Our tech team has launched updates to The Nest today. As a result of these updates, members of the Nest Community will need to change their password in order to continue participating in the community. In addition, The Nest community member's avatars will be replaced with generic default avatars. If you wish to revert to your original avatar, you will need to re-upload it via The Nest.
If you have questions about this, please email help@theknot.com.
Thank you.
Note: This only affects The Nest's community members and will not affect members on The Bump or The Knot.
Outdoor cat in winter
Hi! I usually post on The Bump, but there's no pet board there, so I thought you ladies might have some answers.
DH and I have a nine year old cat named Max that DH got for me 8.5 years ago when we were dating. He used to be a semi- exclusively indoor cat. As in, we wanted him to be an exclusively indoor cat, but he ran outside every chance he got, and we'd have to chase him. In our last house, we lived near a really busy road, so letting him stay outside for any length of time wasn't an option. After our son was born (ten months ago), Max started getting out more often, and I couldn't always chase him if I was holding my son when he got out. We also started worrying about what germs he was bringing back inside because if he stayed outside for longer than ten minutes, he would almost always catch a rodent and leave it on our front porch.
This summer we bought a house that is on a really quiet street and is surrounded by fields, trees and a lake, so we decided just to let Max be an outdoor cat. He sleeps in the garage and during the day we open the garage door just enough so that he can got in and out but still has easy protection from wind, rain, etc. But now that's it's winter and cold (9 degrees F last night), I worry about him being in the garage at night. We got him a heated cat house and a heated water dish so that his water doesn't freeze, but is there anything else we can be doing to make him warmer and more comfortable?
If possible, please try not to flame me too much about him being an outdoor cat. I know it's safer for cats to be indoors, but that ship has sailed, especially as far as DH is concerned.
Re: Outdoor cat in winter
If you know it's safer, bring him inside. You're risking your cat's LIFE by leaving him outdoors. Heads would roll if my FI insisted our (hypothetical) cat lived outside. I get that a married couple are partners, but when a spouse wants to do something that is proven to be a danger to the life of a family member, they get no say.
Your street may be quiet, but that doesn't mean there's no risk of ever getting hit by a car. Or getting into something poisonous. Or being attacked by bigger animals.
I probably should've clarified the last sentence. DH didn't insist that Max live outside, we decided together. I would be ok with keeping Max in our basement, but it's pretty much DH's man cave, so he doesn't want him down there. Max doesn't like kids (he's bitten my nephew before), so now that our son can move around and would be able to chase him, I don't really want Max in the same part of the house as our son, especially if he just ate a field mouse before biting.
I know there are risks to him outside, and that blows. The problem, as I said before, is that before he "officially" became an outdoor cat, he was getting outside at least once a day anyway, in spite of our best efforts to keep him in. I honestly don't know what to do. I can't keep him in, I feel bad keeping him out, and I don't want to get rid of him.
I disagree with this.
It sounds like your cat wants to be outside more, where he's happy.
I grew up on a little farm where we had lots of outdoor cats. Most of them very tame, and we'd let them inside the house for a few hours (or overnight when we were sneaky kids and wanted a snuggle buddy), but they lived outside. They wanted to live outside where they could follow their natural instincts and hunt, wander, and explore.
My parents have a big barn with lots of cozy spots for them to snuggle into. It's not heated, but like you, they have a heater for the water, and a home-made box with a lightbulb heating it. Cats will adapt and grow a nice thick layer of fur and fat to keep warm (mind you they can't survive without some type of shelter tho).
To me, forcing a cat indoors, and taking out their claws seems strange. But I think there's different wiring in the brains of completely domesticated indoor cats, and farm cats. Even the friendliest farm cat at my parent's house would be miserable indoors all the time.
You're doing the right thing providing fresh water, and a warm bed for him. PP is right about a larger animal could hurt him, and he could get hit by a car. It's possible, and it would be avoided if he only lived indoors, but since that's not how the cat is happy, then you're doing what you can do.
Make sure to give him some attention from time to time too, or a yummy can of tuna
I think you're doing everything right! When I was a kid, we had outside cats that survived long winters curled up in a dog house filled with hay or straw (sometimes with a dog - when I was really little we had an outside beagle that my dad hunted with). They grew winter coats and were ok.
Just remember to always check your vehicle - sometimes they'll crawl underneath them after they discover their warm (right after you get home...). As long as you have some sort of heated surface for them, I'm sure they'll be ok. They make a lot of different heated beds now, some that are sort of self heating just by the cats own body heat. I'm not sure how well they work, though.
I'd just try to set up a couple more comfy places for kitty. Maybe a dog house with hay piled in it, maybe another big bed of sorts with a bunch of towels and other various linens in it, an old dog crate (off craigslist) that you can put warm stuff in (think old clothing/blankets/sheets/towels/etc.). The more options your kitty has, the more likely she can figure out which one is her favorite. Also remember to put something comfy outside too (maybe just another dog house with hay), in case she gets locked out of the garage for some reason (you never know!). A cat that is cold will find warmth somewhere - and it may be a neighbors house...so always keep a tag on your kitty with a breakable collar. I know some people keep a tag on their outdoor cat that states they're an outdoor cat, with our number/address on it.
Sometimes you have to take quality of life into consideration when deciding what to do for your pets..and your kitty sounds like her quality of life (in her opinion, anyway), is much better outside. This board will strongly disagree with you, but you have to do what works for your family. One trip to a humane society will tell you taking your cat there is NOT an option....and yes, her life may be shortened living outside...but she's probably going to enjoy it a heck of a lot more than in your basement. Please do make sure she's spayed and fully vaccinated.
FF
Oh, well, when you put it that way. Obviously the cat knows what's best for it. Silly scientific studies. What do they know??
Who ever advocated for declawing? That's a barbaric procedure.
I was just thinking the same thing. Is this why we all left or did this happen because we left?
PS: C is so freaking cute!
Agreed on both points. I grew up on a quiet street, with outdoor cats (before we knew better). We found one of our cats dead, not on our quiet little street, but on the bigger road that connected to our quiet little street. Another one was accidentally poisened from drinking out of a puddle of antifreeze in our next door neighbor's driveway. That's when we learned the lesson that animals, no matter how much they love being outside, need to be kept indoors for their safety.
I was also thinking the same thing. Of course I changed my name on here so no one knows who I am. I used to be a regular and now lurk.
Ditto to you guys. I think it is a vicious cycle. We try to post, get drowned out by all the bad advice, then shake our heads and go back to lurking.
"The hardest thing is to live richly in the present without letting it be tainted out of fear for the future or regret for the past." - Sylvia Plath
To answer your original question. Animals live outside in those temperatures rather safely all the time. You are providing extra shelter and protection from the elements so I am sure your cat is fine. If he was cold and uncomfortable outside I am sure he would be meowing at the door to come back in the house. As he does not appear to be doing so I would not fret over it too much.
As for the other discussion that has popped up: You obviously are well aware of the health benefits of keeping your cat inside, and it is obvious you would prefer to keep your cat indoors for his sake. The cat is the one that has decided to live outside. We cannot reason with cats and dogs and make them understand our reasoning for keeping them indoors. And while if a cat was a child and they would grow out of their unsafe habits, and would eventually understand the reasoning I would be a much larger advocate for going to more lengths to keep the cat indoors. But cats that want to be outdoors will do anything to get there. I have a client whose cat created a hole around piping to get outside. That cat was unhappy inside, and living a much happier life outdoors. The cat is still a picture of health, he now gets a leukemia vaccine as added protection and is a much friendlier cat because of his new living arrangements. Is it ideal? probably not, but it the best we can do for the cat.
I really wish you would just go away. You're one of the worst things that's ever happened to this board. The cat gets to make decisions?
No I am just realistic. I am an advocate for indoor pets and am happy to discuss the benefits of indoor animals. But I am also realistic and know that it doesn't work for every family or every pet. If the cat is truly happier outside then so be it. It may not be ideal, but this is the real world so ideal doesn't always happen.
And all I am saying is you can't rationalize with a cat, so you can't convince them with rational thought that staying indoors is better. To some cats it always will feel like a prison.
This board was one of the least helpful and most judgmental boards on the nest. If new posters weren't doing it your way, they were obviously terrible pet owners. So in that sense, yes I do feel differently than a majority of the old posters.
Good. God. The horrid advice just astounds me. I should just let C play in the street as well since that's what she wants to do.
I think it's pretty assholistic of your DH to say he doesn't want your cat (as a couple) in "his" man cave. Please. Is this not both your house? I would have a huge problem with my DH for saying that.
Second- hating a child outside of the family does not mean he will hate your own child. Some supervision and proper interactions will go a long way.
And I can't reason with my son, but that doesn't mean I let him chew on my laptop wire because that's what he wants to do.
I just can't even find words for you.
I'm still grasping at how someone can't keep their cat indoors? It's 20 lbs. it's not like its a tiger.
It's one thing to be realistic. It's another to actively help someone rationalize their poor choices, which seems to be your M.O. (Well, that and complain about the regulars here).
"The hardest thing is to live richly in the present without letting it be tainted out of fear for the future or regret for the past." - Sylvia Plath
Poor sweet kittymew.
One of my good friends used to have outside cats. She knew that she shouldn't, but thought that her cats were happier outside.
Until her husband backed the car over one of the cats.
Accidents happen. Accidents happen less to cats who stay indoors. Indoor cats also live longer, healthier lives.
http://animal.discovery.com/healthy-pets/cat-health-101/how-long-do-cats-live.html
Outdoor cats also kill the birds and other wildlife.
I will never advocate an outside pet, I don't care how happy they are outside. The chances of them getting attacked by another animal, hit by a car, stolen, poisoned, etc are not worth the risk.
I am pretty sure it would make Raven happy to eat McDonalds every day too, but that doesn't mean I should feed it to her.
They see us rollin'...they be hatin'.
I grew up with indoor/outdoor cats. I know first hand how long they generally live... not very long. We had several when I was really small that didn't make it back (we lived in the woods, I assume the all were eaten). Then we had one that came home after 3 days, and died a slow death over the next 3 days. I found him dead on Valentine's day. Awesome. The next was hit by a car. My mom picked me up from my friend's house and didn't notice the blood was still on the truck floor (who knows what my dad did with the body). The next actually lived a fair amount longer, but then disappeared in the woods never to be seen again.
The cats were all loved very much and well fed and vetted... they just didn't get to enjoy very long lives, and I shudder to think about what their deaths were like.
...and this is funny, how??
http://www.wildlifemanagementinstitute.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=610:new-research-suggests-outdoor-cats-kill-more-wildlife-than-thought&catid=34:ONB Articles&Itemid=54
http://www.abcbirds.org/newsandreports/releases/120806.html
http://www.csmonitor.com/Environment/Wildlife/2009/1201/outdoor-cats-are-easy-prey-for-coyotes
http://wildliferehabinfo.org/Cat_Predation.htm
http://birds.audubon.org/faq/what-do-i-do-about-cats-killing-birds
</br>
Please enlighten me. For someone that is a vet tech and supposedly cares for animals, how is this funny?
They see us rollin'...they be hatin'.
Aggiebug:
Those are just a few of the several things I found by doing a quick search.
Yeah. You are as dumb as I thought. Not to mention a total DB, too.
You get a gold star for laughing at the fact that millions of birds (along with other wildlife) are killed this way,
They see us rollin'...they be hatin'.
This is another good point that I tend to forget. I'm super looking forward to gardening pregnant this year, since my neighbors cat has endlessly used it as her litterbox. Awesome.
And you sure are a classy poster there with your name calling. It very good for a constructive discussion. (which is my point about this board in general)
OK, don't actually read the links that RP took the time to post. Which state that outdoor cats are having a significant negative effect on local songbird populations.
Not to mention the diseases that cats can pick up by eating rodents.