Probably flammable, but I want to ask anyways

NuggetBrain

UsedToBeGoldie:

Holy shiznizzle - are there really THIS many pages to this post???

She's offended by it - period... nobody can change how she feels... but people CAN try not to use the words as much or at all, to be considerate... as others try not to use gay, retarded, etc - knowing it upsets people.  Doesn't matter how YOU compare the use of the words... the fact is that it offends her. Do you have to change b/c of it? Of course not - but she IS a member of this board...  yet, so many seem to think she doesn't deserve the respect others get... b/c she's on the right?

hypocrites... "care about others" philosophy... except when the others are in another political party.

What the hell are you talking about?  This has nothing to do with AW being a conservative.  News flash, lady - there are Christian Democrats *GASP AND CLUTCH PEARLS*.

Project much?

LittleMoxie

SMorriso:

DruidPrincess:

Sh!t.  I just read through the entire thread, and not once was my fairly cogent post quoted.  You are all dead to me.

That's how I felt. haha. I did read yours and agreed, again.

Smo - I meant to respond to yours.  I can't recall it exactly now, but I wanted to say that when I say JFC or whatever, I harbor no ill-will towards Christians.  I think that's become common because Christians are the majority and if you want to say something arousing you're going to choose the one that resonates with most people around you.

In Turkey there is an exclamation "Allah Allah!" said in a certain way (more like Allah-HA-llaaaah) that is our equivalent of OMG.

I'm not picking on any one belief system - I think they are all equally ludicrous, but I use the ones focused on Christianity because that's just the more common expletive around these parts (the US).

taratru

UsedToBeGoldie:

Holy shiznizzle - are there really THIS many pages to this post???

She's offended by it - period... nobody can change how she feels... but people CAN try not to use the words as much or at all, to be considerate... as others try not to use gay, retarded, etc - knowing it upsets people.  Doesn't matter how YOU compare the use of the words... the fact is that it offends her. Do you have to change b/c of it? Of course not - but she IS a member of this board...  yet, so many seem to think she doesn't deserve the respect others get... b/c she's on the right?

hypocrites... "care about others" philosophy... except when the others are in another political party.

Should everyone just make a list of "offensive to them" words and phrases and everyone "respect that enough" to stop using them?  

mxolisi

UsedToBeGoldie:

Holy shiznizzle - are there really THIS many pages to this post???

She's offended by it - period... nobody can change how she feels... but people CAN try not to use the words as much or at all, to be considerate... as others try not to use gay, retarded, etc - knowing it upsets people.  Doesn't matter how YOU compare the use of the words... the fact is that it offends her. Do you have to change b/c of it? Of course not - but she IS a member of this board...  yet, so many seem to think she doesn't deserve the respect others get... b/c she's on the right?

hypocrites... "care about others" philosophy... except when the others are in another political party.

Given what you've stated above, does this mean you will stop stating your opinions on the people of Mexico given that many regulars on this board have told you that they are not only misinformed but also personally offensive? To be considerate and all?

loislayn

Dear meanies,

 It offends me when you say Obama, Congress, Zimmerman, Romney, Santorum, Easter, Christmas, Africa, and Ellen Degeneres.

Please continue on with your discussions without these phrases.

TYIA.

srs5624

I can't resist...

pixy_stix

Dylanite:

Pixy, your example shows you were offended on behalf of someone else.  And because my intent was not to hurt you, I refuse to refrain from using such terminology because I know that of my intent.  Asking someone to refrain from using certain terminology due to the possibility that it could hurt someone sets a precedent I choose to avoid.   I'm not saying this justifies the use of ANY offensive terms (the N-word for example... Because that word is ONLY meant to hurt).

You specifically and deliberately used the word to offend. There is no, "setting precedence." You logically know the word has been used to degrade a segment of society, and yet continue to use it out of a perverse need to shock. There is a growing cultural shift to eradicate the word, but people still defend it's use (huh, sounds like the n-word argument for it's continued use doesn't it?).

I am not only offended on behalf of someone else, I am personally offended by the use of the word. Unless you think it's fun to be told that "Your sister is retarded, so there must be something in the gene pool that makes you retarded too." Because I have a million of those comments as well, and the shame and humiliation that brings. But HEY, it's not about race, so I shouldn't get offended.

+adamwife+

smock.smock:

AW, I have a somewhat related question. Correct me if I'm wrong, but you're saying that the main reason these words are offensive is because you see it as a sin against God. 

Do you have a similar reaction when you read on this board about other sins? Like someone posting about taking birth control? Or about having an affair? I'm assuming these aren't offensive in the same way, or it would be hard to read any post on the internet.

If saying JFC is the same as cheating on your spouse in God's eyes, why is reading about other sins less offensive to you?

I would say the offensiveness and the hurt that Dylanite was asking about have more to do with the fact that I love God so much.  No, I'm not saying this to appear more devout than anyone else.  You asked why it offends me, so I'm answering.  Jesus is my SAVIOR.  His sacrifice was unfathomable (and I think that this being Good Friday and the cost of His sacrifice looming around me today was the reason that I even thought to post this). 

You know how much you love your child?  Your parent?  Your spouse?  That's how much some of us love Jesus. 

Does it hurt you when someone says something hurtful about your child?  Your parent?  Your spouse?  That's how much it hurts some of us when we hear people taking the Lord's name in vain.

Sure, God is a "big boy" and can handle it Himself.  I'm not offended ON God's behalf.  I'm offended that someone took the name of someone that means so much to me and used it in a way to express something negative.

The fact that it is a sin is something different.  I cringe when I hear it sometimes because I know the person saying it doesn't realize what they are doing and that what they are doing is serious.  But that's not what offends me. 

LucyHoneychrrch

+adamwife+

hindsight's_a_biotch:

Forgive me if this point has already been made but I'm not reading 6 pages of crap to see if it was.

I'm black and I'm a Christian. It's offensive to equate using the Lord's name in vain because never once when someone has said the Lord's name in vain have I gotten the impression that they judge me, don't like me, or will hurt me just by virtue of having uttered those words.

To imply otherwise is more offensive than using the Lord's name in vain could ever be.

I'd rather spend the entire week listening to Goddamned this, Christ on a Cracker, and Jesus motherfuuking Christ than hear anyone utter the n word.

I can't believe this is even a topic of conversation.

FTR.  I never mentioned the n-word and if you look back, at some point I posted why I view it as different.

I am sorry.

Dylanite

pixy_stix:

Dylanite:

Pixy, your example shows you were offended on behalf of someone else.  And because my intent was not to hurt you, I refuse to refrain from using such terminology because I know that of my intent.  Asking someone to refrain from using certain terminology due to the possibility that it could hurt someone sets a precedent I choose to avoid.   I'm not saying this justifies the use of ANY offensive terms (the N-word for example... Because that word is ONLY meant to hurt).

You specifically and deliberately used the word to offend. There is no, "setting precedence." You logically know the word has been used to degrade a segment of society, and yet continue to use it out of a perverse need to shock. There is a growing cultural shift to eradicate the word, but people still defend it's use (huh, sounds like the n-word argument for it's continued use doesn't it?).

I am not only offended on behalf of someone else, I am personally offended by the use of the word. Unless you think it's fun to be told that "Your sister is retarded, so there must be something in the gene pool that makes you retarded too." Because I have a million of those comments as well, and the shame and humiliation that brings. But HEY, it's not about race, so I shouldn't get offended.

I'm aware, and okay with, you interpreting that as my intent. I can see why it can be confused as such.  But I only have to justify it with myself, and because I know what my intent is NOT, I will continue responding as I do. I hereby reject and deflect your interpretation, because it is not my concern to be cautious of other people's false perceptions.

doctorwho

BannedDumpsterBaby:

+adamwife+:

NuggetBrain:

Listen, if you don't understand that people oftentimes either are intentionally trying to be offensive, or just don't care, then I doubt you grasp the basic concept of humanity.  Seriously.  You seem to think that if they only understood, they'd just stop!  No.  That's not true.  I can completely understand, and just not give a single f*ck about it.

Right.  But I believe that true understanding means realizing that your not caring about the implications of your words and actions means you truly don't understand.

I realize that some people are going to be offensive and rude.  I'm not stupid.  I'm just saying that those offensive and rude people can say they understand all they want and I don't truly believe it.  I think that their rude and offensive nature blocks them from truly understanding.

Well, thanks for trying to patiently explain it to all of us unsaved retards.

Yeahno. They understand. I understand that violating the Islamic prohibition against images is offensive at it's core. Fundamentalists understand that applying the standard to Muslims amd non-muslims alike under penalty of death is offensive at its core. We all get it. However, I feel not just callous but justified in flouting that prohibition not because I want to offend, but because the demand of conformity or death is unacceptable. Theres no misunderstanding.

pixy_stix

Dylanite:

I'm aware, and okay with, you interpreting that as my intent. I can see why it can be confused as such.  But I only have to justify it with myself, and because I know what my intent is NOT, I will continue responding as I do. I hereby reject and deflect your interpretation, because it is not my concern to be cautious of other people's false perceptions.

Even if it colors their perceptions of you and any further interactions? Because really, I didn't realize I had held onto the frustration I felt from that thread for this long.

LittleMoxie

+adamwife+:

smock.smock:

AW, I have a somewhat related question. Correct me if I'm wrong, but you're saying that the main reason these words are offensive is because you see it as a sin against God. 

Do you have a similar reaction when you read on this board about other sins? Like someone posting about taking birth control? Or about having an affair? I'm assuming these aren't offensive in the same way, or it would be hard to read any post on the internet.

If saying JFC is the same as cheating on your spouse in God's eyes, why is reading about other sins less offensive to you?

I would say the offensiveness and the hurt that Dylanite was asking about have more to do with the fact that I love God so much.  No, I'm not saying this to appear more devout than anyone else.  You asked why it offends me, so I'm answering.  Jesus is my SAVIOR.  His sacrifice was unfathomable (and I think that this being Good Friday and the cost of His sacrifice looming around me today was the reason that I even thought to post this). 

You know how much you love your child?  Your parent?  Your spouse?  That's how much some of us love Jesus. 

Does it hurt you when someone says something hurtful about your child?  Your parent?  Your spouse?  That's how much it hurts some of us when we hear people taking the Lord's name in vain.

This is all a bit emo.  Also, saying something hurtful about someone is NOT the same as using the name in an offhanded expletive or unnecessarily with a bad word thrown in.

Your husband, John, is a stupid retard.  Or even just, "your husband, John, is an idiot" is more hurtful than "John damn it!" or "John *** Smith!"

No one is saying anything HURTFUL about Jesus.  They are just using it unnecessarily.  NOT THE SAME.  Also, in the case of Goddamnit, I use it when I slam the door on my finger or something I'm annoyed and sure, I'd like "God" to damn the door so it doesn't do that again.  See?  Not using his name in vain there.  (I'm being TIC, but I do think that Goddamnit is actually a curse that is in fact, talking to God, so I really don't get the upset there).

 

Dylanite

pixy_stix:

Dylanite:

I'm aware, and okay with, you interpreting that as my intent. I can see why it can be confused as such.  But I only have to justify it with myself, and because I know what my intent is NOT, I will continue responding as I do. I hereby reject and deflect your interpretation, because it is not my concern to be cautious of other people's false perceptions.

Even if it colors their perceptions of you and any further interactions? Because really, I didn't realize I had held onto the frustration I felt from that thread for this long.

I promise I'm not trying to be nasty with you here. But it is my position that the people being offended by such things must deal with it themselves, in their own way.  I'm fully aware that I have a certain negative reputation to some people here as a result. I think the most offensive (heh) thing I could do in response is not be my (innocent, in my eyes) self. Ironic that I feel, and embrace, my semi-anonymity here due to it allowing me to be completely honest.

But there it is.

NaturalBlond

mxolisi:

NuggetBrain:

mxolisi:

NuggetBrain:

mxolisi:

People post things that offend me all the time. Should I share a laundry list so everyone can avoid them? Or does my offense not matter because it isn't rooted in religious belief? I'm not being sarcastic here. I am legitimately offended by some pretty common nestisms and internetisms. 

Like what?

This is probably not the best example, but I'm in a hurry! I think the common usage of the phrase "first world problems" or FWP is pretty offensive and ignorant. But I also get that most people don't see if that way. So while I would never use it--and while I do believe it is offensive--I don't care if other people do because I understand that not everyone has the same mindset as I do and also that the intent isn't to offend. It's just a phrase.

Really??  Because now I'm nosy and want to know why you find that offensive.  I'm assuming because it's somehow invalidating the problems?  Like "well there are starving children in Africa"?

Actually it's kind of the opposite. Since most FWP are petty mundane gripes it creates this perception that the reason THESE are FWP is that so called "third world people" are so consumed with life and death matters that they are fundamentally different and don't have mundane complaints. But the reality is that 99% of FWP I read are nearly identical to complaints that my "third world" friends have too.  Just because you live in Nigeria doesn't mean you never have days when your pants are too tight or when you're hungover or when someone is texting you about a party you can't attend or your new DVD is scratched etc.  Also most people who live in the "third world" don't really like that phrase but you can't have first world problems without a third world.  

OMG. I totally agree with this. There is something about the FWP threads that dont sit right with me and you just articulated it!

Back to reading... 

msmerymac

BeebeeEater:

+adamwife+:

cvillebetrothed:

it seems to me, almost, that you're asking for other people to observe your religious practice, to a certain extent.  that's just not something i see as a prerequisite to respect for another's religious views.   i appreciate your articulate and calm expression of your views, i don't really use "jesus" in the way you find offensive all that often (i can't recall a time recently), and intend no offense (usually) here or irl in most of what i do (though i know i fail daily).  but i think you and i, at least, are going to be at an impasse on this point.

I'm sorry if I came across this way.  My intention isn't for you to observe my religious beliefs, but to respect them.

It's the same to me as maybe refraining from eating or cooking pork in front of a Jew or Muslim.  You aren't not eating the pork because you are observing their religious practices.  You're doing it because you respect them as a person enough not to do something offensive to them.

This is silly. For the vast majority, the offense is in asking THEM to eat the pork, not in cooking or eating it in front of them. Just like for the vast majority of vegetarians, it's not offensive if YOU eat meat, just don't ask them to do it.

Cooking or eating meat? No. But, for example, I was at a vegan beer and food event once and the food was provided by food trucks. Most of the food trucks NORMALLY provide meat options, but for the purposes of the event were serving vegan food (they were all trucks which normally serve at least some vegan options). One guy in line in front of me tried to order something with pork. The truck couldn't do it, because they had stocked their fridge/freezer/pantry with vegan items that day. But also - really? I find eating pork at an event that is explicitly vegan to be disrespectful. And I'm not even a vegan. But my husband and I both enjoy those events, the purpose they serve, and the delicious vegan options. You can eat pork at a non-vegan, which is pretty much any other event.

That's really off-topic, but I guess I told the story to illustrate that there is some kind of subtle difference and it matters. I drink like a fish, but I have a friend who doesn't drink for religious reasons. Out of respect to her, I drink water, tea or soda when we have dinner together.

I actually agree with AW. I don't find the use of JC to be irreverent or offensive. I think the reason people on this board don't lob around "retard" or "gay" as casual insults (either here or IRL, I assume) is because we are aware of the impact they have on those around us. If I hear those words (which I do, almost daily), *I* find them offensive, and I am neither gay nor retarded. But I know the implicit meaning of their use as an insult. I don't think people on this board censor themselves over the use of JC because no one really thinks anyone cares. The vast majority of people aren't offended by it, and therefore, you can use it without assume you're offending many people around you. However, some people have pointed out that they don't use those words around friends or family they know will take offense. And now we know that AW takes offense.

No, this doesn't mean anyone HAS to change, but I, for one, will be more careful of my wording from now on, because why would I want to intentionally offend someone I think is a nice person? That's just common courtesy.

So thank you, AW, for bringing this to my attention.

SMorriso

LittleMoxie:

SMorriso:

DruidPrincess:

Sh!t.  I just read through the entire thread, and not once was my fairly cogent post quoted.  You are all dead to me.

That's how I felt. haha. I did read yours and agreed, again.

Smo - I meant to respond to yours.  I can't recall it exactly now, but I wanted to say that when I say JFC or whatever, I harbor no ill-will towards Christians.  I think that's become common because Christians are the majority and if you want to say something arousing you're going to choose the one that resonates with most people around you.

In Turkey there is an exclamation "Allah Allah!" said in a certain way (more like Allah-HA-llaaaah) that is our equivalent of OMG.

I'm not picking on any one belief system - I think they are all equally ludicrous, but I use the ones focused on Christianity because that's just the more common expletive around these parts (the US).

Thanks.

Yeah, I get the JFC statement, and that isn't really what bugs me. Just moreso the one-sided condescension about how "Fairy tales, and mythical creatures, etc" You saying you find them ludicrous doesn't bug me at all. I can understand how they might come off that way. However to sort of openly mock it as a childish/idiotic belief system just because you don't believe, particularly Christianity when there are probably more open minded believers on this board, is a smidge hypocritical to me.

I get that people will disagree, sure. Mock someone for their beliefs, that doesn't sit well. That is across the board for me. I had to check myself when it came to some of the Mormon threads. A lot of atheists/agnostics chimed in about how both belief systems are similarly outlandish. I checked my judgment of them quick.  They were right, and I shouldn't judge. I would honestly just like the same when it comes to the condescending low blows.

+adamwife+

LittleMoxie:

+adamwife+:

smock.smock:

AW, I have a somewhat related question. Correct me if I'm wrong, but you're saying that the main reason these words are offensive is because you see it as a sin against God. 

Do you have a similar reaction when you read on this board about other sins? Like someone posting about taking birth control? Or about having an affair? I'm assuming these aren't offensive in the same way, or it would be hard to read any post on the internet.

If saying JFC is the same as cheating on your spouse in God's eyes, why is reading about other sins less offensive to you?

I would say the offensiveness and the hurt that Dylanite was asking about have more to do with the fact that I love God so much.  No, I'm not saying this to appear more devout than anyone else.  You asked why it offends me, so I'm answering.  Jesus is my SAVIOR.  His sacrifice was unfathomable (and I think that this being Good Friday and the cost of His sacrifice looming around me today was the reason that I even thought to post this). 

You know how much you love your child?  Your parent?  Your spouse?  That's how much some of us love Jesus. 

Does it hurt you when someone says something hurtful about your child?  Your parent?  Your spouse?  That's how much it hurts some of us when we hear people taking the Lord's name in vain.

This is all a bit emo.  Also, saying something hurtful about someone is NOT the same as using the name in an offhanded expletive or unnecessarily with a bad word thrown in.

Your husband, John, is a stupid retard.  Or even just, "your husband, John, is an idiot" is more hurtful than "John damn it!" or "John *** Smith!"

No one is saying anything HURTFUL about Jesus.  They are just using it unnecessarily.  NOT THE SAME.  Also, in the case of Goddamnit, I use it when I slam the door on my finger or something I'm annoyed and sure, I'd like "God" to damn the door so it doesn't do that again.  See?  Not using his name in vain there.  (I'm being TIC, but I do think that Goddamnit is actually a curse that is in fact, talking to God, so I really don't get the upset there).

 

Maybe it's emo.  It is what it is.  I love Jesus.

And this is where I think faith plays a role in really understanding.  It IS hurtful to to me for you to say it.  When you view someone's name as HOLY, this is an offensive thing. 

It's why Muslims get offended when you destroy a Koran.  It's holy to them.  It's offensive.

 

doctorwho

Also, congratulations on spawning what might be the most blasphemous thread we've ever had. I'm having irony for lunch - it's delicious! And merry fraking egg day. ;P ( I tease because I love)

+adamwife+

msmerymac:

BeebeeEater:

+adamwife+:

cvillebetrothed:

it seems to me, almost, that you're asking for other people to observe your religious practice, to a certain extent.  that's just not something i see as a prerequisite to respect for another's religious views.   i appreciate your articulate and calm expression of your views, i don't really use "jesus" in the way you find offensive all that often (i can't recall a time recently), and intend no offense (usually) here or irl in most of what i do (though i know i fail daily).  but i think you and i, at least, are going to be at an impasse on this point.

I'm sorry if I came across this way.  My intention isn't for you to observe my religious beliefs, but to respect them.

It's the same to me as maybe refraining from eating or cooking pork in front of a Jew or Muslim.  You aren't not eating the pork because you are observing their religious practices.  You're doing it because you respect them as a person enough not to do something offensive to them.

This is silly. For the vast majority, the offense is in asking THEM to eat the pork, not in cooking or eating it in front of them. Just like for the vast majority of vegetarians, it's not offensive if YOU eat meat, just don't ask them to do it.

Cooking or eating meat? No. But, for example, I was at a vegan beer and food event once and the food was provided by food trucks. Most of the food trucks NORMALLY provide meat options, but for the purposes of the event were serving vegan food (they were all trucks which normally serve at least some vegan options). One guy in line in front of me tried to order something with pork. The truck couldn't do it, because they had stocked their fridge/freezer/pantry with vegan items that day. But also - really? I find eating pork at an event that is explicitly vegan to be disrespectful. And I'm not even a vegan. But my husband and I both enjoy those events, the purpose they serve, and the delicious vegan options. You can eat pork at a non-vegan, which is pretty much any other event.

That's really off-topic, but I guess I told the story to illustrate that there is some kind of subtle difference and it matters. I drink like a fish, but I have a friend who doesn't drink for religious reasons. Out of respect to her, I drink water, tea or soda when we have dinner together.

I actually agree with AW. I don't find the use of JC to be irreverent or offensive. I think the reason people on this board don't lob around "retard" or "gay" as casual insults (either here or IRL, I assume) is because we are aware of the impact they have on those around us. If I hear those words (which I do, almost daily), *I* find them offensive, and I am neither gay nor retarded. But I know the implicit meaning of their use as an insult. I don't think people on this board censor themselves over the use of JC because no one really thinks anyone cares. The vast majority of people aren't offended by it, and therefore, you can use it without assume you're offending many people around you. However, some people have pointed out that they don't use those words around friends or family they know will take offense. And now we know that AW takes offense.

No, this doesn't mean anyone HAS to change, but I, for one, will be more careful of my wording from now on, because why would I want to intentionally offend someone I think is a nice person? That's just common courtesy.

So thank you, AW, for bringing this to my attention.

Thank you for understanding

NuggetBrain

I really, really wish people would stop equating the word "gay" and "retarded" with the n word.  Because really, they're not on the same level.  People were using the word "gay" to describe things as being happy for years before it was used as a slut.  Retarded literally just means "stunted" in some way. 

There is no other meaning for the N word but a racial slur.  Please, seriously people.  Stop saying they're on the same level.  Because they're not.

msmerymac

NuggetBrain:

+adamwife+:

broccolitree:

Speaking of the meaning of words, ironically I always took the other definition of vain. So this handswringing over how much it hurts you because you're so much more devvout than everyone else is, tome, taking te lord's name in vain. It goes hand in hand with the verses about praying quietly in the closet ratherthan loudly on the street corner. I have no idea what the actual words and their connotations are in the original text, though.

This is interesting.  I can see how you would interpret it that way.  So do you feel that anyone that is vocal about their faith is doing that?  Should we all be silent about our faith and the way we live it out?  I'm not being snarky or argumentative, I'm just honestly curious about your interpretation.

Just wanted to say that my intent in posting isn't to appear any more devout than anyone else.  As I've said many times in this thread, I am not without sin.  This is certainly something that I choose not to do (using the Lord's name in vain), but it doesn't mean I am any better than anyone else.  I'm not implying that and I'm sorry if that's how it comes across.

It's just hard to believe that when you mentioned that "you must have to be a Christian to understand why it's offensive".  I don't have to be black to understand why using the n-word is offensive.  Honestly, it puts me in the mind of those petulant teenagers we all were once who were all "MOM.  You just don't understand.  YOU WOULDN'T UNDERSTAND ANYWAYS BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT ME.  GAWL." *hurr-flips and stormage to rooms commence here*

I have the opposite interpretation. A LOT of the anti-AW responses in this thread come across to me as "But I don't WANNA change anything about myself! EVER EVER EVER! ME ME ME!"

And no one is saying you have to. But when I engage with AW, knowing she'll be offended if I say JC, I'll try to refrain. And if I forget because I'm in the habit of taking the Lord's name in vain, well, I won't beat myself up over it. I'll go on with my day. But I will try. And I don't think it will 1) be that hard or 2) severely impact my life in a negative way. Feel free to disagree. I just think the RIGHT to use JC as an insult or epithet is a really stupid thing to get worked up over and I never predicted this thread would go in that direction, though maybe I should have.

NuggetBrain

+adamwife+:

LittleMoxie:

+adamwife+:

smock.smock:

AW, I have a somewhat related question. Correct me if I'm wrong, but you're saying that the main reason these words are offensive is because you see it as a sin against God. 

Do you have a similar reaction when you read on this board about other sins? Like someone posting about taking birth control? Or about having an affair? I'm assuming these aren't offensive in the same way, or it would be hard to read any post on the internet.

If saying JFC is the same as cheating on your spouse in God's eyes, why is reading about other sins less offensive to you?

I would say the offensiveness and the hurt that Dylanite was asking about have more to do with the fact that I love God so much.  No, I'm not saying this to appear more devout than anyone else.  You asked why it offends me, so I'm answering.  Jesus is my SAVIOR.  His sacrifice was unfathomable (and I think that this being Good Friday and the cost of His sacrifice looming around me today was the reason that I even thought to post this). 

You know how much you love your child?  Your parent?  Your spouse?  That's how much some of us love Jesus. 

Does it hurt you when someone says something hurtful about your child?  Your parent?  Your spouse?  That's how much it hurts some of us when we hear people taking the Lord's name in vain.

This is all a bit emo.  Also, saying something hurtful about someone is NOT the same as using the name in an offhanded expletive or unnecessarily with a bad word thrown in.

Your husband, John, is a stupid retard.  Or even just, "your husband, John, is an idiot" is more hurtful than "John damn it!" or "John *** Smith!"

No one is saying anything HURTFUL about Jesus.  They are just using it unnecessarily.  NOT THE SAME.  Also, in the case of Goddamnit, I use it when I slam the door on my finger or something I'm annoyed and sure, I'd like "God" to damn the door so it doesn't do that again.  See?  Not using his name in vain there.  (I'm being TIC, but I do think that Goddamnit is actually a curse that is in fact, talking to God, so I really don't get the upset there).

 

Maybe it's emo.  It is what it is.  I love Jesus.

And this is where I think faith plays a role in really understanding.  It IS hurtful to to me for you to say it.  When you view someone's name as HOLY, this is an offensive thing. 

It's why Muslims get offended when you destroy a Koran.  It's holy to them.  It's offensive.

 

Why do you keep talking to us like we're stupid and don't understand this.  People understand.  They just don't give a sh*t.  I don't know how to make this any more clearer to you.  I think you're continuing to insist that they just don't understand, a la parents and Fresh Prince, because it makes you feel better than the alternative.  It makes you feel like you're still justified in your offense because, well, if people really understood then they'd be offended too.

NuggetBrain

msmerymac:

NuggetBrain:

+adamwife+:

broccolitree:

Speaking of the meaning of words, ironically I always took the other definition of vain. So this handswringing over how much it hurts you because you're so much more devvout than everyone else is, tome, taking te lord's name in vain. It goes hand in hand with the verses about praying quietly in the closet ratherthan loudly on the street corner. I have no idea what the actual words and their connotations are in the original text, though.

This is interesting.  I can see how you would interpret it that way.  So do you feel that anyone that is vocal about their faith is doing that?  Should we all be silent about our faith and the way we live it out?  I'm not being snarky or argumentative, I'm just honestly curious about your interpretation.

Just wanted to say that my intent in posting isn't to appear any more devout than anyone else.  As I've said many times in this thread, I am not without sin.  This is certainly something that I choose not to do (using the Lord's name in vain), but it doesn't mean I am any better than anyone else.  I'm not implying that and I'm sorry if that's how it comes across.

It's just hard to believe that when you mentioned that "you must have to be a Christian to understand why it's offensive".  I don't have to be black to understand why using the n-word is offensive.  Honestly, it puts me in the mind of those petulant teenagers we all were once who were all "MOM.  You just don't understand.  YOU WOULDN'T UNDERSTAND ANYWAYS BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT ME.  GAWL." *hurr-flips and stormage to rooms commence here*

I have the opposite interpretation. A LOT of the anti-AW responses in this thread come across to me as "But I don't WANNA change anything about myself! EVER EVER EVER! ME ME ME!"

And no one is saying you have to. But when I engage with AW, knowing she'll be offended if I say JC, I'll try to refrain. And if I forget because I'm in the habit of taking the Lord's name in vain, well, I won't beat myself up over it. I'll go on with my day. But I will try. And I don't think it will 1) be that hard or 2) severely impact my life in a negative way. Feel free to disagree. I just think the RIGHT to use JC as an insult or epithet is a really stupid thing to get worked up over and I never predicted this thread would go in that direction, though maybe I should have.

Why am I not surprised. 

msmerymac

Also, in response to the responses that basically say, "Wow, people will be offended by ANYTHING these days!" being offended by someone taking the Lord's name in vain is nothing new. It's not a PC thing. In the 19th century, if you had said "Jesus Christ!" to someone (particularly an authority figure like a teacher), it would have been pretty serious. Like the equivalent of cursing out a teacher or parent today. As our society has become less heavily Christian (debatable, I know, but let's just say our culture is much more secular now), this offense has really lessened. And might be seen as "quaint," like the belief that women should wear skirts or some such thing. But it has a pretty long history, and it's not just AW or evangelicals who invented it or anything. Personally, as a child I used to say "Gosh" instead of "God," and in restrospect, I guess it's because I knew using "God" as an epithet was more serious.

LucyHoneychrrch

msmerymac:

NuggetBrain:

+adamwife+:

broccolitree:

Speaking of the meaning of words, ironically I always took the other definition of vain. So this handswringing over how much it hurts you because you're so much more devvout than everyone else is, tome, taking te lord's name in vain. It goes hand in hand with the verses about praying quietly in the closet ratherthan loudly on the street corner. I have no idea what the actual words and their connotations are in the original text, though.

This is interesting.  I can see how you would interpret it that way.  So do you feel that anyone that is vocal about their faith is doing that?  Should we all be silent about our faith and the way we live it out?  I'm not being snarky or argumentative, I'm just honestly curious about your interpretation.

Just wanted to say that my intent in posting isn't to appear any more devout than anyone else.  As I've said many times in this thread, I am not without sin.  This is certainly something that I choose not to do (using the Lord's name in vain), but it doesn't mean I am any better than anyone else.  I'm not implying that and I'm sorry if that's how it comes across.

It's just hard to believe that when you mentioned that "you must have to be a Christian to understand why it's offensive".  I don't have to be black to understand why using the n-word is offensive.  Honestly, it puts me in the mind of those petulant teenagers we all were once who were all "MOM.  You just don't understand.  YOU WOULDN'T UNDERSTAND ANYWAYS BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT ME.  GAWL." *hurr-flips and stormage to rooms commence here*

I have the opposite interpretation. A LOT of the anti-AW responses in this thread come across to me as "But I don't WANNA change anything about myself! EVER EVER EVER! ME ME ME!"

And no one is saying you have to. But when I engage with AW, knowing she'll be offended if I say JC, I'll try to refrain. And if I forget because I'm in the habit of taking the Lord's name in vain, well, I won't beat myself up over it. I'll go on with my day. But I will try. And I don't think it will 1) be that hard or 2) severely impact my life in a negative way. Feel free to disagree. I just think the RIGHT to use JC as an insult or epithet is a really stupid thing to get worked up over and I never predicted this thread would go in that direction, though maybe I should have.

Eh.  I see someone requesting (or implying) that we should all stop using the Lord's name on the boards because they find it offensive as very ME ME ME ME ME.  And the statement that anyone who doesn't agree clearly just doesn't understand is incredibly selfish.

 

SunMoon&Stars

NuggetBrain:

+adamwife+:

Maybe it's emo.  It is what it is.  I love Jesus.

And this is where I think faith plays a role in really understanding.  It IS hurtful to to me for you to say it.  When you view someone's name as HOLY, this is an offensive thing. 

It's why Muslims get offended when you destroy a Koran.  It's holy to them.  It's offensive.

 

Why do you keep talking to us like we're stupid and don't understand this.  People understand.  They just don't give a sh*t.  I don't know how to make this any more clearer to you.  I think you're continuing to insist that they just don't understand, a la parents and Fresh Prince, because it makes you feel better than the alternative.  It makes you feel like you're still justified in your offense because, well, if people really understood then they'd be offended too.

Exactly. AW, I think the core issue here is that you think your beliefs  are more valid than everyone else's. 

curmudgeon

Apparently I am not a speed reader because I cannot keep up with this thread. AW, I had never considered that hearing/reading these words would be offensive, thank you for bringing it up, however I likely will not curb my usage.  Just for another perspective, I grew up immersed in christian religion and my parents were very strict about the language my brothers and I used.  When I had my "crisis of faith" part of the process I went through was extreme anger at what I perceive to be lies having been told to me my entire life.  It was around this time I began using god in vain.  I know this is very unpopular, but it was a deliberate decision to demonstrate the anger I felt about my religious upbringing.  Now I use it out of habit, but sometimes it just gets the point across most accurately.

+adamwife+

SunMoon&Stars:

NuggetBrain:

+adamwife+:

Maybe it's emo.  It is what it is.  I love Jesus.

And this is where I think faith plays a role in really understanding.  It IS hurtful to to me for you to say it.  When you view someone's name as HOLY, this is an offensive thing. 

It's why Muslims get offended when you destroy a Koran.  It's holy to them.  It's offensive.

 

Why do you keep talking to us like we're stupid and don't understand this.  People understand.  They just don't give a sh*t.  I don't know how to make this any more clearer to you.  I think you're continuing to insist that they just don't understand, a la parents and Fresh Prince, because it makes you feel better than the alternative.  It makes you feel like you're still justified in your offense because, well, if people really understood then they'd be offended too.

Exactly. AW, I think the core issue here is that you think your beliefs  are more valid than everyone else's. 

I figured it was about time for you to chime in with something like this.

Thanks for the contribution to the thread.  It was helpful.