bubble of la la land as well. Dr. Laura's solution to women that have to work financially is that they work nights and care for their children during the day. 2bBush, how does one physically do this? Please tell! Because you take care of your child during the day and then guess what happens at 9 pm - you hit the pillow exhausted!! But imagine if you had to then work another 8 hours after that!! I think you need to shift you idolizing of Dr. Laura and realize the inpracticality of it all.
Maybe I need to divorce DH because he can't be a "good man" and make more money than me to provide for our family...
LOL. So my husband is not a "good man" because he can't support us entirely on one income?
You are a complete and utter fool. I am of the school that believes that a father who works so much that he never sees the child, just so the mom can stay home, is not a better situation than a child having a quality relationship and knowing BOTH parents.