How comfortable are you?

mrs pH

SaveTheWorld2014:

amelianguy:

1.) Don't talk to me like I'm a child.

2.) If I had said "I have terrible teeth, just like the British!" Would we be having this discussion? Likely not. The real issue at hand is that what I said has been twisted into a race issue. THAT is what's sad, because I can't even make a reference to my own breasts without someone making me out to be a racist.

I honestly wasn't trying to do that, as have been proven before - when people assume others know something they know, it doesn't go well. If wamo talked about anything involving science, I would be completely in the dark and, thanks to this board, I am know assuming people don't understand psycho- and soc- stuff. So sorry about that.

I don't know if Smo would have said anything re: Brits and their teeth (which I don't understand, why is this anyways?) but I would have. It's still making racial generalizations.

And, yes, you did make reference to YOUR breasts but you did not ONLY make reference to YOUR breasts. You compared YOUR breasts to another race's. If you had said 'saggy @$$ breasts,' then that would have been fine. You honestly don't see how saying their breasts are saggy like X race's breasts is hurtful and racist?

First off, not every Ethiopian woman's breasts are like that (which you've already acknowledged so thanks for that) BUT that's not even the case.

WHY is it necessary to say it at all? WHY can't you just say your breasts are saggy? WHY? 

I'm pretty sure she was joking.  Often a joke is more effective when there's a comparison. 

People need to lighten up.  The more meaning we put behind a comment the more harm it does.  We all know Amelia meant nothing by it, so why make it such a big deal?

SaveTheWorld2014

OKay, I see that and I agree. A joke.

Joke = funny, yes?

Her joke =/= funny.

Her joke = insensitive and ignorant.

That = problem. 

amelianguy

SaveTheWorld2014:

amelianguy:

SaveTheWorld2014:

amelianguy:

1.) Don't talk to me like I'm a child.

2.) If I had said "I have terrible teeth, just like the British!" Would we be having this discussion? Likely not. The real issue at hand is that what I said has been twisted into a race issue. THAT is what's sad, because I can't even make a reference to my own breasts without someone making me out to be a racist.

I honestly wasn't trying to do that, as have been proven before - when people assume others know something they know, it doesn't go well. If wamo talked about anything involving science, I would be completely in the dark and, thanks to this board, I am know assuming people don't understand psycho- and soc- stuff. So sorry about that.

I don't know if Smo would have said anything re: Brits and their teeth (which I don't understand, why is this anyways?) but I would have. It's still making racial generalizations.

And, yes, you did make reference to YOUR breasts but you did not ONLY make reference to YOUR breasts. You compared YOUR breasts to another race's. If you had said 'saggy @$$ breasts,' then that would have been fine. You honestly don't see how saying their breasts are saggy like X race's breasts is hurtful and racist?

First off, not every Ethiopian woman's breasts are like that (which you've already acknowledged so thanks for that) BUT that's not even the case.

WHY is it necessary to say it at all? WHY can't you just say your breasts are saggy? WHY? 

First of all, Ethiopia is a country. White women live there too. Thus, I wasn't commenting on an entire race (I didn't say, oh my boobs sag like all black women!) Haven't you ever read a copy of National Geographic? The majority of women in subsaharan Africa don't wear any kind of support for their chest. I was comparing my breasts to the size and shape of theirs. It's quite simple really, and any intelligent person could distinguish that.

also, I would like to clarify that no one ever said anything about the dental issues of the British. I was merely using that as a metaphor.

With that, I'm going to bed. Enjoy your crazycakes.

Race is often used, incorrectly though, interchangeably with ethnicity. With the ignorance shown here, I was assuming you would know the word race better than you would the word ethnicity. So, when I said you made a racial generalization, it was referring to the generalization you made when referring to ALL Ethiopian women.

So, yes, you DID make a generalization. 

And, you have yet to answer why it was necessary to bring up Ethiopian breasts in the first place. THAT'S crazycakes.

And, my wondering about the dental issues of the British had nothing to do with you, I didn't accuse you of saying anything negative about the British so calm down there killa. 

How dare you imply that I know nothing of race issues. How dare you imply that I am uneducated. You don't know ANYTHING about me. You need to back the fvck up.

I an DONE here. Go to hell.

MBMcC421

SaveTheWorld2014:

OKay, I see that and I agree. A joke.

Joke = funny, yes?

Her joke =/= funny.

Her joke = insensitive and ignorant.

That = problem. 

SW2B = joke

MBMcC421

Andplusalso, I am SO glad that you all took the time out of your busy schedules to actually answer Amanda's OP... ?_?

Ugly trolling FTW!!!

... and thanks to Smo's failed attempt at piggybacking off my post the other day, we now know that when it comes to "ugly," it's not always what's on the outside, but what's on the inside that counts.

Thank you, goodnight!

SMorriso

amelianguy:

SaveTheWorld2014:

amelianguy:

SaveTheWorld2014:

amelianguy:

1.) Don't talk to me like I'm a child.

2.) If I had said "I have terrible teeth, just like the British!" Would we be having this discussion? Likely not. The real issue at hand is that what I said has been twisted into a race issue. THAT is what's sad, because I can't even make a reference to my own breasts without someone making me out to be a racist.

I honestly wasn't trying to do that, as have been proven before - when people assume others know something they know, it doesn't go well. If wamo talked about anything involving science, I would be completely in the dark and, thanks to this board, I am know assuming people don't understand psycho- and soc- stuff. So sorry about that.

I don't know if Smo would have said anything re: Brits and their teeth (which I don't understand, why is this anyways?) but I would have. It's still making racial generalizations.

And, yes, you did make reference to YOUR breasts but you did not ONLY make reference to YOUR breasts. You compared YOUR breasts to another race's. If you had said 'saggy @$$ breasts,' then that would have been fine. You honestly don't see how saying their breasts are saggy like X race's breasts is hurtful and racist?

First off, not every Ethiopian woman's breasts are like that (which you've already acknowledged so thanks for that) BUT that's not even the case.

WHY is it necessary to say it at all? WHY can't you just say your breasts are saggy? WHY? 

First of all, Ethiopia is a country. White women live there too. Thus, I wasn't commenting on an entire race (I didn't say, oh my boobs sag like all black women!) Haven't you ever read a copy of National Geographic? The majority of women in subsaharan Africa don't wear any kind of support for their chest. I was comparing my breasts to the size and shape of theirs. It's quite simple really, and any intelligent person could distinguish that.

also, I would like to clarify that no one ever said anything about the dental issues of the British. I was merely using that as a metaphor.

With that, I'm going to bed. Enjoy your crazycakes.

Race is often used, incorrectly though, interchangeably with ethnicity. With the ignorance shown here, I was assuming you would know the word race better than you would the word ethnicity. So, when I said you made a racial generalization, it was referring to the generalization you made when referring to ALL Ethiopian women.

So, yes, you DID make a generalization. 

And, you have yet to answer why it was necessary to bring up Ethiopian breasts in the first place. THAT'S crazycakes.

And, my wondering about the dental issues of the British had nothing to do with you, I didn't accuse you of saying anything negative about the British so calm down there killa. 

How dare you imply that I know nothing of race issues. How dare you imply that I am uneducated. You don't know ANYTHING about me. You need to back the fvck up.

I an DONE here. Go to hell.

Ames, you're backpedalling.Which is understandable because you're being called out. My original post was saying that a nation of women, and unless you read a National Geographic that I did not, I never saw any white women in the Subsaharan parts of Africa with their breasts exposed. So, once again, you were generalizing like SW2B stated. Which is the hurtful and potentially harmful part.

Did you mean it to be rude or insensitive,  no. I know that you were  making a statement about yourself, but in that you insulted a nation of African women. Therein lies the problem. Instead of just saying that your boobs are saggy, you added a comparison that was an insult. You've already expressed that your region has less exposure to Muslims and sensitivities to them in previous posts. So, this is not far off. Which is the reason I called it out. Most of the Ethiopians I know are not only dark skinned, but Muslims as well.

If we had a Niner that was from Ethiopia, better yet, if someone you liked on this board was from Ethiopia, would you have said the same? I can't believe that you would.

This board can be so unapologetic about things that are hugely important in this world. It's sad. SW2B stated quite well responses to this and painted it in a great light.

Racially/nationally insensitive jokes aren't light hearted nor should they be tolerated. Any intentions aside.

btw - everyone, the great MB states that any post with 8 or less responses is considered a failure. Just so they can add that to the board rules and regulations, or with some lame passive aggressive signature picture or avatar. Coming soon folks, coming soon.

ChristinaDawn

I wasn't going to fuel this any further but I need to state this one simple thing.  My issue was not with what you stated, it is the way in which you approached it Smo.  You came into a post in which you didn't even address the topic at hand just to call Ames out on her choice of comparing her breasts to that of an Ethiopian woman's ala National Geographic. You consistently come off as preachy and self righteous while hiding behind themes of race and injustice which makes it hard for anyone to say anything against you, not that that has ever stopped anyone, other than myself.  I'm not saying your views always are wrong, it's the way in which you state them that irks me.  That being said, I'm sure you're just as annoyed with many responses from other's on this board.  I don't often speak up in these situations because it's just not worth it most of the time but I've had my fill of your "my sh!t don't stank" attitude.  That's all.

SMorriso

ChristinaDawn:

I wasn't going to fuel this any further but I need to state this one simple thing.  My issue was not with what you stated, it is the way in which you approached it Smo.  You came into a post in which you didn't even address the topic at hand just to call Ames out on her choice of comparing her breasts to that of an Ethiopian woman's ala National Geographic. You consistently come off as preachy and self righteous while hiding behind themes of race and injustice which makes it hard for anyone to say anything against you, not that that has ever stopped anyone, other than myself.  I'm not saying your views always are wrong, it's the way in which you state them that irks me.  That being said, I'm sure you're just as annoyed with many responses from other's on this board.  I don't often speak up in these situations because it's just not worth it most of the time but I've had my fill of your "my *** don't stank" attitude.  That's all.

Christina, I think that the way I said it, honestly isn't any different than how Ames/MB/SW2B/Stees and a handful of others would not hold back on this board due to our relationships on the board. If that makes sense. We're open and speak frankly with people here. About breastefeeding, dinner recipes, things we disagree on. KWIM?

I think it is hypocritcal to say that I come off as self righteous when other people on this board have dedicated posts to say how they won't apologize for having their opinion or being bitchy because they're just keeping it real. blah blah. What makes me different? Why not call that out?

I'm definitely not trying to come off preachy, more than just calling something out like I did. I said already that it has been a difficult week for me. I didn't feel comfortable posting my thoughts here about what the president was pressured to do, and all the injustice surrounding it. I didn't post here because I didn't feel like dealing with,"Smo's playing the race card" BS. It was so severely moving for me. This whole week. So much so, that no I didn't have the strength to sugar coat or lighten my approach to something insensitive.  

I didn't post on any other post yesterday. So, on topic or not, it was worth calling out.

maryandkirk0909

SMorriso:

[You've already expressed that your region has less exposure to Muslims and sensitivities to them in previous posts. So, this is not far off. Which is the reason I called it out. Most of the Ethiopians I know are not only dark skinned, but Muslims as well.

This has nothing at all to do with the discussion at hand.  This is you calling out Amelia as ignorant for not having exposure to some things.  I'm sure you don't have the same exposure as I do to some things or that Riss or Christina does, or that Jamie does, because much of this has to do with geographic location, not personal ignorance.

FWIW, we have an extremely large Ethiopian population in DC and very few of them are Muslims, many go to Catholic and Christian Churches.   Why is that?  Let's go to Wikipedia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Ethiopia 

"It was one of the first Christian countries in the world, having officially adopted Christianity as the state religion in the 4th century."

Year	Christians	Ethiopian Orthodox	Protestants	Catholics	Muslims	Animists	Other
1994	61.6%	50.6%	10.1%	0.9%	32.8%	4.6%	1.0%
2007	62.8%	43.5%	18.6%	0.7%	33.9%	2.6%	0.7%
Growth	1.2%	-7.1%'	8.5%	-0.2%	1.1%	-1.2%	-0.3%

So, now you can consider yourself of extremely limited knowledge about this just like you consider Amelia. 

This post had nothing to do with religion or race and had everything to do with an analogy.  And if you're going to be insulted about her classification of women in Ethiopia's breasts, I feel like people have the right to be insulted about your lack of understanding about their religion.  There is tons of residual animosity towards people of the Muslim faith in our country right now, and there's no reason your generalization can't be linked to the ignorance that causes it.  

ChristinaDawn

SMorriso:

ChristinaDawn:

I wasn't going to fuel this any further but I need to state this one simple thing.  My issue was not with what you stated, it is the way in which you approached it Smo.  You came into a post in which you didn't even address the topic at hand just to call Ames out on her choice of comparing her breasts to that of an Ethiopian woman's ala National Geographic. You consistently come off as preachy and self righteous while hiding behind themes of race and injustice which makes it hard for anyone to say anything against you, not that that has ever stopped anyone, other than myself.  I'm not saying your views always are wrong, it's the way in which you state them that irks me.  That being said, I'm sure you're just as annoyed with many responses from other's on this board.  I don't often speak up in these situations because it's just not worth it most of the time but I've had my fill of your "my *** don't stank" attitude.  That's all.

Christina, I think that the way I said it, honestly isn't any different than how Ames/MB/SW2B/Stees and a handful of others would not hold back on this board due to our relationships on the board. If that makes sense. We're open and speak frankly with people here. About breastefeeding, dinner recipes, things we disagree on. KWIM?

I think it is hypocritcal to say that I come off as self righteous when other people on this board have dedicated posts to say how they won't apologize for having their opinion or being bitchy because they're just keeping it real. blah blah. What makes me different? Why not call that out?

I'm definitely not trying to come off preachy, more than just calling something out like I did. I said already that it has been a difficult week for me. I didn't feel comfortable posting my thoughts here about what the president was pressured to do, and all the injustice surrounding it. I didn't post here because I didn't feel like dealing with,"Smo's playing the race card" BS. It was so severely moving for me. This whole week. So much so, that no I didn't have the strength to sugar coat or lighten my approach to something insensitive.  

I didn't post on any other post yesterday. So, on topic or not, it was worth calling out.

I don't think it's hypocritical at all considering you have no basis on which to call me hypocritical.  Why? Just because I haven't spoke up before and now I am?  That'd doesn't make me hypocritical, that just makes me fed up and unable to keep my mouth shut.

Why not call that out? Because it's not my style to call people out.  If you were to look back through my posting history from 2008 to date you will not find much drama.  The only other time I can think of was recently when SW2B said something snarky in Emily's pregnancy announcement post which irked me because again it wasn't about the topic at hand at all and was completely unnecessary in my opinion.

What makes you different?  The way in which you state your opinion as if it is a higher truth and better than anyone else's.  You are intellegent and state your opinion in an intellegent manner, however the way you word your opinions is what bothers me.  You talk down to people and have a vendetta against the Great MB and here "team" because you don't like her or the way she states her opinions.  As you are entitled to not like MB, I am entitled to not like you.  As I stated in my previous post, I'm fed up with your manner of "speaking" to people on this board and the fact that you seem to post a lot just to call people out on statements that you twist into issues.  It would be different if the post were about race/nationality issues, but it wasn't, you made it about that.  I am also not stating that your pulling the "race card," you called it that.  Again, for me it isn't about the issue you're speaking out against, it's the way you do it.

maryandkirk0909

I'm fine with it.  I prefer to be naked during sex.  I like to be naked, but not when I'm getting ready.  My boobs are too big for me to blow dry my hair naked (I blow dry upside down and prefer no to be strangled) but I get ready in a bra and panties every day.

ChristinaDawn

maryandkirk0909:

I'm fine with it.  I prefer to be naked during sex.  I like to be naked, but not when I'm getting ready.  My boobs are too big for me to blow dry my hair naked (I blow dry upside down and prefer no to be strangled) but I get ready in a bra and panties every day.

LOL.  The vision this just gave me was mildly disturbing and hilarious at the same time.

SMorriso

maryandkirk0909:

SMorriso:

[You've already expressed that your region has less exposure to Muslims and sensitivities to them in previous posts. So, this is not far off. Which is the reason I called it out. Most of the Ethiopians I know are not only dark skinned, but Muslims as well.

This has nothing at all to do with the discussion at hand.  This is you calling out Ames as ignorant for not having exposure to some things.  I'm sure you don't have the same exposure as I do to some things or that Riss or Christina does, or that Jamie does, because much of this has to do with geographic location, not personal ignorance.

FWIW, we have an extremely large Ethiopian population in DC and very few of them are Muslims, many go to Catholic and Christian Churches.   Why is that?  Let's go to Wikipedia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Ethiopia 

"It was one of the first Christian countries in the world, having officially adopted Christianity as the state religion in the 4th century."

Year	Christians	Ethiopian Orthodox	Protestants	Catholics	Muslims	Animists	Other
1994	61.6%	50.6%	10.1%	0.9%	32.8%	4.6%	1.0%
2007	62.8%	43.5%	18.6%	0.7%	33.9%	2.6%	0.7%
Growth	1.2%	-7.1%'	8.5%	-0.2%	1.1%	-1.2%	-0.3%

 

It had relevance to me. There are a considerable amount of Muslims in Africa, and in Ethiopia (one out of three by your graph). She stated previously that regionally, it is more common for people to say negative things about Muslims. Needless to say, that regional negative can easily (and as she showed here) be connected to other cultural insensitivities. The two topics might seem off base to you, but they're not to me.

That is open to disagreement. A third of a population is still significant. As well as the ignorance of her region in feeling that it is okay to say something negative about Muslims and have the majority agree with her.

Thanks for calling me out, but not her point about the white women in Ethiopia, and the white population not being photographed topless in National Geographic. I bet that topic would be a lot less connecting than 1 out of 3 people being Muslim. I guess you should look for a graph of the sagginess of the breasts of Ethiopian women in comparison to other women of the world.

lneuner09

If Ames had compared her breasts to "saggy old woman boobs" would anyone have said she was being inappropriate and age-ist?  Would any have defended elderly women?  Just curious.

maryandkirk0909

SMorriso:

Thanks for calling me out, but not her point about the white women in Ethiopia, and the white population not being photographed topless in National Geographic. I bet that topic would be a lot less connecting than 1 out of 3 people being Muslim. I guess you should look for a graph of the sagginess of the breasts of Ethiopian women in comparison to other women of the world.

Well, I'd argue that sagginess is subjective and that self identification of religion is actually quantifiable.  So, as lucky as we'd be to have a CHART out there, it probably isn't going to happen.

Also, her analogy created an image in my head that was relatable to me and others on the board.  I didn't need to look for topless pictures of anyone or discuss whether or not certain women were or were not photographed.  Everyone is going to have some experiences and visuals locked into their minds.  

There's a very famous National Geographic cover that Amelia was referencing and that is what came to my mind.  Before she even referenced NG that was there for me.  Neither of us need to apologize for that, and it doesn't mean it has anything to do with race, it means we both locked into a certain image and our synapses made the connection.  

In any case, her post was not a personal attack on you, and you made this one on her. 

maryandkirk0909

lneuner09:

If Ames had compared her breasts to "saggy old woman boobs" would anyone have said she was being inappropriate and age-ist?  Would any have defended elderly women?  Just curious.

No one would have.  Just like if she'd said "deflated udders" animal lovers would not have defended the cow. 

SMorriso

ChristinaDawn:

SMorriso:

ChristinaDawn:

I wasn't going to fuel this any further but I need to state this one simple thing.  My issue was not with what you stated, it is the way in which you approached it Smo.  You came into a post in which you didn't even address the topic at hand just to call Ames out on her choice of comparing her breasts to that of an Ethiopian woman's ala National Geographic. You consistently come off as preachy and self righteous while hiding behind themes of race and injustice which makes it hard for anyone to say anything against you, not that that has ever stopped anyone, other than myself.  I'm not saying your views always are wrong, it's the way in which you state them that irks me.  That being said, I'm sure you're just as annoyed with many responses from other's on this board.  I don't often speak up in these situations because it's just not worth it most of the time but I've had my fill of your "my *** don't stank" attitude.  That's all.

Christina, I think that the way I said it, honestly isn't any different than how Ames/MB/SW2B/Stees and a handful of others would not hold back on this board due to our relationships on the board. If that makes sense. We're open and speak frankly with people here. About breastefeeding, dinner recipes, things we disagree on. KWIM?

I think it is hypocritcal to say that I come off as self righteous when other people on this board have dedicated posts to say how they won't apologize for having their opinion or being bitchy because they're just keeping it real. blah blah. What makes me different? Why not call that out?

I'm definitely not trying to come off preachy, more than just calling something out like I did. I said already that it has been a difficult week for me. I didn't feel comfortable posting my thoughts here about what the president was pressured to do, and all the injustice surrounding it. I didn't post here because I didn't feel like dealing with,"Smo's playing the race card" BS. It was so severely moving for me. This whole week. So much so, that no I didn't have the strength to sugar coat or lighten my approach to something insensitive.  

I didn't post on any other post yesterday. So, on topic or not, it was worth calling out.

I don't think it's hypocritical at all considering you have no basis on which to call me hypocritical.  Why? Just because I haven't spoke up before and now I am?  That'd doesn't make me hypocritical, that just makes me fed up and unable to keep my mouth shut.

Why not call that out? Because it's not my style to call people out.  If you were to look back through my posting history from 2008 to date you will not find much drama.  The only other time I can think of was recently when SW2B said something snarky in Emily's pregnancy announcement post which irked me because again it wasn't about the topic at hand at all and was completely unnecessary in my opinion.

What makes you different?  The way in which you state your opinion as if it is a higher truth and better than anyone else's.  You are intellegent and state your opinion in an intellegent manner, however the way you word your opinions is what bothers me.  You talk down to people and have a vendetta against the Great MB and here "team" because you don't like her or the way she states her opinions.  As you are entitled to not like MB, I am entitled to not like you.  As I stated in my previous post, I'm fed up with your manner of "speaking" to people on this board and the fact that you seem to post a lot just to call people out on statements that you twist into issues.  It would be different if the post were about race/nationality issues, but it wasn't, you made it about that.  I am also not stating that your pulling the "race card," you called it that.  Again, for me it isn't about the issue you're speaking out against, it's the way you do it.

Yes, it is full of myself to call out the truth about someone being ignorant towards a country of women. Not opinion. That comment had no factual basis unless Mary has dug up another graph or Wiki link about the comparison of breasts conducted by a legitimate source.

Even if Mary does have the grace to find such a graph, by Ames own admittance, her statement came from the National Geographics she used to look at, not based on fact.

I'm not talking down. I'm not going to say, Gee Ames, that probably isn't the best use of the term, and you just might be insulting someone out there. But since there is no Ethiopian Niners, or any African Niners, go ahead. That comment was okay, because I know your heart, and that you don't really mean to be insulting.

The comment wasn't okay, whether her intentions were. I didn't twist a damn thing. I don't know how on earth what she said could have been twisted.

I honestly find it hypocritical, that people are fine with MB talking down to people, i.e. JamieWillard, but when I challenge someone on a slur, I'm high and mighty.

I normally contribute to this board in a regular manner, I don't call out people just because I don't like them. Unlike others. If someone is doing something that is just rude, again i.e. JaimeWillard, lilswimmer, etc, I will speak up. If people make derogatory comments I'll speak up. Ames just happened to be the person saying it. It has nothing to do with my like or dislike of her.

ChristinaDawn

SMorriso:

ChristinaDawn:

SMorriso:

ChristinaDawn:

I wasn't going to fuel this any further but I need to state this one simple thing.  My issue was not with what you stated, it is the way in which you approached it Smo.  You came into a post in which you didn't even address the topic at hand just to call Ames out on her choice of comparing her breasts to that of an Ethiopian woman's ala National Geographic. You consistently come off as preachy and self righteous while hiding behind themes of race and injustice which makes it hard for anyone to say anything against you, not that that has ever stopped anyone, other than myself.  I'm not saying your views always are wrong, it's the way in which you state them that irks me.  That being said, I'm sure you're just as annoyed with many responses from other's on this board.  I don't often speak up in these situations because it's just not worth it most of the time but I've had my fill of your "my *** don't stank" attitude.  That's all.

Christina, I think that the way I said it, honestly isn't any different than how Ames/MB/SW2B/Stees and a handful of others would not hold back on this board due to our relationships on the board. If that makes sense. We're open and speak frankly with people here. About breastefeeding, dinner recipes, things we disagree on. KWIM?

I think it is hypocritcal to say that I come off as self righteous when other people on this board have dedicated posts to say how they won't apologize for having their opinion or being bitchy because they're just keeping it real. blah blah. What makes me different? Why not call that out?

I'm definitely not trying to come off preachy, more than just calling something out like I did. I said already that it has been a difficult week for me. I didn't feel comfortable posting my thoughts here about what the president was pressured to do, and all the injustice surrounding it. I didn't post here because I didn't feel like dealing with,"Smo's playing the race card" BS. It was so severely moving for me. This whole week. So much so, that no I didn't have the strength to sugar coat or lighten my approach to something insensitive.  

I didn't post on any other post yesterday. So, on topic or not, it was worth calling out.

I don't think it's hypocritical at all considering you have no basis on which to call me hypocritical.  Why? Just because I haven't spoke up before and now I am?  That'd doesn't make me hypocritical, that just makes me fed up and unable to keep my mouth shut.

Why not call that out? Because it's not my style to call people out.  If you were to look back through my posting history from 2008 to date you will not find much drama.  The only other time I can think of was recently when SW2B said something snarky in Emily's pregnancy announcement post which irked me because again it wasn't about the topic at hand at all and was completely unnecessary in my opinion.

What makes you different?  The way in which you state your opinion as if it is a higher truth and better than anyone else's.  You are intellegent and state your opinion in an intellegent manner, however the way you word your opinions is what bothers me.  You talk down to people and have a vendetta against the Great MB and here "team" because you don't like her or the way she states her opinions.  As you are entitled to not like MB, I am entitled to not like you.  As I stated in my previous post, I'm fed up with your manner of "speaking" to people on this board and the fact that you seem to post a lot just to call people out on statements that you twist into issues.  It would be different if the post were about race/nationality issues, but it wasn't, you made it about that.  I am also not stating that your pulling the "race card," you called it that.  Again, for me it isn't about the issue you're speaking out against, it's the way you do it.

Yes, it is full of myself to call out the truth about someone being ignorant towards a country of women. Not opinion. That comment had no factual basis unless Mary has dug up another graph or Wiki link about the comparison of breasts conducted by a legitimate source.

Even if Mary does have the grace to find such a graph, by Ames own admittance, her statement came from the National Geographics she used to look at, not based on fact.

I'm not talking down. I'm not going to say, Gee Ames, that probably isn't the best use of the term, and you just might be insulting someone out there. But since there is no Ethiopian Niners, or any African Niners, go ahead. That comment was okay, because I know your heart, and that you don't really mean to be insulting.

The comment wasn't okay, whether her intentions were. I didn't twist a damn thing. I don't know how on earth what she said could have been twisted.

I honestly find it hypocritical, that people are fine with MB talking down to people, i.e. JamieWillard, but when I challenge someone on a slur, I'm high and mighty.

I normally contribute to this board in a regular manner, I don't call out people just because I don't like them. Unlike others. If someone is doing something that is just rude, again i.e. JaimeWillard, lilswimmer, etc, I will speak up. If people make derogatory comments I'll speak up. Ames just happened to be the person saying it. It has nothing to do with my like or dislike of her.

You do call people out that you don't like, don't pretend that you don't.  You run to SW2B's defense even when she's saying completely idiotic things just to stick up for the underdog and rage against MB and others.  Again, for me it wasn't this topic specifically, this topic was just the catalyst that made me lose it on you because you are all high and mighty in your opinions and truths.  I agree with Mary's statement that my first image was that of a famous NG cover prior to Ames stating that reference as well.  This didn't have to be blown up like this, you chose to blow it up in this way and I know you're going to state that it's necessary to abolish race issues in the US, which is noble and all, it doesn't change the fact that I can't stand your approach to issues and that I don't like you.  I haven't spoken up before because when I'm working I don't get to post during the day like others and by the time I get home the issue is played out and I'd just be fueling the drama by stating my opinion.  To me this isn't a Team Smo, Team MB thing, it's a I don't like you thing because whether you want to admit it or not you do act like you're better than other's on this board and you do ride in on your high horse quite frequently.

This all goes back to "this is a public forum" "not everyone is going to get along" blah blah blah.  What you twisted was a fun post, into an ugly one by taking it upon yourself to personally crusade against this issue since, as you stated, your emotions have been running high this week.  I didn't ask you to sugar coat it, I asked you to STFU.

ChristinaDawn

lneuner09:

If Ames had compared her breasts to "saggy old woman boobs" would anyone have said she was being inappropriate and age-ist?  Would any have defended elderly women?  Just curious.

This!  But as Smo stated, her emotions were already running high re: race issues this week so she just couldn't stand by and let us racially ignorant woman state and accept distasteful racist references for the sake of comparing boobies.  Ridiculous.

amelianguy

Wait wait wait wait wait. Let me get this straight. You're saying that because I live in an area that has a history of racial intolerance, and because I have stated in the past that there is a tendency towards intolerance towards the muslim population in my region, I'm automatically an ignoramous? And you calling me that is different from my generalization about ethiopians how? Just because I am a white southern american does not mean I have a tendency towards racial intolerance. It does not make me ignorant. I am just as educated and socially aware as anyone on here. I assure you that I am not running around with a rebel flag on my pickup truck, spitting skoal and yelling at the black folks. My point being, if I've committed a crime of ignorance here, then so have you. (Forgive the paragraphs, I'm on my BB.)

SMorriso

ChristinaDawn:

lneuner09:

If Ames had compared her breasts to "saggy old woman boobs" would anyone have said she was being inappropriate and age-ist?  Would any have defended elderly women?  Just curious.

This!  But as Smo stated, her emotions were already running high re: race issues this week so she just couldn't stand by and let us racially ignorant woman state and accept distasteful racist references for the sake of comparing boobies.  Ridiculous.

I'm glad this is a point of mockery for you Christina. Something severly disheartening and sensitive, and should be in general for any American, no matter the race. I was going to let it pass, it would NOT have made the topic less horrible, I just questioned the worth or possibility of putting this much effort into a post about someone not using a slur without being called high and mighty.

As to Neuner's point - no, if it were old women she was talking about, that is a natural and normal progression of the body with age and gravity taking it's toll, like the other parts of our bodies. Ames didn't even say Old Ethiopian women. She said Ethiopian women. I don't know why Ethiopian women had to be involved at all.

Ames - you stated that people in your area would agree if you said something negative about Muslims. I am just repeating what you're saying. The South is known (from polls and it's history in general) for being behind on progression for racial equality. It isn't generalizing.

As for Christina's point about me calling them out, they normally are the ones that say stuff worth calling out like this. I had and have no problems calling out anyone that would use a slur against people like that.  I don't have to pretend that I like someone when I don't. I also act in a civil manner even if I don't like people on a regular basis, when they're not using slurs or being rude for no appropriate reason. I've called out others, Memily - when she had her whole school loan issue, etc. I have no issues with Memily. I didn't think what she did was right, and I said so. Like a few other Niners who did the same.

Again, people on this board tend to side with those that show some sort of strength in numbers. They like the cantor and general snarkiness that goes along with their humor. Which is fine. It doesn't make a slur against a group of women fine. That was the whole point.

So, Christina, for you to be consistent, please call someone else out in the future, as it's likely to happen again, for 'twisting' a fun post into something completely unrelated. Also, when you see someone else being high and mighty based on what you feel is an opinion, call them out too. I'll believe you're not a hypocrite then.

 

 

 

 

amelianguy

The point. You missed it. I didn't say there weren't race issues in the South. There most assuredly are. I said that just because I'm from the South, it doesn't make me ignorant. You are grouping me in with those Southerners who have hate for other races. I am NOT one of those people. I am white. I am a Southern American. Those two factors don't make me a racist, just as being an Ethiopian female doesn't mean one has saggy breasts. Talk about the pot calling the kettle black.

ChristinaDawn

SMorriso:

ChristinaDawn:

lneuner09:

If Ames had compared her breasts to "saggy old woman boobs" would anyone have said she was being inappropriate and age-ist?  Would any have defended elderly women?  Just curious.

This!  But as Smo stated, her emotions were already running high re: race issues this week so she just couldn't stand by and let us racially ignorant woman state and accept distasteful racist references for the sake of comparing boobies.  Ridiculous.

I'm glad this is a point of mockery for you Christina. Something severly disheartening and sensitive, and should be in general for any American, no matter the race. I was going to let it pass, it would NOT have made the topic less horrible, I just questioned the worth or possibility of putting this much effort into a post about someone not using a slur without being called high and mighty.

As to Neuner's point - no, if it were old women she was talking about, that is a natural and normal progression of the body with age and gravity taking it's toll, like the other parts of our bodies. Ames didn't even say Old Ethiopian women. She said Ethiopian women. I don't know why Ethiopian women had to be involved at all.

Ames - you stated that people in your area would agree if you said something negative about Muslims. I am just repeating what you're saying. The South is known (from polls and it's history in general) for being behind on progression for racial equality. It isn't generalizing.

As for Christina's point about me calling them out, they normally are the ones that say stuff worth calling out like this. I had and have no problems calling out anyone that would use a slur against people like that.  I don't have to pretend that I like someone when I don't. I also act in a civil manner even if I don't like people on a regular basis, when they're not using slurs or being rude for no appropriate reason. I've called out others, Memily - when she had her whole school loan issue, etc. I have no issues with Memily. I didn't think what she did was right, and I said so. Like a few other Niners who did the same.

Again, people on this board tend to side with those that show some sort of strength in numbers. They like the cantor and general snarkiness that goes along with their humor. Which is fine. It doesn't make a slur against a group of women fine. That was the whole point.

So, Christina, for you to be consistent, please call someone else out in the future, as it's likely to happen again, for 'twisting' a fun post into something completely unrelated. Also, when you see someone else being high and mighty based on what you feel is an opinion, call them out too. I'll believe you're not a hypocrite then.

 

 

 

 

As stated I called SW2B out in Emily's post announcing she was pregnant.  I take it this doesn't count since everyone calls her out all the time though.  I also just want to say that I don't appreciate you implying that I am insensitive to the subject at hand of racism, maybe I'm just not as sensitive to is as you clearly are which was my point, however poorly conveyed on Nooner's post.  You are very sensitive to these issues, which is your choice, my issue is that you do always call people out on this, just like you stated above you would have called anyone out who stated what you consider to be a racial slur.  You chose to take it that way and others did not.  You can read into that that that makes those of us who were not immediately offended ignorant, again that's your choice.  I am choosing not to be offended and you can think what you want about that.  

I didn't stand up against you assuming people would have my back, I actually assumed quite the opposite since it is a "race issue."  For the last time I will say that it wasn't this topic specifically that set me off, it's you in general, you could have called someone else out about a different topic and if you did it in your typical manner coming from a high and mighty place yet again, I would have called you for out just the same because I'm fed up.

SMorriso

amelianguy:

The point. You missed it. I didn't say there weren't race issues in the South. There most assuredly are. I said that just because I'm from the South, it doesn't make me ignorant. You are grouping me in with those Southerners who have hate for other races. I am NOT one of those people. I am white. I am a Southern American. Those two factors don't make me a racist, just as being an Ethiopian female doesn't mean one has saggy breasts. Talk about the pot calling the kettle black.

I didn't call you racist. I stated you made an ignorant and derogatory slur. That doesn't make you ignorant, but a statement that you made was ignorant. I called out the ignorance of your statement, not you. Then I linked that to a comment you stated about your area lacking cultural exposure and sensitivities.  If you took it as me calling you a racist, I am sorry, honestly.

Christina, the sadness involved in what you said, that I am sensitive because I choose to be, counters that you're not because you also choose to be. People constantly choose to be willfully ignorant (not saying this in reference to this thread) and sort of complacent because it doesn't directly involve them. This birther crap is shameful and embarrassing for the entire country.  I guess I could go into detail about it, but I posted a link on p&CE to a video that said it the best. To go through that emotionally in one week, would definitely leave anyone in a state of distress and rage.

The face that people just lay low or don't feel the need to call out racial insensitivities or racial slurs is shameful. Someone always feels the pain of that, and it seems that as long as it isn't someone that is liked on this board, it doesn't mean much.

This will always be a hot topic for me. Even more so when I have kids and their world is shaped by crap like this. When we can have a president with excellent standings, a great acedemic background, and an upstanding citizen who also happens to be black, and his status is questioned, that is a shame and an outrage. It's degrading, and horrible and hugely important to show where we are, or aren't rather,as a country. I don't think we'll acheive racial equality in my lifetime, though I hope I'm wrong.

 

ChristinaDawn

SMorriso:

amelianguy:

The point. You missed it. I didn't say there weren't race issues in the South. There most assuredly are. I said that just because I'm from the South, it doesn't make me ignorant. You are grouping me in with those Southerners who have hate for other races. I am NOT one of those people. I am white. I am a Southern American. Those two factors don't make me a racist, just as being an Ethiopian female doesn't mean one has saggy breasts. Talk about the pot calling the kettle black.

I didn't call you racist. I stated you made an ignorant and derogatory slur. That doesn't make you ignorant, but a statement that you made was ignorant. I called out the ignorance of your statement, not you. Then I linked that to a comment you stated about your area lacking cultural exposure and sensitivities.  If you took it as me calling you a racist, I am sorry, honestly.

Christina, the sadness involved in what you said, that I am sensitive because I choose to be, counters that you're not because you also choose to be. People constantly choose to be willfully ignorant (not saying this in reference to this thread) and sort of complacent because it doesn't directly involve them. This birther crap is shameful and embarrassing for the entire country.  I guess I could go into detail about it, but I posted a link on p&CE to a video that said it the best. To go through that emotionally in one week, would definitely leave anyone in a state of distress and rage.

The face that people just lay low or don't feel the need to call out racial insensitivities or racial slurs is shameful. Someone always feels the pain of that, and it seems that as long as it isn't someone that is liked on this board, it doesn't mean much.

This will always be a hot topic for me. Even more so when I have kids and their world is shaped by crap like this. When we can have a president with excellent standings, a great acedemic background, and an upstanding citizen who also happens to be black, and his status is questioned, that is a shame and an outrage. It's degrading, and horrible and hugely important to show where we are, or aren't rather,as a country. I don't think we'll acheive racial equality in my lifetime, though I hope I'm wrong.

 

I'll give you this because I do completely agree and I do genuinely apologize for mocking you because that was uncalled for on my part. 

What I want you to take away from my responses to you is that the way you respond and "speak" to people on here annoys me, just as the way MB "speaks" to people annoys you whereas it typically doesn't annoy me.  I may have chosen a poor topic to express my annoyance towards you on, but there it is.  If I'm around to call someone else out when they annoy me I'll be sure to, it took a couple years for me to call you out though, so it may be a bit of a wait

lneuner09

SMorriso:

ChristinaDawn:

lneuner09:

If Ames had compared her breasts to "saggy old woman boobs" would anyone have said she was being inappropriate and age-ist?  Would any have defended elderly women?  Just curious.

This!  But as Smo stated, her emotions were already running high re: race issues this week so she just couldn't stand by and let us racially ignorant woman state and accept distasteful racist references for the sake of comparing boobies.  Ridiculous.

As to Neuner's point - no, if it were old women she was talking about, that is a natural and normal progression of the body with age and gravity taking it's toll, like the other parts of our bodies. Ames didn't even say Old Ethiopian women. She said Ethiopian women. I don't know why Ethiopian women had to be involved at all.

so wait.  It's ok to say saggy old lady boobs because there's some truth to it (even though now all elderly women have saggy breasts).  It doesn't matter that there are some Etheopian women with saggy breasts? Because they are Etheopian, it's not recist?  There IS truth to saying Etheopian women have saggy breasts - culturally, most of them do not wear bras.  Results in saggy breasts. 

You can't say it's racist to refer to Etheopian saggy breasts but that it's ok to refer to elderly women's saggy breasts.  You can't have it both ways. 

maryandkirk0909

SMorriso:

This birther crap is shameful and embarrassing for the entire country.  I guess I could go into detail about it, but I posted a link on p&CE to a video that said it the best. To go through that emotionally in one week, would definitely leave anyone in a state of distress and rage. 

I choose not to be sensitive about the birther crap because it is just that, crap.  Obama is my President whether or not I voted for him.  And for people to be ignorant enough to think that no one along the line checked out his birth certificate is simply outrageously stupid.  So, I pay it no mind.  There's no point in getting worked up over something like that because the people who really believe it won't be dissuaded by facts.  If you spend all your time getting worked up over things like that you'll have no time to do anything else.  

The Dems did the same thing about McCain being born in Panama before the 2008 election.  It also has little to do with Obama's race and more to do with political mudslinging, which goes on from each side. 

SMorriso

lneuner09:

SMorriso:

ChristinaDawn:

lneuner09:

If Ames had compared her breasts to "saggy old woman boobs" would anyone have said she was being inappropriate and age-ist?  Would any have defended elderly women?  Just curious.

This!  But as Smo stated, her emotions were already running high re: race issues this week so she just couldn't stand by and let us racially ignorant woman state and accept distasteful racist references for the sake of comparing boobies.  Ridiculous.

As to Neuner's point - no, if it were old women she was talking about, that is a natural and normal progression of the body with age and gravity taking it's toll, like the other parts of our bodies. Ames didn't even say Old Ethiopian women. She said Ethiopian women. I don't know why Ethiopian women had to be involved at all.

so wait.  It's ok to say saggy old lady boobs because there's some truth to it (even though now all elderly women have saggy breasts).  It doesn't matter that there are some Etheopian women with saggy breasts? Because they are Etheopian, it's not recist?  There IS truth to saying Etheopian women have saggy breasts - culturally, most of them do not wear bras.  Results in saggy breasts. 

You can't say it's racist to refer to Etheopian saggy breasts but that it's ok to refer to elderly women's saggy breasts.  You can't have it both ways. 

Yes I can. No one, if they get older, is exempt from sagging skin and gravity. No man, no woman, no human is exempt. There for it isn't a slur or derogatory to state that older people have sagging body features. I could say that older people have gray or white hair. It isn't a slur, it is a natural occurrence.

When people questioned McCain, it wasn't due to the fact that they thought he was an American or not. People, more so Trump is degrading the leader of our nation because he's rich, and white and has nothing better to do. A black man has a position he doesn't have. Throroughly racist.

tartuga on P&CE covered the McCain issue better than I can:

There was a legal debate over whether being born in a military hospital outside the US counts as "natural born". But NOBODY said "OMG McCain is lying about where he was born!" Nobody questioned his truthfulness, nobody questioned whether he is actually an American citizen. Nobody said "McCain isn't really who he says he is!"

That's exactly what's happened with Obama. They are saying he isn't REALLY an American, that he's lying about his citizenship and birth. 

That is where the difference lies. Unless there is debate about whether being born in Hawaii makes you a "natural born citizen", these two issues are completely different. 

I choose to get worked up because it affects me. It will affect my children, it will affect Tre, if that makes a difference to you. That is worth the time to protest, to write letters to networks, and to get up in arms about.

Brushing it off as unimportant is complacency. It is wholly offensive and thick with racism. As ridiculous as the claims are, it is still relevant that he is being questioned.

This is the video I posted on P&CE. I think he speaks so well and speaks exactly what I feel, and to the degree that so many black people feel. That is relevent, and worth the time.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vX5ueEKsSWc&feature=youtu.be

lneuner09

sagging also naturally happens to people who don't wear bras their entire life.  It doesn't just happen to women in Etheopia, it happens in a lot of countries where women don't wear bras.  It's natural.  If I never wore a bra my entire life it would probably happen to me too.  No one is saying that Etheopian women are born with deformed breasts or anything.  The sagging is natural.  for both elderly women and women in countries where they don't wear bras. 

sarges05girl

I'm not comfortable being in my own body, let alone being naked in it. I've put on a lot of weight and I jiggle a lot. I also have saggy Amazonian boobies (go ahead, call me out) and I haven't even given birth yet. I don't mind being naked in sterile settings, like a doctor's office, or while getting ready in the bathroom, but I hate sexy naked. And I think it's because I don't feel sexy naked. Danny reassures me all the time that I'm still sexy, but if the lights aren't off, I'm not comfortable.